Latest test game in TEST server - that was painful

[SilentRuin]

That was painful. I just ran a 3 hour attempt to run with TEST server on my FGCON16 map tool art subscription assets created maps with lighting.

Last week I ran through the same maps and had a few blackout issues. This week - I had a ton of blackout issues and then horrific eventually unplayable random lag followed by total lag for everyone.

It was a LAN game. I would see the things happen instantly that a player did - but they would not see the player rolls until much later. As time progressed it became unplayable for us all. Some were like 2 minutes behind on things that had happened. Even after I shutdown the maps.

Here is what we found:

When a light equipped player did an end turn, random blackouts. One or multiple players and it varied. Sometimes it would be fixable by resharing the map. Sometimes it would be fixable by player closing map and reopening it from images. Sometimes they had to logout and back in. Sometimes only removing the token and CT entry and replacing it entirely would make it work. Sometimes the DM had to exit the game entirely when none of those things worked. Never happened when a non light effect CT entry had end turn.

A player with a torch had waypoint movement lag issues with a torch.

A player with a torch only saw grey (darkvision) even with a torch effect - everyone else saw color. Reshare map and they see color.

A player with darkvision could see no other player tokens unless a torch was turned on. GM could see them as light green when looking through their eyes and would not clearly see them either. Not sure which of the "blackout" workarounds above fixed this one.

If I had a token with lighting - like an NPC swarm of bats - active (blue light) - and removed it out of combat tracker blackouts happened (most consistent way to get them after end turn).

Removing a combat tracker entry and replacing it with another combat tracker entry controled by player the token was lost completely. Sometimes. Never found the pattern for this and it was the hardest to workaround when it happened. Setting Party vision and movement - which we did not want - seemed to make this a little better even though the player was the owner of the DB combat tracker entry.

The lag started gradually and only with one player. Then another - then eventually all of us. This was not normal explainable network lag in my option it was something else. I now understand all the lag complaints which I did not before (because last week I didn't have any with the same code and maps - only after this latest TEST server update).

I don't know what happened or how this is being tested. But unless the developers are running their tests with multiple players over the network (not local) and running decent sized maps with a moderate amount of lighting in them and on the tokens via effects - then that is not a test and you won't see any of this.

I can do this locally all day and never be hit by this stuff as a GM. This needs to be tested in a big map with real LOS in it like pits and lights etc. I had a max of 4 light sources going at any time in all of this.

Was most frustrating time I've ever had with this game.

[kevininrussia]

Something similar was reported here:

https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forum...erday-s-Update

[SilentRuin]

Something similar was reported here:

https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forum...erday-s-Update

He did a much better job. Good resource stats - what he specifically used. I was too exhausted after this - plus I looked at the logs. Console log for 3 hours was hardly anything and nothing of note. Network log was like 2 lines. And a cynic could easily say - you used extensions - you used a biggish map with 1 fixed light source and 2 combat tracker torch effect light sources and a lot of columns casting shadows and blocking LOS - the lag was the network...

I have to run a test on monday that should be even tougher - is there a way to set logging in test that would show what I'm seeing for that one?

[Moon Wizard]

As usual, we'll need more information, such as the specific campaign files (zipped up with file share link) as well as details on how to open the images to what you were seeing.

Regards
JPG

[SilentRuin]

As usual, we'll need more information, such as the specific campaign files (zipped up with file share link) as well as details on how to open the images to what you were seeing.

Regards
JPG

You'd have to have all the extensions, modules, and remote players to go along with that test so they could gradually build up whatever we were building up (FOW?) till it killed us dead with lag. And that would still not show the blackout issues without running the players through things as they were seemingly random (though I'm sure there was a pattern somewhere).

This is not something I think can be tested by simply doing a few things to it - needs to be hammered like a real game with players doing locked token movement with lighting - with NPCs with active tokens seeing in various visions as you delete them from combat tracker and map and all the other things I mentioned.

I mentioned all the things that can be done by remote players that caused these issues - remember the GM was last to be effected - instantly receive attack roll - players took forever to receive it. I can never see this stuff with GM only or my local test player. I suspect there is something building up on client sides that is killing things and FOW is my number one suspicion.

I'll check with you tomorrow if you still want things that I don't think by themselves will help you but you for sure can try what I'm suggesting as doing those tests with remote players should get you those results. I found polymorphism extensions switching out a PC with an NPC owned by the player without movement option in FGU set pretty much guaranteed the blackout loss of token would be duplicatable. But plenty see that without that - just more randomly. And never at GM or local player test.

[SilentRuin]

As usual, we'll need more information, such as the specific campaign files (zipped up with file share link) as well as details on how to open the images to what you were seeing.

Regards
JPG

Well I tried to export a module of all my maps and the lighting - loaded them into brand new campaign with one pre gen character loaded in and no extensions - copied the images - unloaded the mod - brought up the images. All the lighting was stripped out of them.

So that's another issue - if you can't export lighting with a map that seems kind of a serious flaw. I'll have to recreate the fixed lighting - fortunately that is one light for this demo - still... I find it hard to believe this is not easily duplicated without a special step by step thing if you have remote clients (5) and run around anything. But I will try to simplify a test. How I will do (blackouts, loss of types of light, can't see other tokens, lag) this when it only happens with remote players? I'm not really sure. But I'll give it a shot.

[SilentRuin]

As usual, we'll need more information, such as the specific campaign files (zipped up with file share link) as well as details on how to open the images to what you were seeing.

Regards
JPG

How do I get this campaign zip to you? Note it has 3 maps we used and I had to put in lights manually as the export failed to transfer any lighting. I only loaded SRD stuff. I put in a character with a torch effect in one map - and an NPC alcolyte with torch effect - and NPC priest next to fixed lighting. Also put a swarm of bats.

You can attach a remote player and see if you can duplicate it - we have 5 remote players though.

End turn on guy with torch from player side would cause map to go black for one or more players - random.
Clicking on the bats from GM side so it was active and blue vision showing - then deleting it from combat tracker reaked blackout havoc on one or more players.
Running the five players through the initial cave map and then into the larger underground ruins (where I set up all the combat tracker stuff right now) eventually killed us all with lag and blackouts as I described earlier. We reached the map I have them in after about an hour and a half due to all the issues we had in the first map but pretty sure you can duplicate this in any map with anything if you have enough remote players and play around enough. But I'm ready to give you mine.

Also we had extensions and other modules as I said - but as I don't think those had anything to do with anything I'm giving it to you in pure FGU. Maps were created with art subscription so you'll need those to see them I suspect.

When you give me a place to drop it I will. If you run it locally as GM or as local player I doubt you'll duplicate anything FYI.

[LordEntrails]

How do I get this campaign zip to you?

The usual suggestion is to upload it to a cloud share service (Google, Drop Box, etc) and then either post a link here or PM it to Moon with a reference to this thread, or open a support ticket with the link and a reference to this thread.

[SilentRuin]

The usual suggestion is to upload it to a cloud share service (Google, Drop Box, etc) and then either post a link here or PM it to Moon with a reference to this thread, or open a support ticket with the link and a reference to this thread.

Is there an email I can just send the zip too for support?

[SilentRuin]

Also while I can duplicate NONE of the things we see in a locally attached player - I can duplicate the total LOSS of the token for a player.

Bring up your local player and assign 2 characters to them. You can get in a state where your looking through the eyes of one character with a torch (with other one in the dark) and not see that character on player side. As it should be. Then switch to portrait of the other character - and nothing. You can't see token you can't find token you can't use token. I absolutely saw this happen during our game with some shared NPCs where they could never get back to seeing a token. The only way I could get back was to reactivate the other token I could still see - then have GM get the other token activated - then switch portrait.

My guess being - activating portrait is not triggering the activation for that token somehow when its not currently visible do to perspective of other token. This could be a more basic problem where things that activate tokens are not doing it when lighting says they are not visible from the last perspective or something. All OWNED tokens (CT entries) of the player should ALWAYS be visible on their map. ALWAYS. And with lighting I don't think that is true in some situations. That is what is causing some of these blackout issues I believe - lights have some how messed with the activation on the player sides and are being lost (as in things that should keep them visible on their screens when they own them - no longer are). Thus causing all sorts of situations where token states or visibility from other players somehow get applied to the owning player and they can no longer operate their map token (gone). Which also means nothing can be seen from their perspective. This is NOT the cause of all blackouts as a lot of the time they can still see "some" of the tokens on the map - just no light. But total blackout would be caused by this.