Fg support for d&d 6th edition dd. 17th september 2024

[*Neuro*]

Hello (from Italy!)

I have 2 quick questions:

Next 17th September there will be the release of the new edition of D&D. Support for this edition is confirmed as it has been till now for 5th edition?

If yes, does anyone know if adventure modules of 5th edition, in case of compatible systems, could be opened under the D&D 6th edition?

For example I buy the D&D 6th edition in Fantasy Grounds and then I want to open the module Dungeon of Mad Mage 5th Edition in it.


Any news?

Or maybe you have already discussed elsewhere?

Thanks

[Moon Wizard]

EDIT: See latest response.
https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?81683-Fg-support-for-d-amp-d-6th-edition-dd-17th-september-2024&p=723695&viewfull=1#post723695


I am working on the D&D (2024) ruleset in between other projects, with a goal of having it ready for September release with the official D&D PHB (2024).

As of right now based on the information I have;
* Player options records from D&D (2014) source books will NOT be compatible due to the restructuring of player creation rules in D&D (2024)
* Remaining record types, such as images, stories, NPCs, encounters, items, parcels, tables, etc. should be able to be automatically imported or adapted.

This means that our plan is that D&D (2014) adventures should continue to work without issues in either D&D (2014) or D&D (2024) versions. The caveat is that the work is not completed, so this is still work in progress and the code to perform the automatic migration has not been written yet.

We'll provide more information as we get closer, which will depend on other work in between now and then.

Regards,
JPG

[Laerun]

Player facing extensions, effects automation, and the character wizard will likely need to be rewritten or redone to be usable after the release this fall. Lots of work ahead potentially to maintain and simulate what's been built up in 5e this far in regards to community content, depending on what they do.

[Lazybones1969]

I saw that the preorders for the 5.5e books have been posted to the Smiteworks store. $30 per book, not too bad. DDB has a combined book/digital option for $180, but of course they have the advantage of being owned by WotC. I'll almost certainly get both versions; I especially like the alternative covers for the core books.

[njhiker]

So would players who want to use 2014 characters be able to mix with players using 2024 characters at the same FG table? I don’t mind having to redo a character sheet in a new 2024 ruleset but I know I have die hard fans of some classes/subclasses that would be tough to convince to move to a 2024 ruleset if 2014 weren’t available inside of it as well.

[Moon Wizard]

No; the rulesets will be completely separate for character creation. While the plan is to provide a path for adventures and bestiaries to be used from previous books, any character options from older books will not work and thus D&D (2014) characters won't be able to be built or levelled in the new ruleset.

Regards,
JPG

[njhiker]

Ok, great. Thanks - appreciate the quick answer.

[Dax Doomslayer]

Hi Moon,
Out of curiosity, is there a technological reason for not allowing character options from older books (specifically subclasses)? My understanding from what WotC stated, 2014 characters should be able to play side by side with the 2024 options. Obviously, they can't use any of the 2024 options and need to stay with the 2014 options but they are allowed to co-exist if needed (though most people will pick the new shiny more than likely)...

[Moon Wizard]

If you read the exact quotes from Jeremy Crawford, you see that he clarifies that all the characters would need to use the same rules to be balanced (i.e. new spells, new feats, etc.). So, it's sort of a hand-wave scenario for GMs.

Since the D&D 2024 character creation process is completely different and we're looking at trying to automate more of the character creation process to allow easier automation for homebrew and future changes; the old character code will not work with the older content. You're welcome to homebrew adapt the older character options content; it just won't work automatically.

Regards,
JPG

[Vass_Dts]

If you read the exact quotes from Jeremy Crawford, you see that he clarifies that all the characters would need to use the same rules to be balanced (i.e. new spells, new feats, etc.). So, it's sort of a hand-wave scenario for GMs.

Since the D&D 2024 character creation process is completely different and we're looking at trying to automate more of the character creation process to allow easier automation for homebrew and future changes; the old character code will not work with the older content. You're welcome to homebrew adapt the older character options content; it just won't work automatically.

Regards,
JPG
EDIT: I hadn't read the entire thread when I posted, so some of what I said were already mentioned, so I only have a question: Will it possible to load Tasha's or some of the other non-core books in 5e and have some rudimentary drag'n'drop capability? Or will we have to manually insert stuff from those?


The rest is my original post, which you may ignore.
They specifically said you can have 2014 PHB characters alongside 2024 PHB characters. I have timestamped the part that specifically explain this: https://youtu.be/WPBnLlqV0Z0?si=L4JE_yv5CY-2njdE&t=2008

Now, me personally, I don't mind if they are not part of the character wizard, but I figure it's important that we could still load 5e modules like Tasha's and still be able to at least drag'n'drop an Artificer. And the only reason I even say this, is because that is WotC's stated intent behind the new 2024 revision of 5e at the table, and I understand I may come off as a prick, but I'd kinda like my VTT to reflect the designer's vision.

Incidentally, that's also how WotC handled 4e Essentials, which itself was essentially (no pun intended) 4.5e.

[Moon Wizard]

Just to be clear, none of this is set in stone; but is based on how the books are shaping up based on the reading of the material. Also, some of these comments and first thoughts may change as we get closer to implementation. We'll be talking more internally as the system develops to make sure we have the best coverage without impacting the users as much as possible while keeping things manageable. It's definitely a balancing act. We'll have more to share as the PHB gets closer to launch; but we literally just got the preliminary book materials about a week ago.

Regards,
JPG

[Vass_Dts]

It's good to know that this is an evolving effort.

Understand that I completely understand the practical limitations (primarily those imposed by launch date time constraints) involved in such an undertaking. I'm just pointing out a few (or rather just one) aspect that I personally believe (and could be wrong) that would be important for many people thinking about making the jump to the 2024 rules (oh, let's call it what it is; it's 5.5 :P ).

[albrecd]

Do you expect it will be possible to migrate an existing 5e campaign to the new ruleset (minus the characters), or will this likely require creating a new campaign and manually moving content over?

[Zacchaeus]

Do you expect it will be possible to migrate an existing 5e campaign to the new ruleset (minus the characters), or will this likely require creating a new campaign and manually moving content over?

As far as we know at this time the ruleset will be new so you would need to start a new campaign with the new ruleset to get the functionality of the new ruleset. It may then be possible to copy the db.xml from an existing 5e campaign into that new campaign. But at this time that's speculation.

[Moon Wizard]

While we plan to allow the 5E modules to be loaded; my main concern with any sort of migration is that characters are built differently in the new version, and the new version ruleset will be focused on levelling/managing character data for new characters, not for characters built with old rules.

Regards,
JPG

[albrecd]

Yeah definitely not expecting character migration to make sense. Any campaign / story / maps that can be transferred would be great (so copying the database is probably what I'm looking for), but I get that it's going to be a fully different ruleset and that might not be possible.

Thank you both, and thanks for all of the work going into getting this ready for September!

[Lazybones1969]

Yeah I have held off on building my next campaign until the new ruleset is released. I've started sketching my ideas out in Word for now, and collecting various maps/images I plan on using. I think importing images and text-based story entries would probably work, but NPCs might be challenging to import because of the changes that WotC is making to the creature statblock format. And of course player characters are going to be completely different as noted above. I don't think I've seen any changes to how lighting, special forms of vision, and cover/line of effect work, but if any of that did change then those features would probably have to be redone in any maps brought over.

I assume that the ruleset will be available for the construction of new campaigns in September, although obviously the new magic items won't be available until November and monsters until next February. Presumably any SRD/basic rules wouldn't be posted until all three of those books are released, although I am not 100% certain about that.

[Laerun]

Yeah I have held off on building my next campaign until the new ruleset is released. I've started sketching my ideas out in Word for now, and collecting various maps/images I plan on using. I think importing images and text-based story entries would probably work, but NPCs might be challenging to import because of the changes that WotC is making to the creature statblock format. And of course player characters are going to be completely different as noted above. I don't think I've seen any changes to how lighting, special forms of vision, and cover/line of effect work, but if any of that did change then those features would probably have to be redone in any maps brought over.

I assume that the ruleset will be available for the construction of new campaigns in September, although obviously the new magic items won't be available until November and monsters until next February. Presumably any SRD/basic rules wouldn't be posted until all three of those books are released, although I am not 100% certain about that.

For the most part, NPCs are already accepted and incorporated into the Core 5e system. This happened with the Monsters of the Multiverse format. The changes are not too big stat block wise. The FG 5e importer tool works with legacy and newer MotM formatted NPC stat blocks. THe bigger changes are with player facing stuff.

[gorvidal]

Don't know if this would help or not but there is the Universal Module extension that Damned put on the forge
Here's the link to the Forge page: https://forge.fantasygrounds.com/shop/items/266/view

[Dax Doomslayer]

Hi Folks,
So I was just kind of curious where this ended up (or maybe it still a TBD). In light of everything indicated, it seems like existing D&D 5E subclasses may be used with D&D 5E 2024. Obviously, the progression for abilities would follow 2024 but those subclasses not redone in 2024 can be used. I'm not sure if this would be possible in FGU unless some sort of coversion of the subclasses following the general conversion rules takes place. To Moon Wizard's earlier point, existing PCs would need to be re-created. I guess my question is, if recreated under the D&D 2024 rules, would the subclass be made available from the existing books. For instance, if I had a Forge Cleric in D&D 2014 and wanted to use him in D&D 2024, by the rules, they say I can. If I recreate him in the new 2024 rules, would that option exist or is this basically, any previous 2014 subclasses can't be used unless you create them yourself? Thanks.

[Moon Wizard]

Yes, there has suddenly been a lot of hand-waving about how old content is now "backward compatible" with new content in ways they weren't talking about before. We've been switching gears internally to adapt where we can. With our current iteration, we'll be layering 2024 content directly into current ruleset, but having to add versions to each record type affected.

As for the "conversion" that they are talking about in the various interviews, it's much easier to hand-wave this stuff and just say to "fix it at the table", than it is to automate it. We'll look at what we can do to make this easier, instead of having to "fix it at the table".

Regards,
JPG

[Dax Doomslayer]

That's good news to hear but I do not envy this task! Thanks for the reply Moon!

[ProfDogg]

Willl there be an OGL (or equivalent version) set release with bare bones races, class, spells, etc? I'm holding out on converting as it gets dropped but I'd like to play around with how it all interacts (i.e. with older modules, etc) beforehand. Even without drag and drop options (I can always just create those myself), I can at least get the feel of what all it'd take to convert older stuff (assuming I have to do any).

[Zacchaeus]

Willl there be an OGL (or equivalent version) set release with bare bones races, class, spells, etc? I'm holding out on converting as it gets dropped but I'd like to play around with how it all interacts (i.e. with older modules, etc) beforehand. Even without drag and drop options (I can always just create those myself), I can at least get the feel of what all it'd take to convert older stuff (assuming I have to do any).

If it follows the 5e pattern then any OGL would be published a couple of years after the core rules. But really you'd need to direct that question at WotC.

[Nyarly Dude]

SRD 5.2 is supposed to be published "within weeks" of the official release of the Monster Manual in 2025, with CC-BY-4.0 licensing.

They haven't said much about what'll be in it, although with origin feats now being a standard thing rather than feats entirely being an optional rule you'd hope that there'd be more than just 'Grappler'.

( https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1717-2024-core-rulebooks-to-expand-the-srd -- May 2024, but I'm not aware of them issuing any later statements that would alter this )

[Moon Wizard]

To follow up on discussions on Discord, the original strategy I had outlined at beginning of thread was based on the initial information we received on a clear distinction between character material for 2014 vs. 2024. Based on additional information we got as well as a lot of changing of minds during subsequent interviews by the publisher, we pivoted to take a different approach.

Our current plan is that the 5E ruleset will remain in place; and all records affected by the rules changes will be marked as 2024 vs. 2014. This will flow into character creation as well.
(i.e. 2024 versions of classes will add 2024 version of spells and vice versa) As mentioned in this thread, we will be looking at the "cross-compatibility" handling between versions, but that may take a little longer.

Regards,
JPG

[cwsoots]

I've been following this thread out of curiosity and, while it is still somewhat TBD, I'm glad to hear this update. I have several campaigns in progress that I'm considering moving to the 2024 core rules, however, many of the characters have subclasses that are only available in the 2014 rules. My expectation, based on info from WotC, is that I can use the 2024 classes with the 2014 subclasses. I would hope that FGU makes it easy to do this as well. Thanks!

[Dintaur]

To follow up on discussions on Discord, the original strategy I had outlined at beginning of thread was based on the initial information we received on a clear distinction between character material for 2014 vs. 2024. Based on additional information we got as well as a lot of changing of minds during subsequent interviews by the publisher, we pivoted to take a different approach.

Our current plan is that the 5E ruleset will remain in place; and all records affected by the rules changes will be marked as 2024 vs. 2014. This will flow into character creation as well.
(i.e. 2024 versions of classes will add 2024 version of spells and vice versa) As mentioned in this thread, we will be looking at the "cross-compatibility" handling between versions, but that may take a little longer.

Regards,
JPG

Any and all updates on this matter would be highly appreciated as I have a streamed game using FGU that I am hoping to have both 2014 and 2024 content side by side as per the 2024 guidelines for doing this and I am hoping FGU will be able to follow suit. I'm sure this is a huge headache but if anyone can do it, the FGU team can!

[albrecd]

Thanks for the update! This sounds like it'll be super convenient for pre-existing campaigns!

[LordRichtor]

To the FGU Team, we saw yesterday, I believe, that DnDbeyond was removing all the digital content from the 2014 books for all spells and magic items. All of my purchased content is on this platform. I know reading the thread that the plan here seems to be to merge the two versions, but could something similar have to happen with FG’s content with regard to a full removal of that same data? It just seems to appear that WotC is forcing the move over to OneDnD, and this trend will follow as they move towards the new version of the Monster Manual next spring. Suddenly, “backwards compatible” doesn’t sound as likely.

[Moon Wizard]

As per my previous post, the older books will remain intact; and the new and old records will be displayed differently. No data will be removed

JPG

[LordRichtor]

Thank you and I’m so glad to hear it. I had seen that earlier in the thread but that other news was recent so just wanting to verify. Thanks for all the FG Team do!

[Tempered7]

As per my previous post, the older books will remain intact; and the new and old records will be displayed differently. No data will be removed

JPG

Another thank you is from me, because The Adventurer's Toolbox for solo play is for the current 5E ruleset. I'm guessing, until/IF the module is remade in 6th edition, the links to old info in 5E core books will remain the same.

I'm so glad I chose FGU over others.

[rhagelstrom]

For all you extension users, if you are thinking that you are going to run 2024 on day 1, expect all extensions to be in a broken state. Some may work but don't get your hopes up.

[Viepyr]

To the FGU Team, we saw yesterday, I believe, that DnDbeyond was removing all the digital content from the 2014 books for all spells and magic items. All of my purchased content is on this platform. I know reading the thread that the plan here seems to be to merge the two versions, but could something similar have to happen with FG’s content with regard to a full removal of that same data? It just seems to appear that WotC is forcing the move over to OneDnD, and this trend will follow as they move towards the new version of the Monster Manual next spring. Suddenly, “backwards compatible” doesn’t sound as likely.

Where did you see this information that WotC is removing all of the 2014 content from DnD Beyond? This is their most recent change log for July to September and does not mention anything about removing content from DnD Beyond. They were going to force a separation between the 2014 content and 2024 content by moving the 2014 content to the Homebrew section but have since recanted and are not moving forward with that idea. All 2014 content will be available on DnD Beyond but will have a Legacy tag next to it.

https://www.dndbeyond.com/changelog

[LordEntrails]

Where did you see this information that WotC is removing all of the 2014 content from DnD Beyond? This is their most recent change log for July to September and does not mention anything about removing content from DnD Beyond. They were going to force a separation between the 2014 content and 2024 content by moving the 2014 content to the Homebrew section but have since recanted and are not moving forward with that idea. All 2014 content will be available on DnD Beyond but will have a Legacy tag next to it.

https://www.dndbeyond.com/changelog
Originally DDB said that everything would be updated to 2024 and 2014 copies would not remain. But they quickly changed that when they got a lot of push back. You are right that now they are saying both 2014 and 2024 versions will remain.

[LordRichtor]

I just looked again, and they (again) may be backtracking but my Google search came right back to that they are preparing to remove all spells and and magic items from everyone's purchaced content ahead of the release of OneDnD. We have seen this before and both of those are clearly central to game mechanics for both the PHB and DMG. Even in this thread there was comments that suggested that WotC has stated that the supposedly "backwards comapatible" mechanics cannot work for classses as it would be unballanced, is telling that the players will be forced to migrate to the new system. My bet is, this will follow through to the MM release next spring. The FGU team is clearly working hard to try and merge the two, but at the end of the day I'm wagering this will have to be a wholesale change between the two systems. Frankly, I don't trust WotC to be doing anything other than a money-grab.

[Viepyr]

I have access to all of the 2014 PHB content on the website and app on my phone.

[LordRichtor]

I have access to all of the 2014 PHB content on the website and app on my phone.

https://www.wargamer.com/dnd/beyond-deleting-content-spells-magic-items

[Vass_Dts]

The article itself states its info is no longer up to date.

On the table, the idea is that if you are using the 2024 PHB and the 2014 one; you use the 2024 version for anything that exists in both books, and the 2014 version for anything that has not yet been updated (for instance a subclass from Xanathar’s or Tasha’s).

Regardless, DNDBeyond is DNDBeyond and FG is FG.

[LordEntrails]

I just looked again, and they (again) may be backtracking but my Google search came right back to that they are preparing to remove all spells and and magic items from everyone's purchaced content ahead of the release of OneDnD. We have seen this before and both of those are clearly central to game mechanics for both the PHB and DMG. Even in this thread there was comments that suggested that WotC has stated that the supposedly "backwards comapatible" mechanics cannot work for classses as it would be unballanced, is telling that the players will be forced to migrate to the new system. My bet is, this will follow through to the MM release next spring. The FGU team is clearly working hard to try and merge the two, but at the end of the day I'm wagering this will have to be a wholesale change between the two systems. Frankly, I don't trust WotC to be doing anything other than a money-grab.
If you ignore the following posts, these two initial posts on ENWorld discuss what was happening followed by the latest statement from WotC/DDB retracting the previous decision.
Regardless, what happens on DDB is not what SmiteWorks is doing on FG. Rely upon the statements from SW for what they are doing with FG>

(9) D&D (2024) - How D&D Beyond Will Handle Access To 2014 Rules | EN World Tabletop RPG News & Reviews (https://www.enworld.org/threads/how-d-d-beyond-will-handle-access-to-2014-rules.706245/)
(9) D&D (2024) - Wizards of the Coast Backtracks on D&D Beyond and 2014 Content | EN World Tabletop RPG News & Reviews (https://www.enworld.org/threads/wizards-of-the-coast-backtracks-on-d-d-beyond-and-2014-content.706310/)

[Nyarly Dude]

Indeed. Content wasn't going to be removed, just made considerably more inconvenient to access (i.e. needing to manually look up in the existing Compendiums rather than being linked to from sheets).

The one thing that seems likely to be affected, FGU-side, is that it seems rather plausible that WOTC will stop selling D&D 2014 books once they're superceded and will require that partners do the same. If we go by what happened when MP:MOTM was released, superceding VGtM and MToF, anybody who had already purchased a licensed conversion of VGtM or MToF was permitted to keep using them as-is if desired, but new licenses for them could not be sold. I don't think that WOTC has yet confirmed that they'll be cutting off sales of legacy material, but it at least seems likely.

In other words, if anybody thinks that they'll want to run a 5E game using the FGU conversions of the *2014* PHB / DMG / MM but doesn't yet own them for whatever reason, they should probably buy those licenses soon because they may not be avaiable for much longer (well, the Monster Manual can wait until February, but the PHB 2024 comes out in mid-September); and the same would eventually be true of other books should WOTC decide to reprint/remaster any.

[LordEntrails]

The one thing that seems likely to be affected, FGU-side, is that it seems rather plausible that WOTC will stop selling D&D 2014 books once they're superceded and will require that partners do the same. If we go by what happened when MP:MOTM was released, superceding VGtM and MToF, anybody who had already purchased a licensed conversion of VGtM or MToF was permitted to keep using them as-is if desired, but new licenses for them could not be sold. I don't think that WOTC has yet confirmed that they'll be cutting off sales of legacy material, but it at least seems likely.

In other words, if anybody thinks that they'll want to run a 5E game using the FGU conversions of the *2014* PHB / DMG / MM but doesn't yet own them for whatever reason, they should probably buy those licenses soon because they may not be avaiable for much longer (well, the Monster Manual can wait until February, but the PHB 2024 comes out in mid-September); and the same would eventually be true of other books should WOTC decide to reprint/remaster any.
100% Agree that this is most likely.
I'm hoping SmiteWorks will be able to confirm this either way though soon (tm).

[damned]

The difference here is that it is costly for WOTC and Bricks and Mortar stores to print, distribute, stock 2 different editions but there is no cost to them in continuing to sell digital editions.

[LordEntrails]

The difference here is that it is costly for WOTC and Bricks and Mortar stores to print, distribute, stock 2 different editions but there is no cost to them in continuing to sell digital editions.
Yea, but they still prevented new digital sales of Mord's. *shrug* I hope they don't stop digital sales of 2014 products, but I think they will.

[WildKnight]

Will the SRD elements of the new rules be available free, or will the PHB need to be purchased?

[Zacchaeus]

Will the SRD elements of the new rules be available free, or will the PHB need to be purchased?

I don't think there is any information on whether there will be an SRD release or if there will be one then when. If there is an SRD then I don't imagine anyone charging for it.

[LordEntrails]

WotC through DDB has announced that their will be an updated SRD. SRD 5.2 and it will be released "within weeks of the 2025 Monster Manual".
2024 Core Rulebooks to Expand the SRD | Dungeons & Dragons (dndbeyond.com) (https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1717-2024-core-rulebooks-to-expand-the-srd)

My understanding is that the 2024 MM will be released Feb 18, 2025.

[WildKnight]

I guess what I'm asking is if there will be free support for the elements of the Players Handbook that are free that they've already released (for free). I'm guessing based on responses the answer is no, no SRD type support is forthcoming until the three rule books are complete, if at all.

[LordEntrails]

I guess what I'm asking is if there will be free support for the elements of the Players Handbook that are free that they've already released (for free). I'm guessing based on responses the answer is no, no SRD type support is forthcoming until the three rule books are complete, if at all.
SmiteWorks has not responded.
But your interpretation of mine and Mr Z's responses seems to be different from what we are suggesting.

Yes there will be no SRD support in FG before the SRD is released. How could they possible do that? No one knows what the SRD will contain until it is released, and the content of the PHB '24 is protected intellectual property and not available for anyone to release without license.

WotC says they will release an SRD update next year. SmiteWorks has always released a free FG version of all SRD type documents for all rulesets they support (D&D, Pathfinder, etc).

Unless SmiteWorks says otherwise, it is very safe to assume the SRD 5.2 will be released for FG. After it is actually released.

[johnecc]

I think WildKnight may be referring to the 2024 D&D Free Rules (equivalent to the 2014 D&D Basic Rules), which will be released in conjunction with the Players Handbook. This is not the same as the SRD5.2 which will be released after ALL the 3 main books have been released.

[ddavison]

The new SRD is scheduled to be released next year. There are some free rules that will be available much sooner than that, but those will be more like the equivalent of the D&D Basic Rules. It is different than the SRD.

[LordEntrails]

Ah, that makes sense. Thank you both for helping to resolve my confusion :)

[LordEntrails]

Looks like the new Basic Rules were released on the 5th: D&D Free Rules (2024) - Free Rules - Dungeons & Dragons - Sources - D&D Beyond (dndbeyond.com) (https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/dnd/free-rules)

[wjpennington]

To follow up on discussions on Discord, the original strategy I had outlined at beginning of thread was based on the initial information we received on a clear distinction between character material for 2014 vs. 2024. Based on additional information we got as well as a lot of changing of minds during subsequent interviews by the publisher, we pivoted to take a different approach.

Our current plan is that the 5E ruleset will remain in place; and all records affected by the rules changes will be marked as 2024 vs. 2014. This will flow into character creation as well.
(i.e. 2024 versions of classes will add 2024 version of spells and vice versa) As mentioned in this thread, we will be looking at the "cross-compatibility" handling between versions, but that may take a little longer.

Regards,
JPG

So very happy to hear that. Maybe, just for those who wander into this thread later, it might be best to update or delete the initial posts that were acting on earlier information, and replace them with this post. Just in case someone just reads the initial posts and doesn't follow through to later in the thread. Not trying to be nit picky, just sort of wanting to future proof things based on user behavior. I've very appreciative of the massive work this entails and feel very grateful to have such excellent dedicated support from FG.