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  1. #1

    Pathfinder ruleset upgrades?

    I was wondering if there are going to be any upgrades due to the official roll out of Pathfinder support with the paizo press release.

    I'm aware that it draws heavily from the 3.5 ruleset, and Ddavid himself said it's sufficient, but there can be more room to allow for improvements now outside of a theme adjustment.

    For myself I've modded the status icons in 3.5 to use 22x22 pixel sets from the noun project where are easier to read than the microscopic square effect icons. There's also the possibility of adding drag/drop class features akin to the D&D5e ruleset.

    Given the move to unity, perhaps all we'll get is the theme, but once those vapors coalesce I'm looking forward to seeing a more seamless interface beyond riding on the back of 3.5e.

  2. #2
    I was going to start a new thread, but this seems a good place to chime in and say that I am also hoping for drag and drop character building akin to what 5e ruleset has.
    Nicodemus' race and class mod helps me simplify PC building greatly, but it sure would be nice to be able to drag races and class levels in to character sheets, and then be presented with appropriate dialog boxes for things like alternate racial traits, class features (bloodlines for sorcerers, domains for clerics, combat styles for rangers, etc...), ability score bonuses, etc...

    As a GM for a group of relative news to RPGs in general (and none of whom have ever used a vtt before) I find that my choice of pathfinder makes a LOT more work for me at level up time because the players need me to do almost all of it for them.

  3. #3

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    nick abbey, I don't think we will see that any time soon or perhaps not at all. As has been pointed out, PFRPG has tons of options, including many inherited from 3.5. It is just too complicated at this point, although maybe they could do the basic core characters only with no archetypes. Remember, HeroLab is a piece of software the core mission of which is producing characters, and it really makes little sense for FG to duplicate that effort since you can export the character from HL to FG without a lot of fuss. We would much rather the folks here spend their time focusing on the things FG does well rather than duplicating what other software specializes in.

    Personally, I doubt most gamers would ever be satisfied with a character built by drag-and-drop.

  4. #4
    <cough>PCGen</cough>
    Paul Grosse
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    PR Silverback

  5. #5
    I would love it if they implement hit points based on ability score.
    That way constitution boost and debut works as intended.
    Of course with the option of changing what ability Hp is dependent on.
    It is one of the few things I miss

  6. #6
    I agree that including drag/drop for PF classes is likely not to be developed any time soon due to the sheer number of them. What I would like is the ability of the ruleset to allow it. Given X class it affects Y abilities supressing/altering Z mechanics for spell DC/CMD/BAB etc... a kind of package manager of sorts for applying 'mods' brought by the class.

    Extended classes can be made by the community if the base+APG/UM/UC are included. The framework needs to exist first however.

  7. #7

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    The number of classes, items, etc. don't really matter. Simply writing the functionality for one makes it work for all. We'll see. It's one thing when it's a freebie ruleset. It's something else entirely when there's money rolling in from license agreements and users buying that content. Developers tend to notice that and work on enhancements for where the money is.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talyn View Post
    Simply writing the functionality for one makes it work for all.
    I'd disagree with this statement. There are simple classes in Pathfinder and there are very complex classes. Writing the functionality that allows, say, a fighter to be drag/dropped into the character sheet is very different from the functionality required for a Kineticist (for example).

    Pathfinder has evolved over the years, with the addition of classes and class archetypes that can basically override a lot of the base rules from the Core rulebook. Things that weren't allowed in Core are now allowed due to class archetypes (as an example). To give you an idea of all of the possibilities, to get all of the packages for HeroLab that cover character generation will cost you $240, and HeroLab is constantly having to be developed/changed to allow new content to fit within their framework. And this is for an application that is aimed completely at character generation.

    Not at all a case of "simply writing the functionality for one..."
    Private Messages: My inbox is forever filling up with PMs. Please don't send me PMs unless they are actually private/personal messages. General FG questions should be asked in the forums - don't be afraid, the FG community don't bite and you're giving everyone the chance to respond and learn!

  9. #9

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    Gotta start somewhere though. I'm just talking about the basic drag & drop into the character sheet. If we're going to go into Beyond 5E Automation then sure, that'd be a lot more work but that wasn't the impression I was getting.

  10. #10

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    Talyn, the functionality you are speaking of is already there. You can drag and drop to the character sheet. Anything more than what there is now opens up the can of worms Trenloe is talking about. There is no useful intermediary layer like you are implying. Everything to handle drag and drop is lua scripting if it is not already in the ruleset. You cannot do what you are proposing because a race, for example, could potentially affect almost anything on the character sheet. It might be possible to introduce text parsing like is done for effects now, but a simple search for effects on these forums will demonstrate that it is not very reliable because the discipline of the material writers just isn't there to enforce the strict nomenclature you need to parse reliably.

    I wager that in just over a year, you will see 5e start to break down as they introduce their own gestalts, archetypes, substitution levels, or whatever other complexity they will dream up to sell more ruleset material.

    As I have said elsewhere many times, please let SW focus on the VTT and do your character generation in HeroLabs.

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