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  1. #11
    Git on it!
    I never claimed to be sane. Besides, it's more fun this way.

  2. #12
    El Condoro's Avatar
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    Sorry to ask some basic questions but I have tried to figure them out in testing and failed! These might get answered in the tutorial video but anyway...

    1. Is this extension simply a database or can it be used interactively with PCs. e.g. drag and drop an item from a shop inventory onto a PC inventory and it adds the item and subtracts its cost. Testing showed it did the dragging and dropping OK but did not subtract the cost of the item.
    2. Can you explain the Building fields - Treasury, Purchase Limit and Spell casting - please?
    3. When I drag an item into a building inventory it doesn't bring in the cost and the weight of the item - they have to be manually entered. The 'old' Shops extension brought both in when dragging from the items list.
    4. I assume 'Base' and 'Market' for inventory are the cost of production and the selling prices? e.g. a suit of chainmail might have a base of 30gp and a cost of 40gp (the PC pays). If this is correct, shouldn't the Base value be hidden from PCs when the sheet is shared?

    I'm sure I'll be using this extension a lot. Cheers.

    [Edit]: Just 2c: I know right-aligned is standard for numbers but IMO it looks better if everything is left-aligned in FG sheets.
    Last edited by El Condoro; April 20th, 2014 at 14:54.

  3. #13
    dulux-oz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Condoro View Post
    1. Is this extension simply a database or can it be used interactively with PCs. e.g. drag and drop an item from a shop inventory onto a PC inventory and it adds the item and subtracts its cost. Testing showed it did the dragging and dropping OK but did not subtract the cost of the item.
    No, version 1 does not subtract the cost - but now that you've bought it up I'll incorporate that into version 2.

    Quote Originally Posted by El Condoro View Post
    2. Can you explain the Building fields - Treasury, Purchase Limit and Spell casting - please?
    As I based the Building Form on the original Shops Form and had to make it 100% compatible with that older Extension (by another Author) some of the fields I've never actually used in my own games, but had to include for compatibility reasons. However, as most of the old form's fields were simply datastores it doesn't really matter what you put in them. The first two are probably not going to be useful for Buildings that are not Shops (ie Private Residences, Courthouses, etc). The Spell Casting is a legacy filed - I have no idea what its original purpose was - maybe to record the Spells available to the proprietor (now owner)?

    In any case, most fields if left blank won't show up once the form is Locked.

    Quote Originally Posted by El Condoro View Post
    3. When I drag an item into a building inventory it doesn't bring in the cost and the weight of the item - they have to be manually entered. The 'old' Shops extension brought both in when dragging from the items list.
    Oops - had that functionality tested and working very early on, but it must have been overwritten during a later stage of development. I'll fix it in version 2.

    "Sorry about that, Chief"
    - Maxwell Smart

    Quote Originally Posted by El Condoro View Post
    4. I assume 'Base' and 'Market' for inventory are the cost of production and the selling prices? e.g. a suit of chainmail might have a base of 30gp and a cost of 40gp (the PC pays). If this is correct, shouldn't the Base value be hidden from PCs when the sheet is shared?
    See point 2 re: legacy fields. Maybe not - under the D&D3 Rules on Magic Items, each one has a Base Cost and a Market Cost, both knowable to the Players/Characters. So there is nothing wrong with showing both - if its a problem you could set both to the same value.

    Hope that helps, and thanks for the questions/feedback.

    Cheers
    Dulux-Oz

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  4. #14
    Awesome extension, Dulux.
    Was playing around with it, and got this warning -- Ruleset Warning: buttoncontrol: Could not find icon (button_deleteconfirm) for control (ldbcldbDeleteCapital) in windowclass (wcLocationMainPolitical) -- Ruleset Warning: buttoncontrol: Could not find icon (button_deleteconfirm) for control (ldbrldbDeleteRuler) in windowclass (wcLocationMainPolitical) -- .

    I'm still too new to fully trouble shoot it, but when I get it, I am trying to drop a town into the capital slot.

    As i would be using this for mostly fantasy/medieval worlds, I was wondering about the ability to subinfeudiate? ie., who is the liege lord, who are tenants, and such.

    Anyway,
    Good work,
    James


    PS, Also, as I am working in Acres, I noticed that in the area description 'Acres' doesn't appear. Small thing, and if i was to use any other measurement, it seems to work fine.
    Last edited by jboyd4650; April 21st, 2014 at 05:10.

  5. #15
    dulux-oz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jboyd4650 View Post
    Awesome extension, Dulux.
    Thankyou.

    Quote Originally Posted by jboyd4650 View Post
    Was playing around with it, and got this warning -- Ruleset Warning: buttoncontrol: Could not find icon (button_deleteconfirm) for control (ldbcldbDeleteCapital) in windowclass (wcLocationMainPolitical) -- Ruleset Warning: buttoncontrol: Could not find icon (button_deleteconfirm) for control (ldbrldbDeleteRuler) in windowclass (wcLocationMainPolitical) -- .

    I'm still too new to fully trouble shoot it, but when I get it, I am trying to drop a town into the capital slot.
    I can not reproduce that warning - which Ruleset are you using (including version number) when this occurs?

    I did find a typo in the onDrop section of the "Capital" code to do with the slmlCapitalLink field (it should be slclCapitalLink - now fixed - will be in version 2 - damn global find & replace) - but that would not produce the warning you got. The button_deleteconfirm icon is part of the CoreRPG - the warning is effectively saying that the button_deleteconfirm icon is not available, which is why I ask which Ruleset you are using.

    Quote Originally Posted by jboyd4650 View Post
    As i would be using this for mostly fantasy/medieval worlds, I was wondering about the ability to subinfeudiate? ie., who is the liege lord, who are tenants, and such.

    Anyway,
    Good work,
    James

    PS, Also, as I am working in Acres, I noticed that in the area description 'Acres' doesn't appear. Small thing, and if i was to use any other measurement, it seems to work fine.
    I think what you are asking can be reproduced by having Locations linked to Locations ie have a Duchie Location, and on its Locations Tab have a number of Earldoms; on each of those have a number of Counties, etc. The Ruler of each Earldom would be the vassel of the Duchie's Ruler and the Leige Lord of each of their Counties, respectively.

    Is that what you mean?

    "Acres" String had a typo - fixed now and will be included in version 2

    Thanks for the feedback

    Cheers
    Last edited by dulux-oz; April 22nd, 2014 at 18:45.
    Dulux-Oz

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  6. #16
    I think what you are asking can be reproduced by having Locations linked to Locations ie have a Ducky Location, and on its Locations Tab have a number of Earldoms; on each of those have a number of Counties, etc. The Ruler of each Earldom would be the vassel of the Duchy's Ruler and the Leige Lord of each of their Counties, respectively.

    Is that what you mean?
    yes.
    that is what i did, but all locations used, are now on the main page for locations (the sheet pulled up when you hit the side bar shield). Maybe I'm just not getting them in correct tabs on this original screen.


    I can not reproduce that warning - which Ruleset are you using (including version number) when this occurs?

    all i have done is copy core rules into another files and renamed it...I am playing around at trying to create a rule set... but have done nothing more than trying to figure out the flow of the files... (this doesn't mean i have changed something somewhere). I will try another program tomorrow and see if i can duplicate it again.

    Thanks for all the work,

    James

    after thought, how do you get the quotes from last posting?
    Last edited by jboyd4650; April 21st, 2014 at 13:58.

  7. #17
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    you can use the following syntax (remove spaces) [ quote ] and [ /quote]
    you can also use the reply with quote button in the bottom right hand corner of each post

    MoreCore - Generic Ruleset
    --- Projects ---
    Extensions | Tutorials | MoreCore | MoreCore Themes | Call of Cthulhu | Maelstrom | FG Con

  8. #18

  9. #19
    dulux-oz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jboyd4650 View Post
    all i have done is copy core rules into another files and renamed it...I am playing around at trying to create a rule set... but have done nothing more than trying to figure out the flow of the files... (this doesn't mean i have changed something somewhere). I will try another program tomorrow and see if i can duplicate it again.
    (In the Core RPG) OK, each graphic is a PNG files stored in one of the sub-directories of the Graphics folder in the CoreRPG folder. The particular graphic that we are talking about is called button_deleteconfirm.png and is in the Buttons folder.

    Each graphic is referenced by Fantasy Grounds by a given (internal) name. The name that references the button_deleteconfirm.png is button_deleteconfirm (convenient, isn't it ).

    The references are contained in various "definition" XML files. The button_deleteconfirm reference is defined in the graphics_icons.xml file, which is found in the Graphics folder.

    The actual definition code itself is:
    Code:
    <icon name="button_deleteconfirm" file="graphics/buttons/button_deleteconfirm.png" />
    Which basically reads "Define an Image with a name of button_deleteconfirm and which can be found here: graphics/buttons/button_deleteconfirm.png".

    So, the error warning you were getting was saying that Fantasy Grounds could locate the "thing" called button_deleteconfirm. This can be caused by:
    1. The file button_deleteconfirm.png not existing in the location specified.
    2. The definition button_deleteconfirm not existing as far as Fantasy grounds is concerned, caused by:
      1. The definition not being in any XML file.
      2. The XML file not being known to Fantasy Grounds ie in the correct location.


    So, I suspect that where you copied/moved things you inadvertently changed the path to the XML or the PNG file.

    Does, that all make sense?

    Quote Originally Posted by jboyd4650 View Post
    yes.
    that is what i did, but all locations used, are now on the main page for locations (the sheet pulled up when you hit the side bar shield). Maybe I'm just not getting them in correct tabs on this original screen.
    No, that's how the main sheet (as you call it) is designed to work - its how the "main sheets" of all of the functionalities in FG (not just the Extension) are designed to work - they're an Alphabetical List of the records that the given functionality provides.

    What I do to keep things organised is name my locations for their "level" in the political hierarchy ie, Barony of..., Duchy of..., Kingdom of... That way, all of the Baronies appear together.

    To organise things as I think you are asking for presents some very interesting challenges from a Database Design and User Interaction point of view. Let me explain.

    WARNING!
    This next bit goes into some Database Design Theory - grab a cup of coffee before continuing

    We'll start be considering how a computer would organise such a hierarchy. The most obvious way is to have separate Forms for a Barony, a County, a Duchy, or a Kingdom. Then you would have a Duchy List, a Barony List, etc. The work load to implement something like this would be substantial, let along the duplication of code and the resulting "bloat" of the software - not to mention the amount of "button real-estate" such a solution would require.

    Another way would be to differentiate the different "levels" of such system in some way within the existing "Locations" structure. This would require, at the least, a "level number", so that all the Baronies would be 1, the Counties would be 2, etc. This would only be a small change (an additional field) to each Location Form, but is would require a fairly large bit of code to take this into account to display things in the correct order on your "main page", thus leading back to the first argument against doing so stated above. Also, extra code would be required to ensure that only "level 1" locations were able to be placed within "level 2" locations, etc.

    Any what about those Locations that aren't part of such a hierarchy? How do we deal with them?

    And what about the situation where Dukes had Barons as direct vassals, and therefore you would have Baronies directly belonging to Duchies? Or where someone wanted to include Earl and Earldoms? Why should a single hierarchical structure be dictated?

    And what about those who don't use the English terms, but instead the Persian terms, or the French, of the Russian? These aren't just language changes, but in some cases different hierarchies in structure.

    No, I've designed the system as it is to provide a balance between flexibility (it can represent any collection of Locations, Towns, and Buildings in any configuration), generic-ability (it is usable by anyone in any Ruleset), ease of development/maintenance (to save my sanity), and usefulness (keeping it as simple to use as possible while still providing all of the required functionality). If enough people let me know that they want it done in a different way then I'll certainly consider their views - actually, I'll consider anyone's/everyone's views - but I don't have the time nor the inclination to write something in such a way that it restricts others from using it by dictating to them how something "must" be done - except where absolutely necessary from a "good design" or "technological necessity" point of view.

    And I know that's not what you were asking me to do - I was just trying to explain the rational behind why I designed it the way I did.

    Keep those suggestions coming, people, plus please let me know if you find any "undocumented features" (ie bugs) - thanks.

    Cheers
    Last edited by dulux-oz; April 22nd, 2014 at 18:48.
    Dulux-Oz

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  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by dulux-oz View Post
    We'll start be considering how a computer would organise such a hierarchy. The most obvious way is to have separate Forms for a Barony, a County, a Duchy, or a Kingdom. Then you would have a Duchy List, a Barony List, etc. The work load to implement something like this would be substantial, let along the duplication of code and the resulting "bloat" of the software - not to mention the amount of "button real-estate" such a solution would require.

    Another way would be to differentiate the different "levels" of such system in some way within the existing "Locations" structure. This would require, at the least, a "level number", so that all the Baronies would be 1, the Counties would be 2, etc. This would only be a small change (an additional field) to each Location Form, but is would require a fairly large bit of code to take this into account to display things in the correct order on your "main page", thus leading back to the first argument against doing so stated above. Also, extra code would be required to ensure that only "level 1" locations were able to be placed within "level 2" locations, etc.

    Any what about those Locations that aren't part of such a hierarchy? How do we deal with them?
    I understand what your saying here, and I do like the 'generic' fit to any world ability. So,instead of building a hierarchy, can it be easily set up to hide/show on the main page? That way a GM may show the country, but hide the states; show the kingdom, and hide the baronies.

    Thanks for the reply, I am going to look through the graphic files to see if I did move something,

    James

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