Using fantasy grounds an estimate?

[Marc B]

Could anybody give me at least a rough estimate in hours it would take an experienced user to enter my campaign into Fantasy ground with the current cumbersome interface?

Lets say I am only entering 6 player characters, add 2 custom races and 2 custom classes, my current adventure with encounters(lets say 10 encounters), and 5 NPC's.

[Valarian]

About an hour. The custom races just enter in as stories. You can tackle XML library modules later.
If you have to prepare them from scratch, rather than copying from source, then it'll take as long as it usually takes you to generate a character.

And the "cumbersome interface" is pretty intuitive once you start using it and RTFM.

[JohnD]

About an hour. The custom races just enter in as stories. You can tackle XML library modules later.
If you have to prepare them from scratch, rather than copying from source, then it'll take as long as it usually takes you to generate a character.

And the "cumbersome interface" is pretty intuitive once you start using it and RTFM.

RTFM is good advice. I would say Valarian has it pretty right for the most part. I would enter one character on your own to get the hang of it and then have all your players connect in groups of one or two to be walked through entering their own character data... after all they will have a learning curve to get through as well.

This learning curve will be less odious for all concerned if you flush you current attitude down the crapper and adopt a more positive one YMMV and all that. There are walkthroughs and offers of demo sessions on the table... much more useful than just complaining. Take someone up on their offer of spending their own free hobby time helping you get up to speed is my suggestion.

[dulux-oz]

I concure with JohnD & Valarian.

Look, you've got three choices:

1. Continue to bitch about somethng that is not going to change, therefore alienating any potential friends, helpers and mentors on this site.
2. Write your own VTT Software.
3. Change your attitude, take up an offer for a 1-on-1 Tutorial Session, RTFM, watch a few of the excellent Tutorial Videos avaliable, and basically just deal with it.

I agree with you, on first look the Interface was "unusual", but after only an hour or two of playing around with it it all "fell into place" and now it just "flys" - in other words, I had to get through the learning curve.

And in all honesty, in over 25 years in the ICT game I've seen some pretty crappy interfaces, even from some main stream companies - FG2 isn't even in the worst 80% for "bad" interfaces.

We all want people to enjoy our hobby, and I'm sure the SmiteWorks guys (& girls?) want people using their excellent software - that's one reason there is so much (free) help around - so please, give things a go - I hope you will.

Cheers

Not a Paid Advertisement of SmiteWorks LLC

[Trenloe]

Yeah, complaining constantly is going to quickly lose you any assistance people might be willing to give you.

It really is worth spending the time to get to know Fantasy Grounds and the Rolemaster ruleset. Once you spend that time (which isn't long when you apply yourself to it) you will be able to save that time and more when you actually run a game. All of the tables are there for you within Fantasy Grounds and resolving attacks, criticals, spells, fumbles, maneuvers, etc. are all done very easily without the need to be efficient with your maths calculations. The results of fumbles/criticals are recorded against the characters with this, and other additional book keeping being covered for you as well.

Fantasy Grounds is a fantastic VTT but we all know it has a steep learning curve - hence why a lot of us are willing to help. One of the massive advantages of Fantasy Grounds is the community - work with us and your experience of Fantasy Grounds will be much richer...

[AstaSyneri]

What an unusual thread for this usually so friendly forum.

Shouldn't we all take a step back and draw a deep breath?

The only thing mildly offensive Marc B said is highlighted below (we can argue about tone).

Could anybody give me at least a rough estimate in hours it would take an experienced user to enter my campaign into Fantasy ground with the current cumbersome interface?

In his defense (not knowing him): It really can be a bit difficult for a GM just starting out with FG to find the way around, leading to some frustration. And I can relate - I sometimes (apparently) use words that grate people on the internet, without intending to do so.

Why not give Marc the benefit of the doubt, instead of bashing him just yet? He might become a valuable member of the community .

Oh - and since you unfortunately didn't link it:

And the "cumbersome interface" is pretty intuitive once you start using it and RTFM.

What GM manual are you referring to? I love manuals and have a bit of a problem finding my way around the "hardcore" stuff myself (the basic D&D User manuals for players and GMs are okay, but after that it gets tougher).

[dulux-oz]

You're right Astra, this has turned into an unusually "unfriendly" thread - for my part I apologise (to Marc B, yourself, and others who are reading this).

Having said that, what you may not be aware of is that there have been several other posts that Marc B has made where he both complains about the Interface and asks for help/guidance, and where others have offered help and support - I think people like JohnD, Trenloe and others (although I can not speak definitively for them) have gotten just a little bit "fed-up" with the situation - I know I did, and I haven't offered any direct help (apart from directing Marc B to the Tutiorial Videos, both mine and others').

Personally (and only speaking personally) one of my pet "peeves" in my Professional Life, my Political Life and my Hobby/Private life is people who whinge about something but who aren't willing or can't offer a practical solution. As someone who has worked as a Software Developer and as a ICT Program/Project Manager its amazing to me how often people want to criticise and complain but not do anything to fix or to contribute to an issue, or to the number of times people expect things to be "handed to them on a platter". My personal philiosophy is "Put up or Shut up" (along with "Personal Responsibility, Personal Freedom"). As such, I may have reacted a little too strongly (as I have been known to do from time to time).

Having said all that, I encourage everyone to share this great hobby, which is why I was so glad when I found FG2 and even happier when I found the level of friendship, support and camaraderie that exists in the Forums here. So happy, in fact, that I was willing to persevere and go through the learning curve - for me it was worth the pain of learning a new interface because what I got out of it was way, way more than I had to put into it - but I DID have to "put into it".

I only encourage others to do the same.

Cheers

[Valarian]

The only thing mildly offensive Marc B said is highlighted below (we can argue about tone).

7 posts. Whining about the product not meeting his standards in 6 of them. Seemingly because it doesn't look like a Microsoft product which I, for one, am extremely glad about.

What GM manual are you referring to?

The guides in the library here tell you what you need to know about Fantasy Grounds.

For more generic GM guidance, I can recommend:
- Odyssey and Never Unprepared by Engine Publishing
- Robin's Laws of Good Gamemastering by Robin Laws
- Hamlet's Hit Points by Robin Laws
- Gamemastering by Dominic Walsh
- Write Great Fiction - Description & Setting by Ron Rozelle
- Write Great Fiction - Characters, Emotion & Viewpoint by Nancy Kress

[AstaSyneri]

7 posts. Whining about the product not meeting his standards in 6 of them. Seemingly because it doesn't look like a Microsoft product which I, for one, am extremely glad about.

Ah well, I didn't look up all the other posts he wrote ;-). That of course explains it a bit.

The guides in the library here tell you what you need to know about Fantasy Grounds.

On how to run FG as a player and as a GM I agree (I have no real problem with the interface for gaming. It's not perfect, but that's to be expected from a program with such a small audience).

On how to enter your own adventures, or even build modules, extensions or rulesets, I disagree. Of course there is no other VTT that does it better or offers a better foundation to do it, but starting out on such an endeavor does feel (to me) like you need a PHD in Computer Sciences at times. ;-)

But that's okay, I am willing to learn and I am sure it will get better and better. I very much enjoy the willingness to help on this forum!

[Trenloe]

On how to ... or even build ... extensions or rulesets, I disagree.

You have started at the Ruleset modification guide, right? https://www.fantasygrounds.com/modguide/