Better Combat Effects

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Originally Posted by eriktedesco

Hi all!

Would it be possible to open somewhere a thread dedicated to the spell/feats/item etc coding with BCE operators?

I truly suck with this thing so thiw would be a huge help! (pretty much what was done with kent-extension-outsorce in Team Thowy channel on Discord)

What do yu think about it?

Thanks again

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It is a pretty big job for a single person to go though everything but if people want to share what works for them I made a google sheet.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

I may have missed it, but there is no effect on "critical damage" or is there? PF2 can have effects being applied when a weapon crits, so I was hoping for some automated solution.

Version update 2.8
Fixed 4E compatibility with bmos Ammunition Manager

If you aren't 4E then nothing has changed

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Originally Posted by Weissrolf

I may have missed it, but there is no effect on "critical damage" or is there? PF2 can have effects being applied when a weapon crits, so I was hoping for some automated solution.

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There is no hook in BCE to do something when a critical occurs. Does Kelrugem's stuff offer this?

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Originally Posted by rhagelstrom

Version update 2.8
Fixed 4E compatibility with bmos Ammunition Manager

If you aren't 4E then nothing has changed

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Thanks! No errors in 4e now.

Awesome mod here, thank you for the hard work! I do have a question after the obligatory butter up compliment though ;P... Is there any way to get TDMGADDS to work with melee only attacks? I'm trying to get an effect sorted out for Shadow of Moil's on hit damage shield and it works great, except it reflects the damage back to anything that hits the target. Tried a few options with IF/IFT so not sure if I'm just missing the correct syntax there or heck maybe TDMGADDS isn't the best way to do this at all... thoughts anyone? I know there is no way to get it to apply to all attacks that come from 10 feet away, so I'm just trying to get it to cover the bulk of them which would be all the melee hits.

Hey im on FG Unity, got your extension from the forge. I'm playing the PF 1e, there with it loaded alone, the long rest does nothing to the PCs. Am i missing some option or something? Couldnt find a solution.

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Originally Posted by denmakash

Hey im on FG Unity, got your extension from the forge. I'm playing the PF 1e, there with it loaded alone, the long rest does nothing to the PCs. Am i missing some option or something? Couldnt find a solution.

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There appears to be a typo on line 70 of manager_effect_bce35e.lua
charRest(nodePC) should be charRest(nodeChar)

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Originally Posted by rhagelstrom

Since Temp HP is considered a buffer from damage, when that setting is set to off, the damage logic of this extension won't be executed for temp HP reduction but only HP reduction. If you wish for the logic to always be executed, then set that the option to on.

Thanks for the bug report. I'll take a look at it and post an update.

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First I would like to applaud you for taking the time to add the settings for this in the settings menu... so many other things should have been there from the initial release and many extension writers should take note on this.

However, temporary hit points are an extension of you by RAW and if you take damage to them you are still taking damage as noted in the rules and clarified in Sage Advice Compendium

https://media.wizards.com/2020/dnd/d...Compendium.pdf

If I have 10 temporary hit points and I take 30 damage
from an attack while concentrating on a spell, what is
the DC of the Constitution save to maintain my concentration?
The DC is 15 in that case. When temporary hit
points absorb damage for you, you’re still taking damage,
just not to your real hit points.
In contrast, a feature like the wizard’s Arcane Ward can
take damage for you, potentially eliminating the need to
make a Constitution saving throw or, at least, lowering the
DC of that save

So if I want that to be the case I should have this option set as "ON" I take it to function as RAW intends? I would suggest changing the default on that option to conform to that because I had no idea that this was not calculating correctly until I stumbled in here looking for a way to turn off auto addition of hp on level up... another example of something that should have been in the options setting on release to conform to RAW.

I would also suggest changing the default for "Restrict Concentration" to "ON" as well.

It is always a good idea to default options to the RAW rather than what you do at your tables, it is just good practice from a development stance... I would have lost a bit of time had I noticed this weird behavior during a combat as I tracked down the issue to fix it.

Unless I completely missed something in this thread on those functions.

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Originally Posted by Slagmoth

First I would like to applaud you for taking the time to add the settings for this in the settings menu... so many other things should have been there from the initial release and many extension writers should take note on this.

However, temporary hit points are an extension of you by RAW and if you take damage to them you are still taking damage as noted in the rules and clarified in Sage Advice Compendium

https://media.wizards.com/2020/dnd/d...Compendium.pdf

If I have 10 temporary hit points and I take 30 damage
from an attack while concentrating on a spell, what is
the DC of the Constitution save to maintain my concentration?
The DC is 15 in that case. When temporary hit
points absorb damage for you, you’re still taking damage,
just not to your real hit points.
In contrast, a feature like the wizard’s Arcane Ward can
take damage for you, potentially eliminating the need to
make a Constitution saving throw or, at least, lowering the
DC of that save

So if I want that to be the case I should have this option set as "ON" I take it to function as RAW intends? I would suggest changing the default on that option to conform to that because I had no idea that this was not calculating correctly until I stumbled in here looking for a way to turn off auto addition of hp on level up... another example of something that should have been in the options setting on release to conform to RAW.

I would also suggest changing the default for "Restrict Concentration" to "ON" as well.

It is always a good idea to default options to the RAW rather than what you do at your tables, it is just good practice from a development stance... I would have lost a bit of time had I noticed this weird behavior during a combat as I tracked down the issue to fix it.

Unless I completely missed something in this thread on those functions.

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I agree with you that (assuming they are working correctly) RAW should be the default.

However, your HP issue is RAW. You choose to use the first option, but both options are RAW and neither is a "variant" option.
Also regards to your HP issue, check out Constitutional Amendments EXT. It can do what you are asking for its also an option in the options menu. With this EXT loaded it will give the option "PC: HP on level up" Average or Roll as your options.

Actually, the HP issue is one of those rare or unique instances where the Player decides what they will do... the rules state they can EITHER roll or take the average rounded up at each level... so forcing it only one way is sort of meh.

Unfortunately, for the Constitutional Amendments it conflicts with another extension that has more stuff I have come to rely on.

And for the temp hp issue I think it is simply a case of either misunderstanding the rules (<sarcasm>which never happens in 5E because it is so well and clearly written</sarcasm>) or a case of convenience for his tables since it was likely developed for him/her first then made public, but thought I would bring it up.

What EXT you finding conflict with. I use about 100 EXTs, no conflicts.

[removed duplicate]

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Originally Posted by MrDDT

What EXT you finding conflict with. I use about 100 EXTs, no conflicts.

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Unless MadNomad or MeAndUnique fixed their end there used to be a conflict between 2 of theirs. I believe it was the Character Sheet Tweaks conflicting with Constitutional Amendments. Apparently, there is a Third extension that fixes this but I try to keep the extensions to a minimum... by scried Raven I think.

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Originally Posted by Slagmoth

Unless MadNomad or MeAndUnique fixed their end there used to be a conflict between 2 of theirs. I believe it was the Character Sheet Tweaks conflicting with Constitutional Amendments. Apparently, there is a Third extension that fixes this but I try to keep the extensions to a minimum... by scried Raven I think.

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I use all 3 of those EXTs and I have no issues. If you need help on it let me know in a PM. I'm happy to go over it.

Apologies if this has been brought up elsewhere, but I have an effect coded like so:

> Incapacitated; SAVEE: WIS [SDC]; DMGOE: 1d12 psychic; (C)

This is from the Id Insinuation spell in 5e if anyone's interested. The expected behavior is that at the end of the target's turn, they take 1d12 psychic damage and make a wisdom saving throw vs the caster's spell DC. That happens flawlessly. However, for some reason after those rolls resolve, the target takes another 1d12 psychic damage for no discernible reason. Is this a bug or did I goof somehow?

Edited to add that the additional 1d12 damage is not rolled if I remove the SAVEE section from the effect, only when both are present. It doesn't matter whether the SAVEE or DMGOE clause is first as far as I can tell.

Attachment 49034

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Originally Posted by snakh

Apologies if this has been brought up elsewhere, but I have an effect coded like so:

> Incapacitated; SAVEE: WIS [SDC]; DMGOE: 1d12 psychic; (C)

This is from the Id Insinuation spell in 5e if anyone's interested. The expected behavior is that at the end of the target's turn, they take 1d12 psychic damage and make a wisdom saving throw vs the caster's spell DC. That happens flawlessly. However, for some reason after those rolls resolve, the target takes another 1d12 psychic damage for no discernible reason. Is this a bug or did I goof somehow?

Edited to add that the additional 1d12 damage is not rolled if I remove the SAVEE section from the effect, only when both are present. It doesn't matter whether the SAVEE or DMGOE clause is first as far as I can tell.

Attachment 49034

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Because you are doubling up on things its doing.

If you want it to save at the end of each turn and take damage. You would use SAVEE. If you want it to take ongoing damage at the end of their turn, you would do DMGOE.

So it sounds like this spell only needs the
>>>> SAVEE: WIS [SDC]; DMG: 1d12 psychic; (C)

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Originally Posted by MrDDT

Because you are doubling up on things its doing.

If you want it to save at the end of each turn and take damage. You would use SAVEE. If you want it to take ongoing damage at the end of their turn, you would do DMGOE.

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SAVEE and DMGOE shouldn't theoretically interfere with each other based on the documentation. DMGOE deals damage at the end of the target's turn. SAVEE grants a saving throw at the end of the target's turn. SAVEDMG would theoretically be an option, except it only deals damage on a failed save, whereas the spell deals the damage regardless of whether the target saves that turn or not.

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Originally Posted by MrDDT

So it sounds like this spell only needs the
>>>> SAVEE: WIS [SDC]; DMG: 1d12 psychic; (C)

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DMG: 1d12 psychic; would grant the target a bonus to damage it deals. DMGO is a built-in function that causes ongoing damage at the start of the target's turn. DMGOE is necessary in this case because the spell specifies that the ongoing damage happens at the end.

Hopefully all that made sense.

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Originally Posted by snakh

SAVEE and DMGOE shouldn't really interfere with each other. One deals damage at the end of the target's turn. The other grants a saving throw at the end of the target's turn.



DMG: 1d12 psychic; would grant the target a bonus to damage it deals. DMGO is a built-in function that causes ongoing damage at the start of the target's turn. DMGOE is necessary in this case because the spell specifies that the ongoing damage happens at the end.

Hopefully all that made sense.

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Sorry you are correct, it should be SAVEDMG.

So you want
>>> SAVEE: WIS [SDC]; SAVEDMG: 1d12 psychic; (C)


This will force a save at the end of the effected creature's turn and on a failed save they take 1d12 psychic damage.

If you want it to always take the damage and the save is to remove it, you need to change the coding to where you use the effects.

IDI; DMGOE: 1d12 psychic

Id Insinuation ; IDI; SAVEE: WIS [SPC] (R);(C)


This will apply the effect IDI (which has your damage go end of turn damage. While also making them do a save to remove the effect at the end of each turn.

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Originally Posted by MrDDT

If you want it to always take the damage and the save is to remove it, you need to change the coding to where you use the effects.

IDI; DMGOE: 1d12 psychic

Id Insinuation ; IDI; SAVEE: WIS [SPC] (R);(C)


This will apply the effect IDI (which has your damage go end of turn damage. While also making them do a save to remove the effect at the end of each turn.

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I might not be following exactly, but I tried what you mentioned and it didn't work for me.

I have the following in my custom effects (top right of the screen)
IDI; DMGOE: 1d12 psychic

And then I have this in the effect text of the spell
Id Insinuation ; IDI; Incapacitated; SAVEE: WIS [SDC] (R); (C)

And it only does the save, not the ongoing damage. Is there an extension that lets you use custom effects in that way or am I just not doing it right?

Edit: Per discussion outside the thread, it seems that another extension would be necessary for splitting it out in this way (Equipped Effects).

The core issue I mentioned earlier still stands though I think. According to the documentation, using SAVEE and DMGOE together should not result in the DMGOE damage being rolled twice. That's clearly a bug :)

@rhagelstrom have you seen or considered a way to have "once-per-turn" abilities, such that the effect can be set to never expire and it just toggles active/inactive? This would apply to, for example, the Ranger Monster Slayer ability "Slayer's Prey," which is only used on the first hit per turn but lasts until your next rest.

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Originally Posted by anathemort

@rhagelstrom have you seen or considered a way to have "once-per-turn" abilities, such that the effect can be set to never expire and it just toggles active/inactive? This would apply to, for example, the Ranger Monster Slayer ability "Slayer's Prey," which is only used on the first hit per turn but lasts until your next rest.

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You can use the ONTURN using this EXT for this.
https://www.dmsguild.com/product/312...ate_id=1307708

Hi rhagelstrom this extension adds some really nice functionality, great work!!

Unfortunately the STURNREturn modifier function seems to break down if initiative is rolled each round. I haven't tested with any of the other turn modifier functions (yet) so can't say about any of the others.
Is there any chance you can take a look into this?

Cheers, Steve.

**EDIT**
Scratch the above, just checked and saw that you moved the initiative update to it's own extension. With the two running it works perfectly :)
Thanks again for this ext.

Hi been looking around for this but cant find a answer.

Is there anyway to make the *DMGADD* commands (like TDMGADDS), only trigger on melee attacks?

About the concentration limiting function: If I set it to "on", where it restricts concentration to a single spell, then some spells like Hunter's Mark don't work properly - they require an effect on the caster and an effect on the target, with both effects marked as concentration (to expire properly), and the extension treats them as separate spells and expires the first when you apply the second. But if I toggle the concentration setting to "off", then my players can have multiple concentration effects from different spells on at the same time, and we have to actually remember to check. I always make sure my players preface effects with the name of the spell/ability that grants them, such that spells like Hunter's Mark have effects that all start "Hunter's Mark;" followed by whatever actual effects-coding is required. Is there a way to have the extension check for that and make an exception to the "only one concentration effect per caster" rule?

Tonight we were playing and my group used a giant's str potion. The effect: STR: 23-X, was not working. So I tested it in a clean build and it appears to not be working (s1). In this example the 18 STR would get +5 making it 23 and giving the rolls +2. I tested with a straight STR:5 and it works fine (s2). Maybe I am not using this correctly as an effect?

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Originally Posted by nephranka

Tonight we were playing and my group used a giant's str potion. The effect: STR: 23-X, was not working. So I tested it in a clean build and it appears to not be working (s1). In this example the 18 STR would get +5 making it 23 and giving the rolls +2. I tested with a straight STR:5 and it works fine (s2). Maybe I am not using this correctly as an effect?

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it's not clearly stated, but that only works from the actions tab, the X has to be parsed as something, the way you've applied it directly into the CT it's just being operated as X

Attachment 49547Attachment 49547

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Originally Posted by Zygmunt Molotch

it's not clearly stated, but that only works from the actions tab, the X has to be parsed as something, the way you've applied it directly into the CT it's just being operated as X

Attachment 49547Attachment 49547

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Thank you for the clarification.

Just s heads up that if you're experiencing issues with multiple target concentration spells like BLESS, the effect expires immediately when "single concentration" is set to ON in the game options. The concentration setting must be set to off and then effects like BLESS will not expire immediately for all targets.

Thanks for this great extension!

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Originally Posted by charmov

Just s heads up that if you're experiencing issues with multiple target concentration spells like BLESS, the effect expires immediately when "single concentration" is set to ON in the game options. The concentration setting must be set to off and then effects like BLESS will not expire immediately for all targets.

Thanks for this great extension!

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Yeah, I like the feature so I recoded the way some of my spells work to factor in this fact. I think it is worth the extra effort to let the system track the concentration effect for me. I wish it could factor in the multi targets to decide as to whether or not to cancel the spell.

That's awesome! I'm a bit ignorant but what would be the point of having it set to ON, is it just so players don't accidentally use two concentration effects?

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Originally Posted by charmov

That's awesome! I'm a bit ignorant but what would be the point of having it set to ON, is it just so players don't accidentally use two concentration effects?

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That is correct. With it ON, if they cast a 2nd spell that needs concertation it alerts us to that and ends the early effect. This helps me so I don't have to remember all the spells that have concertation and which ones have been already cast and by who. There are other ways to handle this and this is by far not the only way but it is the way that works for us.

All, been busy lately with life but we have an update:

Version Update: 2.9
Added SAVEADD: Add effect on failed save
Added SaveADDP: Add effect on successful save
Added settings option to take into account duration for concentration

Thanks @MeAndUnique for contributions! I'll see if I can find some time soon to get caught up on things.

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Originally Posted by charmov

Just s heads up that if you're experiencing issues with multiple target concentration spells like BLESS, the effect expires immediately when "single concentration" is set to ON in the game options. The concentration setting must be set to off and then effects like BLESS will not expire immediately for all targets.

Thanks for this great extension!

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Agreed. This extension is invaluable, but I discovered the situation that you described above when one of my players was trying to cast Faerie Fire and the spell kept ending for all except one target. It'd be nice if enforcing the "single concentration spell" rule didn't also catch multi-target concentration spells in its web.

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Originally Posted by BushViper

Agreed. This extension is invaluable, but I discovered the situation that you described above when one of my players was trying to cast Faerie Fire and the spell kept ending for all except one target. It'd be nice if enforcing the "single concentration spell" rule didn't also catch multi-target concentration spells in its web.

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What are/is the effect string(s) you are using?

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Originally Posted by rhagelstrom

What are/is the effect string(s) you are using?

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The standard code from the Automatic Effects package. # Faerie Fire (Blue); GRANTADVATK; (C); LIGHT: 0/10 0000FF; 'npc'

Version update 2.10
Fixed 5E Concentration not correctly restricted when multiple targets and duration is in minutes

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Originally Posted by rhagelstrom

Version update 2.10
Fixed 5E Concentration not correctly restricted when multiple targets and duration is in minutes

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Thanks for the fix! Much appreciated!

I PM'd you about it several weeks ago, but it seems you've been busy and I guess you missed it.

Thanks again for the fantastic extension. It really is invaluable.

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Originally Posted by rhagelstrom

Version update 2.10
Fixed 5E Concentration not correctly restricted when multiple targets and duration is in minutes

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Looking forward to testing it out. Thanks!

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Originally Posted by Alyksandrei

About the concentration limiting function: If I set it to "on", where it restricts concentration to a single spell, then some spells like Hunter's Mark don't work properly - they require an effect on the caster and an effect on the target, with both effects marked as concentration (to expire properly), and the extension treats them as separate spells and expires the first when you apply the second. But if I toggle the concentration setting to "off", then my players can have multiple concentration effects from different spells on at the same time, and we have to actually remember to check. I always make sure my players preface effects with the name of the spell/ability that grants them, such that spells like Hunter's Mark have effects that all start "Hunter's Mark;" followed by whatever actual effects-coding is required. Is there a way to have the extension check for that and make an exception to the "only one concentration effect per caster" rule?

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I can losen the restriction up to only use the effect Tag instead of the entire effect name itself which I think might be sufficient

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Originally Posted by Slagmoth

However, temporary hit points are an extension of you by RAW and if you take damage to them you are still taking damage as noted in the rules and clarified in Sage Advice Compendium

https://media.wizards.com/2020/dnd/d...Compendium.pdf

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This is probably fair point.

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Originally Posted by Slagmoth

I would also suggest changing the default for "Restrict Concentration" to "ON" as well.

It is always a good idea to default options to the RAW rather than what you do at your tables, it is just good practice from a development stance... I would have lost a bit of time had I noticed this weird behavior during a combat as I tracked down the issue to fix it.

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Originally this was on but there was pushback to off. I'm fine with it off as it behaves as vanilla FG. People can enabled it if they feel the need.