OSE Ruleset Feedback/Bugs Support thread

[bayne7400]

I am sorry I don't understand the bug. Give me the cliff notes version.

If your asking for a recode of how npcs work that's not something I am prepared to do.

I thought my npc parser places the stat block in the notes tab, I double check.

Remember this is free ruleset. Jolly and I did it for free and haven't accepted money for our work on it nor has anyone offered ha.

[Tuirgin]

The problem is lack of information within the NPC record to indicate the attack patterns. IF the statblock was included in the record there wouldn't be a problem. So I guess my issue really should go to the paid product thread—the Referee Tome NPC records don't provide enough information to distinguish between multiple attacks and alternate attack patterns, and sometimes there are both—some monsters have multiple attacks AND an alternate attack pattern.

[bayne7400]

monsters.jpg

The monsters in the ref tome have all the information from the book What are you saying is missing?

[Tuirgin]

Let me take another stab at this, without all the supporting detail.

The core problem I want to address is insufficient representation of the monster attacks. Monsters can have 1 or more attack patterns, and each attack pattern can have 1 or more separate attacks. In the OSE books Gavin solves this problem by separating multiple attacks with commas and separating attack patterns with brackets and/or the word "or".

• A) In the software, the NPC record, the limitation is that the concept of multiple attack patterns is simply not represented. There is no way, mechanically, to represent multiple attack patterns in a way that makes them visible to the end user.
• B) In the paid OSE Advanced Fantasy Referee's Tome the NPC records could have, but do not, provide this information. In most cases there is no information provided in the NPC record to distinguish between multiple attack patterns and multiple attacks.

The problem could be mitigated by addressing A or B, or a combination of them. My overly long post was running down the "user story" sort of problem at work here as well as possible solutions. If it would help I can try to detail the issues I see with the Referee's Tome over in the correct thread for it, but I don't want to waste anyone's time. If it would be easier to chat via discord, we can move there to discuss what I'm trying to get at.

[Tuirgin]

monsters.jpgThe monsters in the ref tome have all the information from the book What are you saying is missing?

In the Referee Tome the information for the monster is provided in two places:

• the NPC record
• the Reference Manual

The NPC records do not provide all the needed information to distinguish between multiple attacks and alternate attack patterns. Look at the White Ape, the Banshee, the Bulette, the Manticore, etc. You cannot tell from the NPC record whether the monster has multiple attacks or alternate attack patterns.

• The White Ape has 2 attack patterns: in the 1st pattern they get 2 attacks with claws, and in the 2nd pattern they get 1 attack with a thrown rock.
• The Banshee has 2 attack patterns, each with a single attack.
• The Bulette has only a single attack pattern of 3 attacks.
• The Manticore has 2 attack patterns: in the 1st pattern they get 2 claw attacks and 1 bite attack; in the 2nd pattern they get 6 tail attacks.

There is no way to determine these attack details from the NPC records alone. It is necessary to pull up the reference manual, search for the monsters, and then skim through the collection of monsters in which they appear to find the correct record. This could be a lot more convenient.

The Reference Manual entries have the full monster description, including the statblock, but they cannot be reached efficiently because monsters do not have their own, individual records which can be linked. They are grouped together, which requires navigation to the referee tome, searching to find the monster grouping, then then visual scanning to find the monster entry. Individual monster entries would be an improvement to this, making it more efficient to use. Links to individual entries could be dropped in the NPC records' Notes tab.

[bayne7400]

So you want "or" inserted? Try making a request in one single complete sentence. You can save all of us time.

[Tuirgin]

Okay: "How do I distinguish between multiple attacks and alternate attack patterns for monsters like the White Ape, the Banshee, the Bulette, and the Manticore using the NPC records provided in the paid Referee's Tome?"

[Jiminimonka]

Okay: "How do I distinguish between multiple attacks and alternate attack patterns for monsters like the White Ape, the Banshee, the Bulette, and the Manticore using the NPC records provided in the paid Referee's Tome?"

Pick one monster and post a screenshot off the attacks it has and then show what you think it should have, that might help.

[Tuirgin]

The NPC record as it is now in the Referee Tome:


The NPC record updated with the statblock and attack pattern annotation:


Personally, I think that the statblock is more important than the attack pattern annotation—it will answer a wider variety of questions.

[Jiminimonka]

So you would like the stat block (even though it's included in the NPC sheet) and those extra attacks added?

Roar is not an attack per se, the players need to roll a save to avoid damage, so it doesn't need to be in the automation.

I think you are expecting too much.