Cannot enter Class and Level

So, I've created a character manually (since import has nothing to import yet), and I'm trying to fill out the first tab of the character sheet.

I cannot seem to locate a place to enter the character's speed, but far worse is the fact that I click on the "Class & Level" field, and another dialog pops up. I click "edit the list", then the "+" to add a Class.

The only places that I can click for focus to enter text in the total rank, and the Archetype. The two lines where the Class and Key Ability are will not select.

So, I cannot even enter a character.

This is going to be pretty hard to play if I cannot even enter characters into the system.

Is there an update? Is there some mystery key combo or handshake that I need to do?

You have to drag and drop everything to create a character. There are several magnifying glasses around the main sheet that will pop open all the proper tabs.

Process to create a character is to drag the race and theme over to the character sheet. Once those are dragged over, then drag the class over. The abilities adjustment should then pop up along with any class related choices. The. You can find tune everything afterwards.

One thing that wasn't clear to me until I watched some Starfinder on FG videos was that you need to drag-and-drop more than once to level up. So if you want to create a level 4 mechanic, for example, you need to drag mechanic to class four times. Additionally, there are some fields that you can type in, such as race, that you should drag-and-drop to get the correct bonuses.

The Starfinder character sheet page in the Wiki is slowly being created. It covers most of this already (not the leveling).

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Originally Posted by Trenloe

The Starfinder character sheet page in the Wiki is slowly being created. It covers most of this already (not the leveling).

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Is any of this visible to us yet? I could not see anything for Starfinder in the Wiki.

Current issue is how do I put Infrared Sensors onto Second Skin armor?

I'm sure I'll have more. I'm trying to enter all of my players' characters for our game this weekend.

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Originally Posted by tpkurilla

Is any of this visible to us yet? I could not see anything for Starfinder in the wiki.

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Look for SFRPG.

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Originally Posted by Trenloe

Look for SFRPG.

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Alright, found it.

It at least has the steps to get started. I was trying to drag-n-drop Class before Race and Theme, and was getting nowhere.

Nothing on how to add armor upgrades to armor (or androids). Is it possible to add them yet? I cannot even seem to drop the "templates" or "upgrades" anywhere on the character sheet.

Also, I don't see a means to add "Situational" entries like I can in the 4e rules. Its either a "Weapon" or a "Spell class".

Any guidance on either of these? (armor upgrades, situational abilities/mods)

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Originally Posted by tpkurilla

It at least has the steps to get started. I was trying to drag-n-drop Class before Race and Theme, and was getting nowhere.

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Check the chat window - it provides feedback during the process.

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Originally Posted by tpkurilla

Also, I don't see a means to add "Situational" entries like I can in the 4e rules. Its either a "Weapon" or a "Spell class"

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Don’t think of spell classes as just spells. Add another class, call it something like "Abilities", add 10 uses (or whatever works for you) per day for level 1 and you can then add “spell” entries (which are abilities, situational, whatever entries) with various actions/effects.

Clearly my brain was boxed into being too literal!

I'll give it a try when I get home tonight.

Thanks for the quick responses.

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Originally Posted by tpkurilla

Is any of this visible to us yet? I could not see anything for Starfinder in the Wiki.

Current issue is how do I put Infrared Sensors onto Second Skin armor?

I'm sure I'll have more. I'm trying to enter all of my players' characters for our game this weekend.

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To do this

1- Open Items
2-In Items window Open FORGE
3- Open Armor Table and drop Armor into EQUIPMENT section in the Forge.
4-From the Item window open TEMPLATES. Drag n Drop Infraed Sensors into the ITEM TEMPLATES section of the Forge
5-Press FORGE MAGIC ITEM -Your new Armor will be created.
NOTE- This creates the Item with the Name and Other Tab Information show both the Armor and Sensor Information. If the Template adds stats IE EAC or KAC or any thing else those will need to be edited in the new armor. Unlock it and make the changes to it.

See Attachment

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Originally Posted by Samarex

To do this

1- Open Items
2-In Items window Open FORGE
3- Open Armor Table and drop Armor into EQUIPMENT section in the Forge.
4-From the Item window open TEMPLATES. Drag n Drop Infraed Sensors into the ITEM TEMPLATES section of the Forge
5-Press FORGE MAGIC ITEM -Your new Armor will be created.
NOTE- This creates the Item with the Name and Other Tab Information show both the Armor and Sensor Information. If the Template adds stats IE EAC or KAC or any thing else those will need to be edited in the new armor. Unlock it and make the changes to it.

See Attachment

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Worked perfectly for the armor. Thanks!

Now how do I add to the Android Upgrade slot?

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Originally Posted by tpkurilla

Worked perfectly for the armor. Thanks!

Now how do I add to the Android Upgrade slot?

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Since it's really just record keeping

You could create a Item (Upgrade Slot) Then use the Forge the same way
(This would probably be the best as stats for the Upgrade could be auto applied if there are any.)
or
Open the Racial Trait and edit it Adding your Upgrade Item.

Kind of weird navigating to get that to match your jpg, but I got there. Thanks again!

I wish we'd had a "Forge" in the 4e rules for combining weapons and/or armor base with magic template. That would have saved me a ton of time.

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Originally Posted by Blahness98

You have to drag and drop everything to create a character.

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While I think it's neat to have the ability to just add class levels by dragging them onto the character, I'd love to have the option of doing things manually.
For example, I like to have the class name a certain way (namely, the class name being just the class name, not "Mechanic (drone)"). I actually have a character in my characters with just the class "Mechanic". I basically can't level them up properly because I cannot add another level of "Mechanic", just "Mechanic (drone)" or "Mechanic (exocortex)", which FG will treat as multiclassing and add 1st level abilities.

HP and Stamina are also something I'd like to be able to freely adjust instead of being forced to adjust it by dragging class levels.

As I said, adding new levels and the corresponding HP etc. by drag & drop is neat, and is definitely good for people who are not that experienced with FG, but the option of doing it manually like in the Pathfinder ruleset would be great.

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Originally Posted by Malkavian_Andi

While I think it's neat to have the ability to just add class levels by dragging them onto the character, I'd love to have the option of doing things manually.
For example, I like to have the class name a certain way (namely, the class name being just the class name, not "Mechanic (drone)"). I actually have a character in my characters with just the class "Mechanic". I basically can't level them up properly because I cannot add another level of "Mechanic", just "Mechanic (drone)" or "Mechanic (exocortex)", which FG will treat as multiclassing and add 1st level abilities.

HP and Stamina are also something I'd like to be able to freely adjust instead of being forced to adjust it by dragging class levels.

As I said, adding new levels and the corresponding HP etc. by drag & drop is neat, and is definitely good for people who are not that experienced with FG, but the option of doing it manually like in the Pathfinder ruleset would be great.

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The reason for the two different names for Mechanic (Drone and Exocortex) is your choice made at 1st level. I you chose to have a drone for your ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE (EX) then you use the Mechanic (Drone) there are several things in the leveling automation set up for the the Drone side of a Mechanic. Same thing for the Exocortex.

Now with that said. I have gotten allot of complaints about things that are locked down that people would like to edit manually. At first release of the rule set most things were not locked. I was getting bug report after bug report because players were not following the proper creation order. So I started making fail safe to prevent errors and bugs. Now I have went thru and unlocked stuff so players can change just about anything they want to. But I will forewarn, Automation of character leveling will start giving you problems if things like Class name are changed. If you change the Class name you will have to modify and create everything manually when you level.

You best bet for creating a Mechanic with out the Drone or Exocortex added in is to copy the original Class IE Mechanic(Drone) this can be done in the Class Window by dragging the Mechanic Drone into the List of Classes , you will then see Mechanic (Drone) with a Grey lock instead of Red You can unlock that Class, Rename it to Mechanic and use it when you create your 1st level mechanic. With that most of the automation should be fine and work well.

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Originally Posted by Samarex

You best bet for creating a Mechanic with out the Drone or Exocortex added in is to copy the original Class IE Mechanic(Drone) this can be done in the Class Window by dragging the Mechanic Drone into the List of Classes , you will then see Mechanic (Drone) with a Grey lock instead of Red You can unlock that Class, Rename it to Mechanic and use it when you create your 1st level mechanic. With that most of the automation should be fine and work well.

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Actually after testing this , it can not be done yet. You will get a console error..


I will need to spend some time re writing the Leveling Wizard system to get to where you can name things what ever you want. I don't know how much automation we will lose in doing this.

Nice to see it's being worked on. Thanks.

Please unlock class, key ability and level entry. It is very cumbersome to not be able to enter this information manually.

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Originally Posted by HoloGnome

Please unlock class, key ability and level entry. It is very cumbersome to not be able to enter this information manually.

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Those are locked for the automation, If unlocked for manual entry there will be issues and errors when the proper wording is not entered.
What are you trying to do that requires manually changing them?

I'm trying to create a character. Entering level just requires trivial number field certification and shouldn't be locked. Also, if there are text key names that the code requires for some reason, then use a pop-up.

For example, there are 6 stat names and a minimal number of classes and archetypes. Or, certify the user entry against known class and archetype names and delete if invalid. Again, it's a short list. There should be no need to lock these fields and prevent direct basic user maintenance.

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Originally Posted by HoloGnome

I'm trying to create a character. Entering level just requires trivial number field certification and shouldn't be locked. Also, if there are text key names that the code requires for some reason, then use a pop-up.

For example, there are 6 stat names and a minimal number of classes and archetypes. Or, certify the user entry against known class and archetype names and delete if invalid. Again, it's a short list. There should be no need to lock these fields and prevent direct basic user maintenance.

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There is a extensive Character Creation and Level wizard built into the rule set, Unlocking some fields for direct input breaks this wizard, I have 98% of the users wanting more automation than there is with 2% that want it all manual input.
The list of Classes and archtypes is low but it is getting bigger.
If you want a Class entered that is not already there you can create the Class and take advantage of the automation built in.

From the standpoint of usability, I guess I don't agree. Philosophically, locking these fields forces non-technical users to have to buy further content they don't have access to when they buy the base version of FG.

For level, entering a single master level number should never break anything and the ruleset changes should immediately key off of that master level entry (HP, SP, etc.).
For class or archetype names, if there is a known list (and it is relatively short), it should be easy to offer a lookup (menu or cert.) as a key input and everything downstream follows the top-level class selection.
Stat names follow from class. Skill ranks follow from class and INT. And, I guess when it comes down to it, level follows from XP. So, even without a pop-up, if I were to type an exactly matching known class name like "Mystic" and enter 4 XP, you would have all the info you need to automate from that window. You know you are creating a Mystic/2 with Wisdom as the primary stat and the number of skill ranks it should have based on INT (and dynamically calculated whenever INT changes). And...this thought experiment obviously doesn't preclude other existing top-level automation from the CRB content. They're not mutually exclusive.

So, some day, it would be great if the code were user-friendly enough to handle basic manual user entry of key lookup items, whether it's a level change, a class change, etc.

I understand that this kind of change represents more work when you are probably already overworked and that you don't want to do it...and maybe there are other priorities. Totally understandable. But, in the abstract, it should be programmatically straightforward and could easily mimic entry points in the existing automation. And I realize there are dependencies...but software architecture can usually account for those.

Thanks for taking the time to respond. I appreciate it. It's nice to see the Starfinder client making progress. I have definitely been digging into to it to make a character, and I know I'm not the average user. I hope the various other reports are helping you out.

If the current ruleset doesn't meet your needs, feel free to write an extension to override the character sheet and supporting code. That is typically the best way to get your code looked at by the developers, and possibly included in future releases

OK, thanks. And if there is ever a chance to improve the architecture for keyed items such as level derived from XP and basic class names, I hope it can become more open to support manual entry.