Special Announcement - Kickstarter

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Originally Posted by Teknykk

I honestly fail to see the logic in this approach. It's like saying people who've been loyal for longer are worth less to you than those who just rocked up. Generally, if you want to retain respect of loyal users who've been with the community for a long time, making them pay more than someone who just walked in to buy a little while ago is a pretty daft way to go about it. For Ultimate users, the difference is quite literally double the price for a longer user, and half that for the newer one. I'd love to know the reasoning behind this, and the excuse above about having had more value from FGC is a bit of a cop out, don't you think?

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The logic behind is that the 1-time licenses are a replacement for a monthly subscription that costs $10 per month. The longer you've had that and not paid a subscription, the more monetary value you've received from the license. New customers are likely to face buyers regret if they just bought 10 days ago. We are giving them a very steep discount that means they get more value from their original purchase. We are just being overly friendly and extending that even further all the way back to 2018. They can have owned it for nearly 17 months ($170 worth of subscription value savings) and they only have to pay $30 (the equivalent of 3 months). Beyond that, people get multiple years worth of savings but are only asked to pay the equivalent of $60 (6-months worth of subscriptions) to transfer that same savings to the newest version of the software. Meanwhile, it's an optional upgrade that doesn't invalidate their old version.

We had one customer arguing endlessly over it for a license he bought in 2011 (8 years worth is $960 worth of savings in monthly subscription fees and he thought it was unfair that we want to charge him $60 for access to the new platform.

If it doesn't make sense to you, then simply don't back the KS or upgrade to FGU. FGC will continue to work fine for you and you can go on about your business.

I think the upgrade approach is spot on. I purchased my standard in 2015 and Ultimate in 2018. While I'm thrilled to be able to upgrade for $30, I would have happily paid full price. I use FG for both online and f2f play. I've been playing D&D since 1979 and can't imagine doing it any other way now. I've gotten my money out of it and then some.

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Originally Posted by ddavison

The logic behind is that the 1-time licenses are a replacement for a monthly subscription that costs $10 per month. The longer you've had that and not paid a subscription, the more monetary value you've received from the license. New customers are likely to face buyers regret if they just bought 10 days ago. We are giving them a very steep discount that means they get more value from their original purchase. We are just being overly friendly and extending that even further all the way back to 2018. They can have owned it for nearly 17 months ($170 worth of subscription value savings) and they only have to pay $30 (the equivalent of 3 months). Beyond that, people get multiple years worth of savings but are only asked to pay the equivalent of $60 (6-months worth of subscriptions) to transfer that same savings to the newest version of the software. Meanwhile, it's an optional upgrade that doesn't invalidate their old version.

We had one customer arguing endlessly over it for a license he bought in 2011 (8 years worth is $960 worth of savings in monthly subscription fees and he thought it was unfair that we want to charge him $60 for access to the new platform.

If it doesn't make sense to you, then simply don't back the KS or upgrade to FGU. FGC will continue to work fine for you and you can go on about your business.

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I think it's useless to keep explaining yourself. This has been made clear over and over again. Honestly, I was expecting to pay more to upgrade. The price structure you have is more than fair! You have an awesome product, with great customer service (best in the business), and an awesome community. Look forward to the Unity.

actually i really appreciate the clarification( Ddavisons post should be added to the kickstarter faq :)

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Originally Posted by ddavison

The logic behind is that the 1-time licenses are a replacement for a monthly subscription that costs $10 per month. The longer you've had that and not paid a subscription, the more monetary value you've received from the license. New customers are likely to face buyers regret if they just bought 10 days ago. We are giving them a very steep discount that means they get more value from their original purchase. We are just being overly friendly and extending that even further all the way back to 2018. They can have owned it for nearly 17 months ($170 worth of subscription value savings) and they only have to pay $30 (the equivalent of 3 months). Beyond that, people get multiple years worth of savings but are only asked to pay the equivalent of $60 (6-months worth of subscriptions) to transfer that same savings to the newest version of the software. Meanwhile, it's an optional upgrade that doesn't invalidate their old version.

We had one customer arguing endlessly over it for a license he bought in 2011 (8 years worth is $960 worth of savings in monthly subscription fees and he thought it was unfair that we want to charge him $60 for access to the new platform.

If it doesn't make sense to you, then simply don't back the KS or upgrade to FGU. FGC will continue to work fine for you and you can go on about your business.

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I would've thought a mid-range price between either would've sufficed. And I think any customer, like me, arguing over it is perfectly reasonable also. Especially if one were to consider the contribution they've made with other purchases, or more so, helping keep the community alive with their activities. For me, this is that sore point. I've been here a fair while now. Not as long as some, but long enough to be willing to put in endless hours to cater to players, free or otherwise, to give them games to play. If one were to factor that in, it's somewhat harder to swallow that they'd have to pay double what someone else with the exact same license will.

It makes sense from your longer explanation (and I haven't been around to see it earlier if this was made clear previously), but the other responses just struck me as short excuses in a ploy to gain new users.

You'll just have to forgive me if I factor in more than actual money here, because I think it matters.

That said, I have yet to check when my license was obtained. I fully want to see the success of this campaign, as FGC is really showing its age.

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Originally Posted by Teknykk

... I'd love to know the reasoning behind this, and the excuse above about having had more value from FGC is a bit of a cop out, don't you think?

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*I don't work for SW*

No. I don't, and neither does the rest of the real world. SW has supported their user base with free upgrades for a very, very, very, very long time. New users have not had the entirety of that free ride.

Time for the *loyal* users to plunk down some coin, for the new product.

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Originally Posted by seycyrus

*I don't work for SW*

No. I don't, and neither does the rest of the real world. SW has supported their user base with free upgrades for a very, very, very, very long time. New users have not had the entirety of that free ride.

Time for the *loyal* users to plunk down some coin, for the new product.

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And I'm more than willing. I just wasn't aware of how different the prices would be. Though I think people should remember that without those loyal users, we might not be here today.

There are many ways SW could have chosen to tier the upgrade price. Including have one set price across the board. Or perhaps the value added to the community at large would be a good measure like implied. But then how would you measure that? By # of forum posts? Or forum reputation? or number of times you have used the game alias feature (if they even track that type of data).

In the end, SW seems to have chosen the industry standard, and then been more generous with it.

As for the other replies to this query. They have probably been short and less than they could be because today alone this question has been asked here and on other sites at least a dozen time. It's something that has been discussed here and elsewhere for probably a year or more.

BUT, it doesn't mean that it is not a valid question/concern. It just means people might not answer in as full or sensitive manner as they might have otherwise.

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Originally Posted by seycyrus

*I don't work for SW*

No. I don't, and neither does the rest of the real world. SW has supported their user base with free upgrades for a very, very, very, very long time. New users have not had the entirety of that free ride.

Time for the *loyal* users to plunk down some coin, for the new product.

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Well put. What other company puts out updates on a weekly basis? It's unheard of.

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Originally Posted by Teknykk

I honestly fail to see the logic in this approach. It's like saying people who've been loyal for longer are worth less to you than those who just rocked up. Generally, if you want to retain respect of loyal users who've been with the community for a long time, making them pay more than someone who just walked in to buy a little while ago is a pretty daft way to go about it. For Ultimate users, the difference is quite literally double the price for a longer user, and half that for the newer one. I'd love to know the reasoning behind this, and the excuse above about having had more value from FGC is a bit of a cop out, don't you think?

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So you're getting Ultimate FGU for $60 instead of $150. Plus you've used it for however many years you've had FGC already. A $90 discount doesn't cut the mustard, eh?