Website refresh

[ddavison]

We just refreshed the website. This is the first thing Adam Bradford wanted to tackle after he joined the company, so we took advantage of his enthusiasm and energy to strike while the iron was hot.

It gives a great example of Adam’s vision and skill when it comes to polish. What you didn’t see was how much effort he pours into his work and how easy he is to work with.

We have new stuff planned out already to tackle next. We are looking forward to revealing those in the coming weeks and months.

[Zacchaeus]

It's very nice indeed. I did notice that there wasn't a link to the suggestions page any more in any of the dropdowns. This, of course, may be deliberate.

[ddavison]

This is added back now under Support > Feature Requests.

[Muagen]

New landing page is chef's-kiss. Good stuff, and I *really* like the new Fantasy Grounds logo!

[dmbrown]

Site looks great, can’t wait to see the changes to the app.

[Jiminimonka]

Looking good!

[Griogre]

Looks super nice :D

[Thelgor]

Nice new look. Will the FGU logos be changing in the near future?

Show-your-love-of-Fantasy-Grounds (https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?12523-Show-your-love-of-Fantasy-Grounds)

[Samzagas]

I must say it's a welcomed change this new look, I really like it, it looks modern and professional.
The only thing I'm missing is being able to see what was the latest addition to the art pack, the currently style displays the sheer ammount of content included but as a subscriber I'd like to see what's new when it comes out. Perhaps it just needs like a "new" label on the latest item or something similar.

[similarly]

WOW! I love the new look. Outstanding!

[Dakadin]

Why isn't Rolemaster listed as one of the systems on the home page?!?

[Judgecat]

Brilliant Well done

[Egheal]

Very nice and modern. I would have listed all the officially available rulesets on this page not just a bunch of them though.

[Omalus]

Just wanted to say, really like the new website look. Great job!

[dendarii]

Looks amazing! The new logo is very appealing.

[bayne7400]

We lost links to many supported games. Did it get removed or moved?

[spoofer]

It now appears as if FG supports much fewer game systems than it actually does. That is unfortunate. There should be some way to easily show the full list of supported games, such as OSE, World of Darkness, Shadowdark, Shadow of the Demon Lord, Vaesen, etc.

[dmbrown]

It appears that a number of Vampire items are missing from the Worlds of Darkness section, including the main ruleset.

[dmbrown]

Very nice and modern. I would have listed all the officially available rulesets on this page not just a bunch of them though.
I agree with this.

[viresanimi]

It looks great!

[sjard]

Any chance of a light mode for those of us with astigmatism? I get maybe 3 minutes on a dark mode sight before I'm effectively blind for an hour or more.

[DaddieCat]

Such an improvement. Looking forward to seeing what else is coming.

[Atarsamak]

It now appears as if FG supports much fewer game systems than it actually does. That is unfortunate. There should be some way to easily show the full list of supported games, such as OSE, World of Darkness, Shadowdark, Shadow of the Demon Lord, Vaesen, etc.

I think you can find them by clickin on Download -> Browse available rulesets from the top menu.
I believe that the new website looks way more modern and professional and it makes sense to have on th front page only the most common rulesets (as long as all the others can be easily reached for those interested).

Now I hope FGU receives a similar "refurbishment" although I guess it's not easy and could take much time. I own both FGU Ultimate and Foundry VTT but, up to now, I opted to use FGU partly because of the automation (although that's not much important to me) and partly because of the official support by WotC. Now that also Foundry VTT has such a support, I find myself thinking whether to stay with FGU or switch to Foundry. I guess the new D&D edition will be my sliding door.

Anyway, the work done on FGU over the years is really impressive. I hope it will take this opportunity to stay "up to date" on every aspect.

[Meteoro]

I'm a recent user of FGU, so I was browsing the site to see all the modules available, and it was right when you updated the site, it was like changing from water to wine. I was shocked because I thought I had clicked on something wrong haha. It's excellent! Smells like a new car haha ​​Great work 🎉

[bayne7400]

I think you can find them by clickin on Download -> Browse available rulesets from the top menu.
I believe that the new website looks way more modern and professional and it makes sense to have on th front page only the most common rulesets (as long as all the others can be easily reached for those interested).

Now I hope FGU receives a similar "refurbishment" although I guess it's not easy and could take much time. I own both FGU Ultimate and Foundry VTT but, up to now, I opted to use FGU partly because of the automation (although that's not much important to me) and partly because of the official support by WotC. Now that also Foundry VTT has such a support, I find myself thinking whether to stay with FGU or switch to Foundry. I guess the new D&D edition will be my sliding door.

Anyway, the work done on FGU over the years is really impressive. I hope it will take this opportunity to stay "up to date" on every aspect.


Good find, although it is still missing some available rulesets.

[Giggles666]

Nice and shiny for 2024.

[JohnD]

You generally don't make sales by hiding your products. Show all the rulesets please.

[Sulimo]

Not sure if it was intended, but when logging into the forums (from a forum page), after login it redirects back to the main page instead of the page you came from (mildly annoying).

[HywelPhillips]

You generally don't make sales by hiding your products. Show all the rulesets please.

The new layout is a great improvement in general, but on this specific point I must agree. Show all the rulesets.

Cheers, Hywel

[Dakadin]

I will say as a community developer when I first saw that the ruleset I've worked on for over a decade wasn't listed it got me thinking that maybe I should be spending my free time doing something else. I know it isn't a big seller but it was disappointing from my point of view and has me serious considering moving on from being a developer for FG.

[Shandorf]

The website looks totally cool and professional! On the page where the prices of the licenses are listed where you have both the monthly price and the one time price, some may take it as an upfront cost for the license AND an additional monthly fee to keep playing. Might be better to put an "or" between the two prices. Otherwise, I think the site looks better than the other VTT websites out there. Nice job, Doug!

[LordEntrails]

I will agree that all of the rulesets should be easily accessible. But I also understand the problem with listing them all on the homepage. It's easy to overwhelm people with options and information. IMO, make an obvious link "15 more rulesets, details here" or "See all 492 rulesets here!" or such. But I tend to agree to not have them all on the homepage.

[deer_buster]

Nah, if Smiteworks is going to make the assumption that my favorite game is one of the 16 listed, then I am "assuming" that they don't support my game. Either make EVERYONE go to a page that lists all the official ones, or don't list any

[damned]

The main reason FG users try another VTT is to play a game system not supported on FG.
New buyers are not going to buy when their game system isnt available and it is somewhere else.
I would strongly prefer to see 492 rulesets all listed.

[LordEntrails]

Remember, the website refresh is not designed for us. It's designed for the 99% of the RPG community that does not use FG, and the 85% of those who do not use any VTT. (percentages made up!) I would suggest one of the values Adam brings is a different perspective than those we all currently have. I think we should all be open to change knowing the intent is to make things better for all by changing how FG is perceived outside of us FG advocates.
Edit: but this does not mean we should not voice our opinions, re-reading my post, I fear such could have been construed.

[BadEye]

Hello everyone - I'll jump in and start by sharing that this is step 0.5 of a big, adventurous journey. We're not going to be able to snap our fingers and have everything done in an instant (although we did crank out a new website in less than a week, so let's see what we can do).


I will agree that all of the rulesets should be easily accessible. But I also understand the problem with listing them all on the homepage. It's easy to overwhelm people with options and information. IMO, make an obvious link "15 more rulesets, details here" or "See all 492 rulesets here!" or such. But I tend to agree to not have them all on the homepage.

We won't have every single ruleset we support on the homepage, mainly for the reason you mention here (we didn't have all the systems we support on the homepage before the site refresh either, by the way since it seems like in this thread that's being misunderstood), but we will end up with a dedicated "Games / Systems" page that has them all that will be accessible from the "Browse All Games" button at the bottom of the abbreviated homepage section. That page will have ALL games and will take some time to compile, hence the transitional period here where that button takes you to the store where you can access every product for every game.



Nah, if Smiteworks is going to make the assumption that my favorite game is one of the 16 listed, then I am "assuming" that they don't support my game. Either make EVERYONE go to a page that lists all the official ones, or don't list any
That feels dramatic. As I mention above, we'll have a page that actually shows all of the game systems (since before according to your logic, we were assuming that your favorite was in the 33 that were listed and not the other systems that were missing from that list). We're simplifying the list of systems on the homepage itself, but we'll end up with a place that is actually comprehensive.


The main reason FG users try another VTT is to play a game system not supported on FG.
New buyers are not going to buy when their game system isnt available and it is somewhere else.
I would strongly prefer to see 492 rulesets all listed.
This also doesn't make complete sense to me, as no VTT lists every system they support on their homepage - that kind of full list happens elsewhere in the store or another page of the site, which is what we already do (in the store) and will end up with as well (on a dedicated page). And one more time for effect, the site two days ago didn't list every system we support either.



Now I hope FGU receives a similar "refurbishment" although I guess it's not easy and could take much time.
It absolutely will - that will be several steps in our upcoming adventurous journey. We're looking forward to rolling that out and we'll share more as we get there.


Such an improvement. Looking forward to seeing what else is coming.

Can't wait!

61083

[BadEye]

Remember, the website refresh is not designed for us.
I'm not sure who the "us" here is, but we have received positive feedback about the site refresh beyond expectations already, so it is seemingly resonating with current FGU fans as well.

The feedback about roughly half the games that were previously listed on the homepage no longer being listed is a valid question to raise - and as I shared in the last post, the reasons were 1) we need to simplify for all the new fans that are going to be coming to Fantasy Grounds for the first time, 2) the previous homepage didn't list them all anyway, and 3) we want to end up with a completely comprehensive /games page that does indeed list them all.

Keep any and all feedback coming. We'll monitor all of it and make adjustments as needed. It's also great to hear the positive impressions, as that validates the direction we're heading, so keep that coming too!

[BadEye]

The website looks totally cool and professional! On the page where the prices of the licenses are listed where you have both the monthly price and the one time price, some may take it as an upfront cost for the license AND an additional monthly fee to keep playing. Might be better to put an "or" between the two prices.
Much appreciated - and this is a good callout. I agree and that's been updated.


Thanks!

[Dakadin]

I'm not sure who the "us" here is, but we have received positive feedback about the site refresh beyond expectations already, so it is seemingly resonating with current FGU fans as well.

The feedback about roughly half the games that were previously listed on the homepage no longer being listed is a valid question to raise - and as I shared in the last post, the reasons were 1) we need to simplify for all the new fans that are going to be coming to Fantasy Grounds for the first time, 2) the previous homepage didn't list them all anyway, and 3) we want to end up with a completely comprehensive /games page that does indeed list them all.

Keep any and all feedback coming. We'll monitor all of it and make adjustments as needed. It's also great to hear the positive impressions, as that validates the direction we're heading, so keep that coming too!

So if you only want to show 16 rulesets on the home page why have 2 rulesets for D&D and Pathfinder. Couldn't you show the different versions like you do in the top right for those systems by combining them? That would also allow combining the 2 Savage Worlds and Traveller editions.

I am also curious how the 16 were chosen. Some of them are very obvious but a couple aren't to me so more insight into it would be helpful.

I will say the Browse All Games button should default to the Ruleset filter and not just take you to the store in general if you are listing it under the rulesets. Maybe it requires another button for rulesets in particular like you mentioned.

[Jiminimonka]

So if you only want to show 16 rulesets on the home page why have 2 rulesets for D&D and Pathfinder. Couldn't you show the different versions like you do in the top right for those systems by combining them? That would also allow combining the 2 Savage Worlds and Traveller editions.

I am also curious how the 16 were chosen. Some of them are very obvious but a couple aren't to me so more insight into it would be helpful.

I will say the Browse All Games button should default to the Ruleset filter and not just take you to the store in general if you are listing it under the rulesets. Maybe it requires another button for rulesets in particular like you mentioned.

Bad Eye said that eventually it will.open to all rulesets.but its a WIP.

[HywelPhillips]

A link to a page showing all rulesets would answer my criticism just fine; seems perfectly sensible to list top sellers or top-by-games-played on the main page and the rest on a click through page.

Cheers, Hywel

[spoonhead]

Just went to the new store page. One thing that is annoying, not all products show the ruleset they are for, unless I click into the product itself. It would be nice to see the ruleset before I click.

[Nylanfs]

Very nice!

[damned]

This also doesn't make complete sense to me, as no VTT lists every system they support on their homepage - that kind of full list happens elsewhere in the store or another page of the site, which is what we already do (in the store) and will end up with as well (on a dedicated page). And one more time for effect, the site two days ago didn't list every system we support either.61083

That is I suppose fair.
The site did however have twice as many games listed on the front page previously as opposed to 16 now.
Right now it takes a minimum of 4 clicks to find the other officially supported games - and that is if you know what you are looking for and know that games are called rulesets. And there is no obvious link to Forge rulesets (some of which are official/licensed) from there either.
The current Browse all games button does not take you to more games but to the catalogue as presented by the algorithm (newest releases, best sellers and current sale items?).
A suggestion - with the new listing format you can probably fit more titles per page.

Please note - I do think the new pages do look great.

Oh and DNDB :ninja: and Alchemy list all their games or at least publishers on the front page.

[indavis]

Here is my suggestion. Where the 16 games are listed under "Your Favorite Games" have this be the image of a rotating cube like a giant 6 sided die, where after 20 or 30 seconds it will spin to another side with other games listed. Have buttons to where you can flip back and forth between sides. Possibly have the first side be a defined set, and after it spins some other random rulesets populate the side.

Now, I clicked on "Browse all games", then typed in Vaesen, and and I get 4 items, but at the bottom is "[Prev] Page 1 of 1 [Next]". It might be worth polishing this up to where the Prev and Next buttons aren't displayed on single page results.

I also think there could be a verbiage change. On the main page is "Your Favorite Games" which lists rulesets. At the top is a link to "Find a Game" which my brain for a second thought might be another listing of rulesets. There might need to be a distinction at some point between games and games. I mean rulesets and people playing/tables. Just some food for thought.

[deer_buster]

Bad Eye said that eventually it will.open to all rulesets.but its a WIP.
That should have definitely been 1) announced in the initial post that the refresh was a WIP (it was presented as a website refresh, not a WIP, so quite a few of us assumed that it was a "complete" refresh), and/or 2) the browse all rulesets button should have either acted like Dakadin suggested, or if it is eventually going to go to another page that lists all the rulesets, it should have gone to that page with an "Under Construction" sign on it....

[deer_buster]

this "confusion" could have easily been avoided had the website been "previewed" by those curious to gather feedback before making it "live"

[deer_buster]

otherwise, I like the direction

[damned]

this "confusion" could have easily been avoided had the website been "previewed" by those curious to gather feedback before making it "live"

Not much progress is ever made by committee!

[deer_buster]

Not much progress is ever made by committee!

While I agree, in principle, I don't think that having a "preview" period would have slowed down progress, and indeed could have caught the main point being brought up before it went live.

[ddavison]

Thanks for the feedback everyone.

We will discuss and respond once we have a plan of action -- or like I often do, we will just make changes as we go and then announce them. I'm going to be traveling later this month, so I'm on a shortened schedule to get some important stuff done before I am away. I also wanted to strike while the iron was hot and get some major tasks knocked out as quickly as possible.

We do have a couple known issues about how we can surface other content in an effective manner. One of the strengths of FG is that we support a large # of systems and we also have Forge offerings. This also presents a major challenge on how we can make that easily presented without overwhelming new customers as well. We are also evaluating whether or not our older methods were effective at this as well. So far it doesn't seem like they were. Our hope is that we can do so in a better way and that will translate into more support for those systems that are great, but perhaps not as popular.

[BadEye]

So if you only want to show 16 rulesets on the home page why have 2 rulesets for D&D and Pathfinder. Couldn't you show the different versions like you do in the top right for those systems by combining them? That would also allow combining the 2 Savage Worlds and Traveller editions.

The D&D and Pathfinder editions / versions were separated specifically because Fantasy Grounds still sees significant usage for D&D Classic and Pathfinder 1e, and it was determined to be important to highlight both are available in addition to the newer versions.


I am also curious how the 16 were chosen. Some of them are very obvious but a couple aren't to me so more insight into it would be helpful.
A variety of factors - sales, variety of genres, experimentation to see what "works" best on the homepage, etc. That list is a starting point that could be dynamic over time (or perhaps not if we see the data shows what is there is effective for the purpose that section is there for).


Just went to the new store page. One thing that is annoying, not all products show the ruleset they are for, unless I click into the product itself. It would be nice to see the ruleset before I click.

Sure - this is something we'll evaluate. Part of the consolidation / streamlining of the products listing was pairing down to are core of information and then seeing through feedback if there was anything else that was important for people to see.


That is I suppose fair.
The site did however have twice as many games listed on the front page previously as opposed to 16 now.
Right now it takes a minimum of 4 clicks to find the other officially supported games - and that is if you know what you are looking for and know that games are called rulesets. And there is no obvious link to Forge rulesets (some of which are official/licensed) from there either.
The current Browse all games button does not take you to more games but to the catalogue as presented by the algorithm (newest releases, best sellers and current sale items?).
A suggestion - with the new listing format you can probably fit more titles per page.

As I and Doug mentioned, we'll be doing additional work on the overall presentation of products and discoverability in the store that would address most of this.


Oh and DNDB :ninja: and Alchemy list all their games or at least publishers on the front page.

Pretty sure we could list all our games / publishers on the homepage if we only had one or a handful too. :) We have considerably more than that and need to go another route.


That should have definitely been 1) announced in the initial post that the refresh was a WIP (it was presented as a website refresh, not a WIP, so quite a few of us assumed that it was a "complete" refresh), and/or 2) the browse all rulesets button should have either acted like Dakadin suggested, or if it is eventually going to go to another page that lists all the rulesets, it should have gone to that page with an "Under Construction" sign on it....

Web / software development works differently than this - everything is always under construction, and we'll continue to iterate to make improvements continually. In that process, we won't be releasing things that don't work (at least not on purpose, accounting for the occasional bug), but things might not be in their final form since that iterative process is always there. We'll always monitor feedback and make adjustments as needed, but we also want to take action to make those improvements and will keep moving forward.

###

Thanks all - much more to come!

[BaneTBC]

One request is can we get it so that when we log in that it returns us to the page we were viewing, versus being an absolute redirect back to the home page? Outside that, like the refresh and can't wait to see what comes next.

[Griogre]

My biggest feedback is in the store bundles. It's hard to see at first which products you already have. The only way of telling is the "Download" button graphic which is small and at the bottom right (last thing to read). I'd suggest instead you do an "Owned" banner in the left top corner (for left to right languages) or a large font simi-transparent "Own" with background diagonal across the product image.

Edit: Now I think about it a big green simi-transparent check mark with Own under it is better than the diagonal "Own".

[Griogre]

Also for those who don't know, one of the biggest criticisms on Steam that turned people off was the list of all 3,175 paid DLC. Now DLC does have a different connotation than RPG types, but that list on steam is awkward (and Smiteworks did add some better search tools).

I'd suggest the top sellers / played games on the landing page to assure people that FG can handle some of the best known games, a link to all of the different RPGs, also verbiage to explain how FG can be used generically for systems without a ruleset and a rotating group of the other systems that didn't make the landing page.

[deer_buster]

Web / software development works differently than this - everything is always under construction, and we'll continue to iterate to make improvements continually. In that process, we won't be releasing things that don't work (at least not on purpose, accounting for the occasional bug), but things might not be in their final form since that iterative process is always there. We'll always monitor feedback and make adjustments as needed, but we also want to take action to make those improvements and will keep moving forward.

I am actually a software engineer/web developer for a major corporation. Public-facing web pages are never "always under construction", at least not the released to production versions of them. They are meticulously tested from a UI/UX, content completeness, and legal perspective before they are released for public consumption. Failure to do so can easily lead to potential regulatory (license to operate), legal, reputation, or loss of business issues.

As you are "probably" less likely to face regulatory or legal issues due to invalid/incorrect information (unless you say it is one price, but charge more, for example), but you do have to deal with reputation and loss of business issues.

[deer_buster]

Also for those who don't know, one of the biggest criticisms on Steam that turned people off was the list of all 3,175 paid DLC. Now DLC does have a different connotation than RPG types, but that list on steam is awkward (and Smiteworks did add some better search tools).

I'd suggest the top sellers / played games on the landing page to assure people that FG can handle some of the best known games, a link to all of the different RPGs, also verbiage to explain how FG can be used generically for systems without a ruleset and a rotating group of the other systems that didn't make the landing page.

Yeah, I don't purchase my FG content from Steam, one of the reasons being that the Steam DLC listings are akin to word-vomit. Nothing logically sorted. Leaves a LOT to be desired.

[ddavison]

One request is can we get it so that when we log in that it returns us to the page we were viewing, versus being an absolute redirect back to the home page? Outside that, like the refresh and can't wait to see what comes next.

This is what I was trying to do, but vbulletin was not cooperating with this. I will see if I can get that working within their system. It's easy to redirect on a basic level in webpages, but the issue is how to get it to work through vbulletin's system of hooks.

[deer_buster]

This is what I was trying to do, but vbulletin was not cooperating with this. I will see if I can get that working within their system. It's easy to redirect on a basic level in webpages, but the issue is how to get it to work through vbulletin's system of hooks.

Another thing I would like to see, is a consistent page header regardless of where you are (e.g. the header on the forums is different than the one from the home page/store, etc.)

[deer_buster]

Also, even though I am signed in, it still offers a "SIGN IN/REGISTER" button on the home page.

[Jiminimonka]

Where is the Order Pizza Button?

[Egheal]

Indeed, 20 years and still no Order Pizza Button. disappointing.

[BadEye]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts deer_buster - I think there's some context missing in the rough cut of the philosophies that would be tough to cover in the Forums, but I will assert that we are committed to making not only the website, but all of Fantasy Grounds, better and better, and we're going to keep heading down that path.


My biggest feedback is in the store bundles. It's hard to see at first which products you already have. The only way of telling is the "Download" button graphic which is small and at the bottom right (last thing to read).

This was already on the list and almost finished when you posted this. Pushed live just now:

61086

Thanks!

[JohnD]

Also for those who don't know, one of the biggest criticisms on Steam that turned people off was the list of all 3,175 paid DLC. Now DLC does have a different connotation than RPG types, but that list on steam is awkward (and Smiteworks did add some better search tools).

I'd suggest the top sellers / played games on the landing page to assure people that FG can handle some of the best known games, a link to all of the different RPGs, also verbiage to explain how FG can be used generically for systems without a ruleset and a rotating group of the other systems that didn't make the landing page.

To be fair, I personally think that a good portion of those people were being deliberately obtuse and/or trolling. Imagine thinking you need to by a SWADE module when you're playing Rolemaster because "I need all the DLC to enjoy the game"... and then stubbornly not listening to people telling you the inherent problem with this approach.

That said, it seems foolish, to me at least, to hide one of the strongest selling points of the platform behind a bunch of additional clicks... if the potential customer even knows what they're trying to find. Personally I'd see the 16 listed and figure that Castles and Crusades or Rolemaster aren't supported and move on, but that's me.

[Nick Frost]

I feel like pointing out that the other two of the "Big Three VTTs" show way less systems on their main pages, one of them lists 4 and the other 0...

[deer_buster]

I feel like pointing out that the other two of the "Big Three VTTs" show way less systems on their main pages, one of them lists 4 and the other 0...

I'd rather see 0 than only a limited few. Showing 0 tells me that it is probably listed somewhere. Showing a limited number tells me (incorrectly in this case) that those are the only ones supported. Having me click a link that takes me to a page that I can filter by name, or popularity, or whatever, allows me to look at not only what I came to find, but also tells me that "hey, this platform is pretty inclusive in its support, maybe I'll really give it a go"

[AlterZwerg]

Very much appreciated!
It may not be final and it may not be perfect to everyone’s liking - but I surely welcome the much needed fresh air that’s being brought to FG.
Sorely needed and I’m looking forward to the things that are coming to the client.

[Jiminimonka]

I'd rather see 0 than only a limited few. Showing 0 tells me that it is probably listed somewhere. Showing a limited number tells me (incorrectly in this case) that those are the only ones supported. Having me click a link that takes me to a page that I can filter by name, or popularity, or whatever, allows me to look at not only what I came to find, but also tells me that "hey, this platform is pretty inclusive in its support, maybe I'll really give it a go"

Way over thinking this.

The website has just improved in appearance massively, and will continue to improve functionality as well. In steps.

More happened this week than in a long while.

Having a single page with how many rulesets (did damned say 492??) on it will not attract anyone's attention, it will look like a mess - especially on a tablet or mobile phone.

[Jiminimonka]

What you could have is the 16 rulesets on the home page cycle through the rulesets on page refresh - with the big 3 always show and then the other 13 buttons cycle thru Forge and Store rulesets, and have a button that has SHOW ALL RULESETS on it in big shiny letters.

[damned]

Way over thinking this.

The website has just improved in appearance massively, and will continue to improve functionality as well. In steps.

More happened this week than in a long while.

Having a single page with how many rulesets (did damned say 492??) on it will not attract anyone's attention, it will look like a mess - especially on a tablet or mobile phone.

I did say 492. I was being a little obtuse. It would be great if FG had 492 systems it supported.

[Jiminimonka]

I did say 492. I was being a little obtuse. It would be great if FG had 492 systems it supported.

Phew!

[Dakadin]

FYI in the Customers Also Bought section it seems to be listing everything with the Owned icon or at least is doing some of them incorrectly.

[johnecc]

Actually, a filter by "Ruleset" shows 34 official, purchasable, rulesets.

FYI, @ddavison, 13th Age Ruleset does not have a thumbnail image.

A filter on the Forge for "Ruleset" shows 53 entries, however, not all of them are actually rulesets. Example, "Feature: Just The Clock Adjuster" shows up as a Ruleset, which it obviously is not, and there are numerous others.

[Kelrugem]

I really like the new look, thank you :) Looking forward to the new stuff coming in the future as well :)

[ju95]

Actually, a filter by "Ruleset" shows 34 official, purchasable, rulesets.

FYI, @ddavison, 13th Age Ruleset does not have a thumbnail image.

A filter on the Forge for "Ruleset" shows 53 entries, however, not all of them are actually rulesets. Example, "Feature: Just The Clock Adjuster" shows up as a Ruleset, which it obviously is not, and there are numerous others.

The Forge grabs any Forge item listed as a ruleset and adds it to the filter, so crafters can make extensions and adventures for Forge rulesets. If an item is incorrectly set as a ruleset please tell the crafter or let me know in the House of Healing - Forge subforum or on the Forge channel in the Discord

[Meteoro]

Hello everyone - I'll jump in and start by sharing that this is step 0.5 of a big, adventurous journey. We're not going to be able to snap our fingers and have everything done in an instant (although we did crank out a new website in less than a week, so let's see what we can do).



We won't have every single ruleset we support on the homepage, mainly for the reason you mention here (we didn't have all the systems we support on the homepage before the site refresh either, by the way since it seems like in this thread that's being misunderstood), but we will end up with a dedicated "Games / Systems" page that has them all that will be accessible from the "Browse All Games" button at the bottom of the abbreviated homepage section. That page will have ALL games and will take some time to compile, hence the transitional period here where that button takes you to the store where you can access every product for every game.



That feels dramatic. As I mention above, we'll have a page that actually shows all of the game systems (since before according to your logic, we were assuming that your favorite was in the 33 that were listed and not the other systems that were missing from that list). We're simplifying the list of systems on the homepage itself, but we'll end up with a place that is actually comprehensive.


This also doesn't make complete sense to me, as no VTT lists every system they support on their homepage - that kind of full list happens elsewhere in the store or another page of the site, which is what we already do (in the store) and will end up with as well (on a dedicated page). And one more time for effect, the site two days ago didn't list every system we support either.



It absolutely will - that will be several steps in our upcoming adventurous journey. We're looking forward to rolling that out and we'll share more as we get there.



Can't wait!

61083

It responded well to anxious people who don't understand anything about how complex it is to redesign a website and everything involved in the backend and functionalities. It's only been 2 days and they're already starting to publicize an apocalypse haha. It's the price you pay for getting people used to solving their problems with 1 click. They start to think that everything is done with 1 click! hahahaha ;)

[DustyLensCap42]

Great start too many changes soon to come! This makes me even more excited to see what Adam Bradford can bring. In less than two weeks it's truly excellent work from him, and the rest of the team at Smiteworks! Got me all excited for the future! I shout it out to my players, who may not feel as passionate but are also enthused.

[Moon Wizard]

@johnecc,

Just went through the items listed as Ruleset on the Forge, and reassigned the 8-10 that were miscategorized. It's showing 52 now; and they all seem to be rulesets. (Also, I might have a few more, since I see unlisted ones too.)

Regards,
JPG

[andrewcr]

The new website looks very modern - well done Adam and team - no rest for the inspired.

I didn't recognize the button to subscribe to the Fantasy Grounds mailing list - surprised it was so hidden as its a pretty powerful marketing tool.

[MrDDT]

Great job on the refresh.

Personally, I like it, however, I also don't care much about it other than I think others care. So if the people who don't currently have FGU care to like it (which I've heard only good things) I think its a huge win for FGU as a whole for me.

[Szabtom]

Very appealing and modern-looking, I like it. Great job!

[leozelig]

Great job! I love the clean, contemporary look. It looked like a product from the 90’s before. I also appreciate the updated pricing for licenses. Both of those were common criticisms from people who opt for competing products, so nice job Smiteworks!

[Kelrugem]

Not sure, if this is the suitable place to mention it, but I see that there is now an owned banner over the modules/packs I already purchased :) However, the dice packs I purchased do not have that banner, except the two dice packs recently gifted by Smiteworks (with hearts and skulls etc.) :) (Note: I purchased those dice packs on Steam; so maybe the owned banner only shows over modules and packs I directly purchased on the website? Though I linked my Steam account and so the Steam purchases also show in my order history :) )

[bmos]

Wow, it looks great! Maybe a forum update at some point too?
I see we are still on v4 and they're up to v6 already with over 15,000 changes (https://forum.vbulletin.com/forum/vbulletin-6/installation-upgrades/4484262-list-of-changes-and-improvements-over-vb5?p=4484264#post4484264) since v4.

[Nylanfs]

Not sure, if this is the suitable place to mention it, but I see that there is now an owned banner over the modules/packs I already purchased :) However, the dice packs I purchased do not have that banner, except the two dice packs recently gifted by Smiteworks (with hearts and skulls etc.) :) (Note: I purchased those dice packs on Steam; so maybe the owned banner only shows over modules and packs I directly purchased on the website? Though I linked my Steam account and so the Steam purchases also show in my order history :) )

DLC purchases aren't tracked between the stores, just the main licenses. It's one of the reasons people are advised if they want to complete a bundle to do it on one site.

[ddavison]

Not sure, if this is the suitable place to mention it, but I see that there is now an owned banner over the modules/packs I already purchased :) However, the dice packs I purchased do not have that banner, except the two dice packs recently gifted by Smiteworks (with hearts and skulls etc.) :) (Note: I purchased those dice packs on Steam; so maybe the owned banner only shows over modules and packs I directly purchased on the website? Though I linked my Steam account and so the Steam purchases also show in my order history :) )

That is correct. We don't show Steam purchases in our Store or vice versa. We encourage you to do your shopping on one location to avoid possible duplications and to benefit the most from Complete the Set bundle opportunities.

[BadEye]

Wow, it looks great! Maybe a forum update at some point too?
I see we are still on v4 and they're up to v6 already with over 15,000 changes (https://forum.vbulletin.com/forum/vbulletin-6/installation-upgrades/4484262-list-of-changes-and-improvements-over-vb5?p=4484264#post4484264) since v4.

We've talked about that recently, but we'll share more if we take that step to update the forums.

If you're looking for a theme closer to the site refresh while here, the "FG 2024" theme is close to done. While it's a WIP, you can select it from the dropdown in the bottom left of the page, and we'll do a default switchover once it's 100% ready (mobile responsive is the biggest thing that's still WIP at the moment).

[Kelrugem]

@Nylanfs, ddavison: Aaah, I recall that matter of fact now, thank you! :) Initially I was merely thinking "It shows in the order history, so it should get an owned banner", but I forgot that bundle completion etc. worked like how you just described :)

[deer_buster]

That is correct. We don't show Steam purchases in our Store or vice versa. We encourage you to do your shopping on one location to avoid possible duplications and to benefit the most from Complete the Set bundle opportunities.
Yet another reason to never use steam for FG.

[MrDDT]

Yet another reason to never use steam for FG.

A lot of the people outside the US use steam because of the conversion rates.

I never use steam because steam takes a cut and the reason posted here of seeing your stuff.

[Kelrugem]

Originally I also preferred the FG website. But then I moved to Taiwan and Steam is here not just much cheaper than the FG website, in Taiwan Steam payments just work out of the box with the Taiwan bank debit cards while for the FG website I'd need to get a special credit card just for that

(though now I finally found a way how to use Paypal here; however, Steam is still much cheaper in Taiwan :D)

[EdwinBonnar]

New site looks great! The only thing I miss is the section with the newest/hottest Forge selections. Would love to see that on the main page again.

[BadEye]

Hello everyone -

I wanted to mention a few updates in the last day or two with the site.

We'll still likely end up with a dedicated (and automated) /games page at some point, but in the meantime, I got a solution in there to display all our officially-licensed games / systems on the homepage with a carousel. Don't get too hung up on ordering or anything, as the list and placement will rotate depending on a variety of factors in the days to come. The key is all of them are there on the front page now, which is aa better spot than we were in even before the refresh.

We also have the Sign In / Register button only appearing in the main section now if you're not logged in, and a store button replacing it if you are.

And this one came from Discord, but if you happen to navigate to a product that isn't released yet in the store, there's a pretty clear label there now instead of just missing buttons.

Separately-but-related, we've done a pretty big pass this week on some brand unification with the overall refresh, so you should see the new look in most all of the places. The team has even covered a good bit of ground with product cover updates, etc. that we will continue to work through over time.

Up next for me, I'll turn my Eye of Sauron to the app a bit more, with things like a new default theme being among the first up on the list. We'll share more updates as we have them.

Thanks!

[Dakadin]

Hello everyone -

I wanted to mention a few updates in the last day or two with the site.

We'll still likely end up with a dedicated (and automated) /games page at some point, but in the meantime, I got a solution in there to display all our officially-licensed games / systems on the homepage with a carousel. Don't get too hung up on ordering or anything, as the list and placement will rotate depending on a variety of factors in the days to come. The key is all of them are there on the front page now, which is aa better spot than we were in even before the refresh.

We also have the Sign In / Register button only appearing in the main section now if you're not logged in, and a store button replacing it if you are.

And this one came from Discord, but if you happen to navigate to a product that isn't released yet in the store, there's a pretty clear label there now instead of just missing buttons.

Separately-but-related, we've done a pretty big pass this week on some brand unification with the overall refresh, so you should see the new look in most all of the places. The team has even covered a good bit of ground with product cover updates, etc. that we will continue to work through over time.

Up next for me, I'll turn my Eye of Sauron to the app a bit more, with things like a new default theme being among the first up on the list. We'll share more updates as we have them.

Thanks!

Thanks that helps.

[Egheal]

Awesome news, thanks.

[Saramund]

Brilliant news!
thank you

[Asgurgolas]

The new layout looks neat, but I personally dislike the fact that logging in the forum automatically redirects to the main webpage instead of the same forum/thread I was in, it's annoying to browse around to find where I was...

[GregRex]

I like the carousel! The 5e category is a nice touch.

[damned]

The new favicon looks great on dark mode but on normal browser mode it is quite washed out. Possibly you could put a dark ring around it?
Keep up the good work.

[Ecks]

Looks great, but I don’t see where to buy a license on the home page anymore. The link to compare licenses goes to a FAQ, but there’s no actual link to the store to get a license.

[BadEye]

Looks great, but I don’t see where to buy a license on the home page anymore. The link to compare licenses goes to a FAQ, but there’s no actual link to the store to get a license.
You caught us in the middle of an update, but you'll see them there now.

[deer_buster]

Hello everyone -

I wanted to mention a few updates in the last day or two with the site.

We'll still likely end up with a dedicated (and automated) /games page at some point, but in the meantime, I got a solution in there to display all our officially-licensed games / systems on the homepage with a carousel. Don't get too hung up on ordering or anything, as the list and placement will rotate depending on a variety of factors in the days to come. The key is all of them are there on the front page now, which is aa better spot than we were in even before the refresh.

We also have the Sign In / Register button only appearing in the main section now if you're not logged in, and a store button replacing it if you are.

And this one came from Discord, but if you happen to navigate to a product that isn't released yet in the store, there's a pretty clear label there now instead of just missing buttons.

Separately-but-related, we've done a pretty big pass this week on some brand unification with the overall refresh, so you should see the new look in most all of the places. The team has even covered a good bit of ground with product cover updates, etc. that we will continue to work through over time.

Up next for me, I'll turn my Eye of Sauron to the app a bit more, with things like a new default theme being among the first up on the list. We'll share more updates as we have them.

Thanks!
Much better :)

[Sulimo]

Agreed (https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?81690-Website-refresh&p=718718&viewfull=1#post718718), the more I have to deal with this, the more annoyed I'm getting about it. I figure by now over the entire user base it's got to be at man-days of time lost, of not man-weeks.

[deer_buster]

The new favicon looks great on dark mode but on normal browser mode it is quite washed out. Possibly you could put a dark ring around it?
Agree with this...

[BadEye]

Agree with this...

I did too - which is why it was already updated half an hour ago.

It might take a while for cache to clear in a few of the places.

[BadEye]

The new layout looks neat, but I personally dislike the fact that logging in the forum automatically redirects to the main webpage instead of the same forum/thread I was in, it's annoying to browse around to find where I was...

This should now be resolved - let us know if anyone still sees any strange login redirect behavior.

[indavis]

The new catalog list looks sweet!!

[damned]

I did too - which is why it was already updated half an hour ago.

It might take a while for cache to clear in a few of the places.

Looking good.

[Nylanfs]

Hello everyone -

I wanted to mention a few updates in the last day or two with the site.

We'll still likely end up with a dedicated (and automated) /games page at some point, but in the meantime, I got a solution in there to display all our officially-licensed games / systems on the homepage with a carousel.
<snip>

Thanks!

One thing that I think would be a good addition is an automated list of active games that could be pulled from the server pings. Doug generates a yearly report, occasionally :D, on games being run a break down of systems, and a bit of analysis of the info. While a lot of that was probably manually generated from the data. It would be a draw to have something automated that say updated like from the previous day. Nothing that has to be a big draw on the servers. Then new users could get a better idea of how active the user base is with a couple of graphs.

[deer_buster]

I did too - which is why it was already updated half an hour ago.

It might take a while for cache to clear in a few of the places.
Took a couple of days for it to update my favicon on my saved link, but it looks great now.

[LordEntrails]

One thing that I think would be a good addition is an automated list of active games that could be pulled from the server pings. Doug generates a yearly report, occasionally :D, on games being run a break down of systems, and a bit of analysis of the info. While a lot of that was probably manually generated from the data. It would be a draw to have something automated that say updated like from the previous day. Nothing that has to be a big draw on the servers. Then new users could get a better idea of how active the user base is with a couple of graphs.
Yea, Roll20 used to do there report too but have dropped it. I think Arkenforge is the only one that still talks about their growth with numbers. Transparency on numbers is an interesting business discussion. As a user, I would love to see how things play out. But I also know that from a traditional business perspective, it can be a sensitive topic. I do think that their are benefits to the company and community for knowing numbers, and hope to see them again. I just accept that some risk is involved and it needs to be approached int he right manner and a business decision needs to be made. (Which would be based on more than my desires or the information available to the community.)

[Jiminimonka]

Yea, Roll20 used to do there report too but have dropped it. I think Arkenforge is the only one that still talks about their growth with numbers. Transparency on numbers is an interesting business discussion. As a user, I would love to see how things play out. But I also know that from a traditional business perspective, it can be a sensitive topic. I do think that their are benefits to the company and community for knowing numbers, and hope to see them again. I just accept that some risk is involved and it needs to be approached int he right manner and a business decision needs to be made. (Which would be based on more than my desires or the information available to the community.)

I think he meant just showing how many games and what ruleset are playing live.

[Saramund]

Those who love FG wouldn't change their minds based on the number of played games, IMHO.
I think it is more reliable the number of threads (I would love to get a kind of closed as resolved status and a tagging system for better advanced search) for measuring how big is the community and the number of releases - not too few (no one is working on it anymore) and not too many (not stable and crash prone) and the quanity and quality of officially supported rulesets.
OT: a generative AI trained for FG community would give the best great impression ever to newcomers! (and not only them)

[Laerun]

Those who love FG wouldn't change their minds based on the number of played games, IMHO.
I think it is more reliable the number of threads (I would love to get a kind of closed as resolved status and a tagging system for better advanced search) for measuring how big is the community and the number of releases - not too few (no one is working on it anymore) and not too many (not stable and crash prone) and the quanity and quality of officially supported rulesets.
OT: a generative AI trained for FG community would give the best great impression ever to newcomers! (and not only them)

Agreed. Real data that is useful and not just essentially confirming that most users are playing the same top three rulesets. Good call.

[Xemit]

On the page above this, the icons for whomever has last posted are not the correct icons.

I mean the page: Forum \ General \ City Hall

And all like it.

[BadEye]

On the page above this, the icons for whomever has last posted are not the correct icons.

I mean the page: Forum \ General \ City Hall

And all like it.

I'm not following what you mean. Can you post a screenshot or share more information?

[Xemit]

Apparently I can't attach a picture.

On the page above this which lists all the message threads in City Hall. On the right columns it shows who was last to post a reply. Immediately to the left of their name used to be their forum avatar picture. Right now it is a random selection of like three icons.

The pop up tool tip for the avatar picture does indicate the same name as the right column, but it is not their icon.

Posted picture in Discord.

[deer_buster]

I'm not following what you mean. Can you post a screenshot or share more information?

We do not seem to have the ability to post a screenshot. But I *think* what they are referring to is the avatar icon of the last person that posted on a topic is wrong? Mine doesn't show up if I was the last person that posted...or is it the person that started the topic?

[BadEye]

Yeah, connected with them in Discord - we see that one level up from this the avatar image is the original poster and not the latest poster. We'll take a look when we get a chance and get it resolved.


Thanks for the report!

[deer_buster]

Yeah, connected with them in Discord - we see that one level up from this the avatar image is the original poster and not the latest poster. We'll take a look when we get a chance and get it resolved.


Thanks for the report!

I think the avatar image is the one that started the topic, but when you hover over it, it displays the name of the person that last posted in the topic.

[Vass_Dts]

On the page above this, the icons for whomever has last posted are not the correct icons.

I mean the page: Forum \ General \ City Hall

And all like it.

Yeah, that's actually not new. It's been like this for ages.

[Saramund]

I guess he's talking about the icon next to the name of the last who has commented a thread. the page he's referring to is the main page of the forum https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?37-City-Hall

[LordEntrails]

61155
Yep, been like this for as long as i can remember.

[LinWood2020]

Very impressed by the new look! Definitely an upgrade!!!

One question - I've noticed some of the modules in the store are now tagged with an "LOS" designation. What's that stand for?

[dmbrown]

It means Line of Sight on the maps

[Zacchaeus]

61155
Yep, been like this for as long as i can remember.

I don't see any icons at all and never have.

[dmbrown]

I really like the look of the new banners in the forum. Are you also redesigning the newsletter as I haven’t seen one in a while?

[BadEye]

Very impressed by the new look! Definitely an upgrade!!!

One question - I've noticed some of the modules in the store are now tagged with an "LOS" designation. What's that stand for?

Yeah, it is an indicator that the module has line of sight support. There is supposed to be a tooltip on hover, but it looks like it's not working and will get that fixed.



I really like the look of the new banners in the forum. Are you also redesigning the newsletter as I haven’t seen one in a while?

There's a lot of ground to cover, but yes, we will be working on updating visuals and branding top to bottom.

[MrDDT]

I don't see any icons at all and never have.

You can't see the icons on the far right in the screenshot?

[Zacchaeus]

You can't see the icons on the far right in the screenshot?

I've found them. I only ever use the New Posts button but I see if you look at the forum list there are icons on the right.

[JohnD]

My icon never shows up, have had one for 13 years. No idea why it doesn't.

[Egheal]

Using Chrome, on the first page of the store the search tool seems to be always fully visible.

https://i.postimg.cc/Z5pHVS6K/chrome-P7-Ip-QWSLd-E.png
Nice search engine btw.

https://postimg.cc/FYF0HwP2
https://postimg.cc/FYF0HwP2

[damned]

I am also seeing this...

[M0d1usPy]

I Am seeing this also, On Firefox. I've tried refreshing, clicking the drop down, advanced search and searching but it stays.

[BadEye]

My icon never shows up, have had one for 13 years. No idea why it doesn't.

The "forum search" option has been removed - there are too many limitations (things like only being able to search every 60 seconds). The "Site Search" option should still be available for you in the main menu of the forums. We're going to be polishing that search page in the near future.


Using Chrome, on the first page of the store the search tool seems to be always fully visible.

We'll take a look at that and get it fixed - thanks.

[anstett]

Not sure if this is possible, it would be a new 'function', but not a feature request.

Can the Art Packs be linked as Owned if we have an active subscription? It would eliminate any duplicates in a search, particularly for map packs.

[BadEye]

Not sure if this is possible, it would be a new 'function', but not a feature request.

Can the Art Packs be linked as Owned if we have an active subscription? It would eliminate any duplicates in a search, particularly for map packs.

Makes sense - we'll see what we can do.

[wndrngdru]

Makes sense - we'll see what we can do.

How about a "Part of Art Subscription" tag. Since I've actually purchased a portion of what the art sub covers, it would still be nice to see what I've already bought and what I haven't while subscribed.

[BadEye]

How about a "Part of Art Subscription" tag. Since I've actually purchased a portion of what the art sub covers, it would still be nice to see what I've already bought and what I haven't while subscribed.
This would be how we would go about it if we end up doing it, yes.

[Laerun]

To the Smiteworks Team,

I hope this message finds you well. I’d like to propose a useful enhancement for the Fantasy Grounds store, specifically regarding the art asset packs. It’s currently quite challenging to identify the specific assets included in each pack, making it difficult to choose the right one. To improve this, I suggest adding preview thumbnail images that clearly show what's inside each pack.

Here are the key points:

Art Asset Thumbnail Previews on Website:

1.) Each asset pack should have a preview thumbnail in the image carousel that shows a collage of the main assets included.
These thumbnails should follow a standardized, clear, and visually appealing format, helping users quickly understand the contents without needing detailed descriptions.

In-Game Previews:

2.) Asset packs should also include a thumbnail preview image accessible within Fantasy Grounds, providing an overview of all included assets.

3.) A feature allowing users to hover over or click on an asset pack to see a detailed preview would greatly enhance usability if doable.

Catalog Module?:

Maybe Develop a catalog module within Fantasy Grounds that lists all available asset packs with their preview images, updated regularly to include new releases.
Adding an option for users to filter and search for specific assets within the catalog would be very beneficial, especially for those who own multiple packs.

Labor considerations and potential Community Contributions:
If consistency is not an issue, perhaps allow users to submit their own preview images or reviews of asset packs, creating a more dynamic and user-driven experience.
Implementing a rating and comment system for asset packs could provide valuable feedback for both developers and users.
For example, if someone is looking for goblin assets, it would be incredibly helpful if they could easily tell which art packs include goblin assets.
Unless a user is intimately familiar with each and every asset pack, many of these assets can become lost and underutilized.
Implementing these suggestions would greatly improve the usability and user experience of the Fantasy Grounds store, making it easier for users to find and utilize the assets they need.

Thank you for considering this request.


Added a request here already, it's a bit challenging to link back to the actual vote.
https://www.fantasygrounds.com/featurerequests/featurerequests.php

[GregRex]

I was just poking around the Store and wanted to view specific publishers for a ruleset and realized I might not be the only one with this frustration...

Can we get a multi-select from the dropdown lists? Being limited to one filter at a time for each of the three dropdowns narrows my search too much.

Thanks!

[LordEntrails]

I was just poking around the Store and wanted to view specific publishers for a ruleset and realized I might not be the only one with this frustration...

Can we get a multi-select from the dropdown lists? Being limited to one filter at a time for each of the three dropdowns narrows my search too much.

Thanks!
I know these types of threads kind of confuse things, but the place that SmiteWorks has asked us to put feature requests (for the program, the website, the forge, etc) is in their Feature Request list here: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/featurerequests

[ddavison]

For sure. Please put it on the Feature Requests for website updates. I will add that the main reason we don't do this is because we want the search performance to be as quick as possible. We can have it do all sorts of things, but it is always a balance between how in demand a request is and how efficient we can make the search. The more we ask the search feature to do, the slower the site will become. A multi-publisher filter is not as bad as tokenized search terms, but it is still more than what it was doing before.

[deer_buster]

For sure. Please put it on the Feature Requests for website updates. I will add that the main reason we don't do this is because we want the search performance to be as quick as possible. We can have it do all sorts of things, but it is always a balance between how in demand a request is and how efficient we can make the search. The more we ask the search feature to do, the slower the site will become. A multi-publisher filter is not as bad as tokenized search terms, but it is still more than what it was doing before.

Yeah, but I don't think you're searching against 10s of millions of records. Any modern database can handle full-text search pretty well. Even a 10 second search result is going to be acceptable, but I can't imagine you have enough records to even cause that long a wait for the result, unless you have foundational data structure issues.

[ddavison]

We do a full text search already across the title and description. We don’t do a tokenized full text search.

We also join across order history and user tables to show owned status, across sales tables for scheduled sales, bundles, and several other tables. It’s a fairly complex query already. I’m not saying it can’t be done and can’t be done in a manner that still uses indexes efficiently. I’m just saying to put it on the wishlist to see how much demand there is for it before we consider adding even more requirements to an already complex query.

A 10 second search for a webpage is not really considered acceptable though. You get dinged in SEO for slow pages.