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  1. #11
    Sorry mate. I didn't mean to sound so negative. I understand that the updater is a higher priority and that makes sense.

    I'm just disappointed and nervous that information about the Mac Beta test was not sent out in Kickstarter updates, and worried by statements like 'Mac client to the mix will also tend to slow down the pace of FGU Window client updates as well'. If that is a concern maybe you should just get further through the Windows Beta and don't do the Mac beta at all yet. I think if you let people know this and keep them updated people would be disappointed but they would understand and it would be fine.

    I know how hard it is to juggle lots of things and I do appreciate your posting on the forum.



    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Wizard View Post
    Calchas,

    That is not what I said. I said that we will have a Mac client for release. However, for at this moment in time, it is a lower priority than getting the updater client working well for both platforms. Without the installer/updater, there's no point in having the Mac client ready.

    Regards,
    JPG

  2. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Wizard View Post
    tcdo,

    Summary
    Our plan is to have a Mac client ready for release of FGU. Beyond that, the beta testing of the Mac client is a fluid project with no set dates.

    More Details
    A lot of the updater fixes that Ryan is working on are also relevant to Mac installations as well, since they use the same updater engine. So, all of this eventually funnels into getting the Mac to live release as well.

    I just spoke with Ryan this morning, and we are wrapping up the latest round of updater changes this week. And, he should be back on Mac work next week. There are no firm dates when the beta will be available, and we will most likely need to do some internal testing with any final builds we create before we make available to the playtest community as well.

    On top of that, adding a Mac client to the mix will also tend to slow down the pace of FGU Window client updates as well, because the Mac and Windows builds are done by different developers. So, there's more coordination needed.

    Regards,
    JPG
    Out of curiosity, if the Mac and Windows builds are that different, will they be able to communicate with each other?

    I ask that, because a couple of my friends are working on a Unity based TPS game, and for them creating a mac runnable version took about 4 hours, because it took 3 hours for the developer who had a mac to get home. I understand this is a different project than a TPS, and there's network data involved as well, but ... I think you see my concern there.

    Not to mention, this way you are closing the Mac userbase out of the beta, which means they cannot give feedback on the current state, which could get the opinions biased - for example, most mac users don't use a mouse with 2-3 separate buttons, so using LMB+RMB combos for common tasks means we would have to buy extra hardware; on the other hand if the Mac and the Windows version has different gestures for the same task, that means players (and GMs) might not be able to help each otehr during game, because if a Windows player tells me to use middle button to scroll the image, well, there's no middle button on the default Magic Mouse (or the touchpad on laptops).

    I understand that the focus is on the Windows version and the Updater; but I'm concerned that means the Mac version will suffer a lot, and probably the biggest reason I stood behind and backed the Unity version was the native Mac app.
    Natural 20 - that's how I roll.

  3. #13
    LordEntrails's Avatar
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    I think most of what is being tested and resolved at the moment applies to all platforms.

    I have no idea if they are considering changing the interface to accommodate Mac capabilities. Personally I would assume a 3 button mouse to be required (like they are today). Including shipping, 3 button mice can be had in the US for $3.50. So hard to consider it prohibitive in cost. But, i know people dont want to have special hardware for just one application and may not want the cheapest thing available.

    Hopefully that perspective helps, i dont mean to dismiss your concerns and perspective. They are valid and important.

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  4. #14
    Two of my players are Mac users. Despite my exalted status as the DM, one repeatedly rejects my suggestion to add a three-click mouse. Instead, he found various ways to do the same things on the trackpad of his Mac laptop. And all of them have refused my suggestion to add a second monitor to give themselves more screen space. We've been playing regularly for more than two years and have loved every minute of it, even with the occasional mechanics delay.

    I say this to make two points:
    1) Mac users can still enjoy FG even with the minor limitations
    2) Players never listen to their DM

  5. #15
    I always use a real mouse with my Macbook Pro when I can. A trackpad is a device of last resort. None of my Mac-based players have ever complained about bringing a real mouse. Now, if I could just get them to pitch in for pizza as easily...

    I'm sure SmiteWorks will get the Mac version out as soon as they can and value all constructive feedback, but they still have a lot of work ahead that applies to all platforms, not to mention continuing to support FGC at the same time.

  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Man Dice View Post
    Two of my players are Mac users. Despite my exalted status as the DM, one repeatedly rejects my suggestion to add a three-click mouse. Instead, he found various ways to do the same things on the trackpad of his Mac laptop. And all of them have refused my suggestion to add a second monitor to give themselves more screen space. We've been playing regularly for more than two years and have loved every minute of it, even with the occasional mechanics delay.

    I say this to make two points:
    1) Mac users can still enjoy FG even with the minor limitations
    2) Players never listen to their DM
    I would love to know what workarounds your players have employed. 2 1/2 years in, I still beseech my Windows-based DM to do things for me that I can't. There isn't really a FAQ set up for Mac users yet. (FGU's wiki implies there will be one, but as yet it, like my beta, is vaporware.)

    My group is half Mac, give or take half a computer. And I've borrowed a three-button mouse. We'll see how my Wineskin treats it.

    It seems to me that if the aim is simultaneous release of FGU for Windows and Mac that there must then be a Mac beta of some sort. If so I'd like to be part of that. (There was some mention of beta access in the Kickstarter. One hates to think that one's own OS is an afterthought....) I will say the promise of a working Mac-native client was a big reason I joined the Kickstarter.

  7. #17
    LordEntrails's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tcdo View Post
    It seems to me that if the aim is simultaneous release of FGU for Windows and Mac that there must then be a Mac beta of some sort. If so I'd like to be part of that. (There was some mention of beta access in the Kickstarter. One hates to think that one's own OS is an afterthought....) I will say the promise of a working Mac-native client was a big reason I joined the Kickstarter.
    The lead developer has already responded to you and another on your comments here. See posts #5 & 8 of this thread.

    SmiteWorks has never given me reason to question their integrity.

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  8. #18
    [QUOTE=notrealdan;462390]I always use a real mouse with my Macbook Pro when I can. A trackpad is a device of last resort. None of my Mac-based players have ever complained about bringing a real mouse. Now, if I could just get them to pitch in for pizza as easily...

    I gave up a mouse after 20 years and due to using a mouse. While I had always used trackpads on my Macs, I even use one for work (and left handed to boot) to spread the load on my shoulders and hands. Haven't had to see the Physical Therapist since I switched to a trackpad full time.

    I've been running FG in a Parallels VM and have not found anything I couldn't do. You just need to be familiar with the tool of choice.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flyteach View Post
    I gave up a mouse after 20 years and due to using a mouse. While I had always used trackpads on my Macs, I even use one for work (and left handed to boot) to spread the load on my shoulders and hands. Haven't had to see the Physical Therapist since I switched to a trackpad full time.

    I've been running FG in a Parallels VM and have not found anything I couldn't do. You just need to be familiar with the tool of choice.
    Just in case you were not aware and wanted another option, their are trackballs and 3D mice that don't require movement like a normal mouse that can help with such issues and often have a whole lot of buttons.

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  10. #20
    I am a die hard Mac user and I’ve been using trackballs for the last 15 years and they work great. Logitech makes several that work well and are around $20. The Mac OS has had a right click contextual menu for a very long time and I never found their standard mouses to be very good at incorporating that.

    Here is a link to a trackball that I use: https://www.amazon.com/Logitech-Trac...48223478&psc=1

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