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  1. #1

    Symbaroum Ruleset Issues

    I finally bit the bullet and purchased the Symbaroum ruleset. Myself and some of my players ran a quick test this morning using it with Fantasy Grounds Unity and here are a few issues we ran into, in rough order of severity:


    1. Is there a way to automate NPC attacks in the Combat Tracker? I can drag & drop damage rolls to a target and it rolls the armor dice and applies the dice automatically, but I can't figure out how to drag & drop attacks. Currently I have to tell my players to manually set the Defence modifier and then roll their Defence. This massively slows down the game.
    2. Players cannot set their own targets in the Combat Tracker - this is very annoying, especially for spell casters. They have to keep asking the DM to set the target for them, which slows things down a lot, and reduces the feeling of player agency.
    3. Maintained spell effects in the Combat Tracker are not removed when the caster fails their automatic maintain roll.
    4. Manually removing spell effects in the Combat Tracker throws up a script error in the FGU console.
    5. Larvae Boil spell damage is supposed to ignore armor, but it doesn't. Each time it's applied in the Combat Tracker the victim's armor is rolled and deducted from it.
    6. Death test table appears to be missing (p.160 of the rulebook). This should preferably be applied automatically when a character reaches 0 Toughness or less.
    7. Selecting Create PC in the Library window changes the right side menu to just show the Characters button - it should show all of the buttons useful when creating a character e.g. Archetypes, Race, Abilities, Mystical Traditions, Mystical Powers, Rituals, Items, etc. (this is how it works in other rulesets).
    8. Fonts are quite wonky in places - I assume this is an FGU thing?
    9. Little red + symbol beside spells that opens up the drop down spell menu isn't very obvious, took us about an hour to figure that out. So that's either a UI issue or a players being dumbasses issue, you decide :-)
    10. Can't drag & drop occupations into the Occupations field in the character sheet, but you can drag them into the Abilities field?
    11. The Images folder is labelled as Maps in the right side menu, but called Images in the Library and when you open the folder - the menu item should be called Images to stay coherent, and because it contains more than just maps.
    12. The original book is full of atmospheric images but they aren't in the ruleset - can we have those in the Images folder as well please? I would love to show them to the players in appropriate places.


    The Promised Land
    • No Encounters created within the adventure, or even links to the appropriate NPCs within the body of the text. For example, Scene 1: The Tryout should have a link either an Encounter with the Caravan Guard NPC, or that NPC should be directly linked in the text so that the GM doesn't have to go hunting for it.
    • Same goes for the Scene 3 - the map is linked (yay!) but the NPC encounters are not (boo!).


    I'd like to start start streaming a new campaign with this ruleset on Twitch, but currently it still feels a bit rough round the edges and not quite as slick as it should be. If we could at least have the first few of these issues addressed it would go a long way to improving things...

    Thanks for your hard work on this already!

    Rodney
    Last edited by rodney418; April 20th, 2020 at 15:56.
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  2. #2
    Another small thing: all of the weapons in the Items list only have 1 quality listed. Long weapons and Short weapons should preferably have those qualities listed as well since they make a material difference to how they operate.
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  3. #3
    Another small thing: the pregens listed don't have portraits and only have 1 gendered name. Whereas the versions given on The Iron Pact have both male and female names listed, plus portraits. See:

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B2z...xvVmVZTHc/view
    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B2z...gwc0QzbGc/view
    https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B2z...V5bEV1MVE/view
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  4. #4
    Modifiers & Effects tables both seem to be empty. How do I apply Advantage or the reroll effects of Critical Damage for example? Are the effects of a Perfect Hit or Fumble automatically applied?
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  5. #5
    Hi Rodney!

    It's really hard to answer all your questions when you post them in multiple messages. The best way for the future is if you edit your first post instead of posting multiple times.

    Secondly it would be great if you report which branch you are running on (Test/Dev/Live), as well as the client FGU/FGC.

    1. The idea here is that the player rolls their defense, and then you check if they have rolled enough successes to beat the modifier from the enemy. It's hard to automate this although possible.
    2. That's a good suggestion! I wonder why it's not like that in CoreRPG? I don't think Symbaroum has modified that behavior anything, but I could be wrong.
    3. I've managed to reproduce this with Larvae Boil, it worked with Entangling Vines so that's weird. I'll look into it! Thanks.
    4. I can't reproduce this. I just tried with Entangling Vines (and Larvae Boil). There should be an update today, try it out and then if it still fails - please provide a more concrete example, thanks!
    5. You're right, this seems to be a bug in Larvae Boil. I'll fix it to the next update!
    6. You're completely right! I'll add this to the next update as well.
    7. Interesting, I'll try to look this up as well and fix it, thanks!
    8. I don't know about fonts in FGU sorry. I haven't ever started FGU much less tried the ruleset in it.
    9. What icon would you suggest?
    10. Abilities field accepts basically anything. But yeah preferably you should be able to drag it into the Occupation, even though Occupation is only a string. I'll see if I can fix that but it's fairly low priority.
    11. Hmm yeah that's a very good point. I'll see if I can fix it!
    12. There are quite some images in the reference guide. For example, if you look into "The Ways of Life" you can see it or under "The Iron Pact". Maybe it's different in FGU, I don't know.

    The Promised Land: Those are fairly low-prioritized but I'll see if I can find time to insert them.

    13. You're right. long and short seems to be missing from weapons. That's very interesting. I'll definitely fix this.
    14. "The Iron Pact" that you're referring to is not official resources. In the book, there are no such portraits.
    15. Those modifiers have not been added to the modifiers list. However, if you deal enough damage to a monster or player they should be knocked prone. In the effects-list in the Combat Tracker you can select if a target is elevated and/or if attacks versus the target has advantage. It's not very obvious but hover the two now flattened diamond-shaped symbols there and you should get more information.

    Thanks for reporting all of this. I'll try to get it fixed as soon as I can!

    Cheers,
    Simon

  6. #6
    Hi again Rodney, regarding the long/short quality - that's embedded in the weapon type (weapon type short/long etc), and the quality should be working correctly. Please let me know if that doesn't work.

  7. #7
    Hi Simon!

    Will try to keep things all in one place in future, sorry about that :-)

    Re versions: I updated to the most recent FGU this morning, running on the Live branch, so that's 04-17.

    1. It's standard in FG that you should be able to drag & drop your combat dice rolls directly on to the target. While it's true that Symbaroum has fixed amounts for NPCs rather than dice rolls, the ruleset does handle this correctly with the Damage system, so would be much simpler if the Attack roll worked exactly the same way. If I drag an NPC's weapon damage to a PC in the Combat Tracker, the PC autorolls the Armor amount and the resulting damage is automatically applied. It should work the same way for NPC attacks. I should be able to drag the NPC attack modifier to a PC (or use a dedicated Attack button) and have the PC autoroll their Defence. (This should work if an NPC has targeted a PC previously and the GM just double clicks the NPC's Attack and Damage rolls)

    2. In Savage Worlds for example (which I think is based on CoreRPG), a player can grab the Attack dice or Spellcasting dice in their character sheet and drag it to an NPC field in the Combat Tracker to automatically target that NPC and make an attack roll on it with either the weapon or spell. We couldn't figure out how to do this with the spells in Symbaroum. The player had to tell the GM which enemy they wanted to target, then the GM set up the targeting in the Combat Tracker, and only then could the player roll to see if they hit. If you are used to the drag & drop method this seems very clumsy in comparison.

    4. Screenshot enclosed

    8. "I haven't ever started FGU much less tried the ruleset in it."

    I would strongly suggest that you do. Unity is pretty far advanced in beta already and as an official ruleset the expectation is that Symbaroum should be fully compatible with it (and I believe that it is already being advertised as such). So you absolutely need to be testing on it.


    Annotation 2020-04-20 185128.png
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  8. #8
    1. Not really possible due to a lot of reaction mystical powers and similar abilities.
    2. That's supposed to work with weapons at least in Symbaroum, it probably should work with mystical powers as well. I'll look into why it doesn't work there.
    4. I still don't get this error myself. Maybe it's something that only happens in FGU? Can you try it in FGC and see if you can reproduce it there?
    8. Since FGU is in beta and not officially released yet, and as I have very little time to spend on this I am only maintaining the main line. When FGC will be no longer supported by SW I will switch over to FGU. I'm sorry to say that this is a question of throughput - plus that would mean that I'd have to buy FGU - something I don't think I've done. Afaik, it's up to SW to make sure that the ruleset is working as good at FGU as it is on FGC?

    I'm not the only developer with the FGU-issue. I know there are people even considering not using the forums until FGU is completed because they're having issues with FGU bugs being reported as FGC-bugs. I'm sorry to say but at this point I don't think it's up to me to make sure that the ruleset works as good in FGU.

  9. #9
    You don't need to buy FGU in order to test with it, your current FGC license will licence FGU as well during the beta period. I'm kind of amazed that as an official developer they don't give you an NFR license anyway.

    And given that we are already in Public Beta stage, the time when it will be officially released is imminent. That means all Devs should be testing with it NOW. The idea that some Devs are actively ignoring forum posts about it is actually quite astonishing to me. The whole point of a Public Beta is so users like me can report problems and you guys can fix them. Not ignore us.

    I understand your time issues and I do sympathise. I don't expect you to fix this right away, because I know we all have Real Life to deal with. But I would like to hear "I am looking into it", not "I am not going to bother".
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simpe View Post
    Hi Rodney!

    2. That's a good suggestion! I wonder why it's not like that in CoreRPG? I don't think Symbaroum has modified that behavior anything, but I could be wrong.
    8. I don't know about fonts in FGU sorry. I haven't ever started FGU much less tried the ruleset in it.
    Hi Simon,

    If someone edits their post there is no additional notification that such a thing has happened other than a small note at the bottom of the post.
    2. CT interaction is designed for GM use, not player use. Players can target on the map - they can also drag and drop attacks and damage onto the CT but they cannot use the targeting widget.
    8. Many fonts dont work in Unity....

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