Story window behavior changes

[Trenloe]

Well Moon Wizard though I have forward and backward navigation arrows I fail to see why my campaign story area shows Story (Advanced) and Story (Simple) showing when before the latest fixes...it didn't show the books (which are the advanced stories) I was copying in as reference manuals.

Though once I gave high praise to Fantasy Grounds...I'm afraid this latest update has left a bad taste in my mouth and a sadness in my heart for what was once a beautiful thing now seems tarnished.

With the forward/back arrows now present again I'm confused what you now think is tarnished, can you elaborate please?

[Moon Wizard]

I'm not sure what you are referring to; as the only posts I see from you above have to do with navigation buttons, which are now available for non-book Story records.

If you are talking about the fact that Story Book pages are now all shown in the Story records, that was a design choice made to make sure that all records are available for access, instead of being hidden.

Regards,
JPG

[rocketvaultgames]

I do love having the navigation arrows back. Unfortunately, they don't seem to respect which folder the story record is in like they used to...

For example: Right Arrow from "B6. WARLORD LAIR: SOUL COLLECTORS" in folder "00 - Avernus Hexes" goes to "Bai Shui's Invitation" in "(Uncategorized)", rather than "C1. MONUMENT OF TIAMAT" in "00 - Avernus Hexes".

[Moon Wizard]

Hmm, I'll have to take a look at enhancing that a bit. It got a lot more complicated with all the extra records.

Regards,
JPG

[GSKlein]

With the forward/back arrows now present again I'm confused what you now think is tarnished, can you elaborate please?

I'd say for me the system is a little tarnished.

I'd like to know why the recent update was made to change how the story section shows? How many of your customers asked to have the navigation buttons removed? How many asked to have "simple" and "advanced" story sections noted? How many wanted their reference books copied into the story section?

this has screwed up numerous campaigns I was running. The only way to get rid of this ridiculous "advanced" story notations which aren't stories but reference books is to delete the books or make sure all stories (basically chapters in an ongoing campaign) listed under their own category which also means i can't have them all showing in the story section or the reference books show as well.

I'm not sure who thought this would be great idea but it hasn't been and I highly doubt based on the comments I've seen the majority of users wanted this done...but was done anyway. Anything that makes it more difficult or time consuming to be a GM when I'm using a software application that supposed to make things simpler, more efficient and quicker tarnishes that software. For me that's this latest update which makes things difficult or time consuming to be a GM.

[bwatford]

As someone that is outside and looking in, having no interaction with the development team, and being just as surprised as a lot of people when the update dropped, here are my thoughts. Note, they may be wrong and MW or another developer might tell me as much.

It seems the entire goal here is to move away from "simple" story entries as the default way to build a module/adventure/campaign. The simple renaming of reference manuals to "books" and putting it on the sidebar is the first obvious sight of that.

The old way of using the story window and an obtuse numbering format to keep it in order is something that has always been around and I do understand that change is hard for a lot of people.

The new way, I think is much like you would do at a table top and open your book to run a game. With the ease of access of advanced story entry and the organization that the "books" provide make it an obvious way of doing things going forward.

I have already moved a few of my campaigns over to it, having the book open in the place of the "story" window and opening entries from the book much the same as old "simple" story entries (which have the arrows and you can flip through.

To me it seems a much better "organized" system, but I also see that the old story window gets crowded in older preexisting modules and campaigns with both entries in there. I think a selector to filter the entries by simple or advanced would eliminate that issue pretty quickly.

The main issue I am having with transitioning older snuff into workable books is two fold...

1. Most of the reference manuals from older books are locked and won't let you edit them like the simple story entries, so you have to rebuild a book to make edits.

2. Map pins still go to the old story entries instead of new book entries, so you have to redo map pins.

But even with those two issues, I can easily see the intent and where the change is going for modules after the update.

It actually eliminates the need for both "reference manuals" and "simple stories" since the reference manual can now be used like a real book to run the game from.

I hope this helps, but again, your millage may vary. Change is hard.

Just my 2 coppers.

[GSKlein]

As someone that is outside and looking in, having no interaction with the development team, and being just as surprised as a lot of people when the update dropped, here are my thoughts. Note, they may be wrong and MW or another developer might tell me as much.

It seems the entire goal here is to move away from "simple" story entries as the default way to build a module/adventure/campaign. The simple renaming of reference manuals to "books" and putting it on the sidebar is the first obvious sight of that.

The old way of using the story window and an obtuse numbering format to keep it in order is something that has always been around and I do understand that change is hard for a lot of people.

The new way, I think is much like you would do at a table top and open your book to run a game. With the ease of access of advanced story entry and the organization that the "books" provide make it an obvious way of doing things going forward.

I have already moved a few of my campaigns over to it, having the book open in the place of the "story" window and opening entries from the book much the same as old "simple" story entries (which have the arrows and you can flip through.

To me it seems a much better "organized" system, but I also see that the old story window gets crowded in older preexisting modules and campaigns with both entries in there. I think a selector to filter the entries by simple or advanced would eliminate that issue pretty quickly.

The main issue I am having with transitioning older snuff into workable books is two fold...

1. Most of the reference manuals from older books are locked and won't let you edit them like the simple story entries, so you have to rebuild a book to make edits.

2. Map pins still go to the old story entries instead of new book entries, so you have to redo map pins.

But even with those two issues, I can easily see the intent and where the change is going for modules after the update.

It actually eliminates the need for both "reference manuals" and "simple stories" since the reference manual can now be used like a real book to run the game from.

I hope this helps, but again, your millage may vary. Change is hard.

Just my 2 coppers.

Sorry but yeah I guess the new design just doesn't work for me.

I mean if campaigns were just meant to entered into the "books" section it would be easy but I don't find it that way at all. Secondly, if we didn't need stories but just books...we wouldn't need a story button.

So no this update doesn't make things easier or more efficient I find.

[Zacchaeus]

I think this is part of the process of removing story entries altogether and moving to advanced stories (previously reference pages) which started about two years ago. The first steps is to make it easier to access the reference pages and so it makes sense to have them accessible via the right hand menu. I don't think the navigation buttons were removed but it was rather a side effect of the changes (a bug if you will). All modules for the last couple of years have not included story entries but some method of enabling legacy modules to be used has to be in place.

[GSKlein]

I think this is part of the process of removing story entries altogether and moving to advanced stories (previously reference pages) which started about two years ago. The first steps is to make it easier to access the reference pages and so it makes sense to have them accessible via the right hand menu. I don't think the navigation buttons were removed but it was rather a side effect of the changes (a bug if you will). All modules for the last couple of years have not included story entries but some method of enabling legacy modules to be used has to be in place.

Unfortunately moving to "books" is not very nice. I don't find the setup, design or look better or more efficient at all. Its clunkier and doesn't operate as nicely.

As a GM I find the story section and structure smoother and a better design. The books section I only used for reference material due to the fact it doesn't look nice and isn't really friendly or fast to construct a story.

Very disappointed indeed.

[Zacchaeus]

Unfortunately moving to "books" is not very nice. I don't find the setup, design or look better or more efficient at all. Its clunkier and doesn't operate as nicely.

As a GM I find the story section and structure smoother and a better design. The books section I only used for reference material due to the fact it doesn't look nice and isn't really friendly or fast to construct a story.

Very disappointed indeed.

Well each to their own of course but the creation of a book is easier than a story and has many more options for making them look good. And the reference has a much better indexing system. However if you don't like it you don't like it. Currently stories are still there and you can create your stuff in stories just like you could before. So you don't need to create or use a reference if you don't want to.