Increased damage effect (DLWW Ammo Whammy)

[PikeWake]

I've been running games live at the table lately, so I'm trying to brush up my FG skills again in case they're needed.

First issue I ran in to: Haven't checked if this is setting specific, but I can't get an effect raising the damage die of an attack to work.
The specific case is a DLWW Hexslinger using the "Ammo Whammy" power and the "Loaded for Bear Effect", i.e. raise the damage die on rune-etched weapons while the power is active. Applying the effect directly from the power does nothing (no effect code in brackets included).
Adding an effect with "[Damage +1d]" does nothing. Damage rolls are unaffected and the roll result in the chat window doesn't mention the effect. Tried a few combinations with specified damage type and prefixes, but the result is the same.
Adding "[Damage +1]" in the same effect works fine. +1 is added to rolled damage and the effect is included in the result information in the chat window.

So, here's the question: Am I missing something in the syntax of the effect or do I need to create sub-attacks for the hexslinger's weapons?
I've used the second option before, but it would be really nice to have the effect activated from the "Ammo Whammy" power and have it time out when the power duration ends.
Any and all input appreciated!

[Jiminimonka]

You should add an effect to the weapon like [>Extra Ranged Damage +2d] or create a sub-attack for the weapon named Bear Effect with the extra dice in the damage box.

[PikeWake]

Right, and thank you for the reply.
I understand that I can add the effect to the weapon or create a sub-attack, but is there any way to get a temporary effect based on the power ("Ammo Whammy" in this case)?
In other words: can I apply an effect to a character that increases the damage dice? What confuses me is that I can create an effect that adds a fixed number to all damage rolled by a character (e.g. [Damage +1]), but not one that increases the die of damage rolls (e.g. [Damage +1d]).

[Jiminimonka]

Right, and thank you for the reply.
I understand that I can add the effect to the weapon or create a sub-attack, but is there any way to get a temporary effect based on the power ("Ammo Whammy" in this case)?
In other words: can I apply an effect to a character that increases the damage dice? What confuses me is that I can create an effect that adds a fixed number to all damage rolled by a character (e.g. [Damage +1]), but not one that increases the die of damage rolls (e.g. [Damage +1d]).

If it adds damage to everything then [Extra: Damage =2d] would work. =1d is a d4, =2d is a d6 etc.

[Jiminimonka]

https://fantasygroundsunity.atlassian.net/wiki/spaces/FGCP/pages/996643800/Savage+Worlds+Effects

https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?72619-List-of-Undocumented-SWADE-Ruleset-Features

These provide a lot of information on Effects (including the latest changes)

[PikeWake]

Thanks again.
I read the information you linked before posting and unfortunately it didn't help.
I'm starting to think that what I'm trying to do won't work, and maybe I'm confusing things by referring to the specific power in DLWW.
I'm not trying to add extra damage or extra damage dice (which works fine with "[Extra: ...]")
The general case is that a character has a weapon that does, for example, 2d6+1 damage. The character also has a power that increases the damage die of weapon attacks (specific ones, but that doesn't matter here). So, with a successful use of that power the weapon damage would be increase one die type (to 2d8+1 in this example), for five rounds or however long the power lasts.
It would be convenient to just keep track of that effect like any other effect from powers, but I guess I'll have to go back to creating sub-attacks and hope the players remember to keep track of the effect duration and click the right one.

[Mike Serfass]

There's no effect that increases the damage a die type. You'll have to use sub attacks.

[Jiminimonka]

That is what sub-attacks are for, to cover the bases effects don't.

[PikeWake]

Thank you both for your answers.
As I suspected, what I was trying to do won't work, but there are workarounds (sub-attacks).

Apart from that, two things come to mind:

First, it would be great if the effects documentation would mention that the "(x)d" modifier won't work in expressions like "[Damage +1d]". The examples are great, but some "negative" examples would help a lot to avoid confusion when trying out new effects.

The other thing is the fact that sub-attacks workaround only "works" to a point. Powers modifying weapon attacks (like "Ammo Whammy") are good examples. Apart from the automation benefits of having the effect activate and time out with the power, there is the issue of multiple effects.

If you just have a single effect affecting your weapon attacks at a time, sub-attacks work great. Just add one sub-attack for every effect. The problem is that characters like Hexslingers in DLWW may have multiple effects, and to get full automation you would need a sub-attack for every possible combination. Even if the effect of a power is just on or off (not increased by raises or extra power points) the number of sub-attacks would be the factorial of powers that could affect the attack simultaneously, i.e. three possible active powers would need six sub-attacks, four would need 24, five 120 and so on.
In those cases sub-attacks aren't practical and you are probably better off calculating modifiers, attack rolls and damage rolls separately and skip automation.
I know that effects applied to the character can help a a lot, but effects that could be applied to a character's equipped weapons would get rid of this problem entirely.

[Jiminimonka]

Thank you both for your answers.
As I suspected, what I was trying to do won't work, but there are workarounds (sub-attacks).

Apart from that, two things come to mind:

First, it would be great if the effects documentation would mention that the "(x)d" modifier won't work in expressions like "[Damage +1d]". The examples are great, but some "negative" examples would help a lot to avoid confusion when trying out new effects.

The other thing is the fact that sub-attacks workaround only "works" to a point. Powers modifying weapon attacks (like "Ammo Whammy") are good examples. Apart from the automation benefits of having the effect activate and time out with the power, there is the issue of multiple effects.

If you just have a single effect affecting your weapon attacks at a time, sub-attacks work great. Just add one sub-attack for every effect. The problem is that characters like Hexslingers in DLWW may have multiple effects, and to get full automation you would need a sub-attack for every possible combination. Even if the effect of a power is just on or off (not increased by raises or extra power points) the number of sub-attacks would be the factorial of powers that could affect the attack simultaneously, i.e. three possible active powers would need six sub-attacks, four would need 24, five 120 and so on.
In those cases sub-attacks aren't practical and you are probably better off calculating modifiers, attack rolls and damage rolls separately and skip automation.
I know that effects applied to the character can help a a lot, but effects that could be applied to a character's equipped weapons would get rid of this problem entirely.

What type of effect would be useful on a characters equipped weapon? I am not familiar with DLWW or Hexslingers.

[Jiminimonka]

I just pinged Ikael about adding a [Damage +1d] [>Damage +1d] effect to the system.