Please figure out how to save what my players have explored

[LillySprout]

It's incredibly frustrating that all exploration is lost whenever moving a token to a new map. Roll20 is able to handle this just fine, if the db.xml is getting so bloated that FG can't support saving what characters have explored, maybe storing the entire state of the game and every map in it in a single xml file just... isn't the best design choice? But it's clearly something that CAN be done, and at this point it feels like it should just be table stakes for a VTT to not lose the state of a map just because you temporarily move to another map.

[LordEntrails]

Vote for the idea on the Wish List; https://fgapp.idea.informer.com/proj/?ia=135949

[LillySprout]

Voted and commented - but at the same time I do strongly feel this shouldn't be on the wish list, it's so basic/expected that it really should be considered broken in it's current state. Speaking as a software developer myself, Data Loss is Bad(tm). A user shouldn't be able to do something that will just wipe out a significant amount of game data unintentionally like this, at the very least if the team is so determined to not prioritize it have some pop up that says 'doing this will cause you to lose exploration data on other_map' when they try to drag the characters tokens to a new map.

[Zarestia]

I don't know why all self-proclaimed professionals go on and on with snarky comments and try to push their ideals on a foreign company. That is neither professional nor mature behavior. We all can be glad that we have this forum as a way of communication with SW.

Back to topic...
This "issue" was already discussed just a few weeks / months ago.

See here: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?56055-LoS-Fog-of-War-Explored-Area-History

or here: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?62701-Tokens-lose-LOS-history-when-transitioning-between-maps

Maybe this helps you. This was a 5 sec google search, there is probably more.

Spontaneous workaround idea:
1. Screenshot the map before they leave.
2. When they reenter, enable party vision; move one of them along the whole path again.
3. Disable party vision (if you play with disabled party vision)

This should take about a minute max. per map change (bigger maps a bit longer of course).

[LillySprout]

I don't know why all self-proclaimed professionals go on and on with snarky comments and try to push their ideals on a foreign company. That is neither professional nor mature behavior. We all can be glad that we have this forum as a way of communication with SW.

Back to topic...
This "issue" was already discussed just a few weeks / months ago.

See here: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?56055-LoS-Fog-of-War-Explored-Area-History

or here: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?62701-Tokens-lose-LOS-history-when-transitioning-between-maps

Maybe this helps you. This was a 5 sec google search, there is probably more.

Spontaneous workaround idea:
1. Screenshot the map before they leave.
2. When they reenter, enable party vision; move one of them along the whole path again.
3. Disable party vision (if you play with disabled party vision)

This should take about a minute max. per map change (bigger maps a bit longer of course).

I apologize as coming off as snarky, that wasn't my intent, I was admittedly frustrated in the moment. Though, in my defense, my frustration was due to losing literally months worth of exploration data on a map because I'd forgotten this was an issue, moved my players onto a new side map, and came back to find all their previous overarching exploration on our giant main map lost. I legitimately don't think that it's 'my' personal ideal that it shouldn't be possible to lose that much data by accident so easily.

[fubeca150]

What I did to workaround this issue was, for a hex overland map (Kingmaker), create hex overlay image then place it in each hex. Then I removed the hex image overlay when the hex was fully explored. In my case I had a fully opaque layer and a semi transparent layer. I'd remove the full opacity from surrounding hexes so they could see the neighbor hexes.

Unfortunately this, too, is a pain, but it looks really cool and you don't lose the progress.

[LillySprout]

Yeah. It's definately able to be 'fixed' by just using a masking layer and manually revealing areas of the mask, too... but given that we have the really nice fog/los feature it would be nice to be able to use it (especially when you spent a LOT of time setting up the walls/doors/windows for it on your giant map expecting to be able to use it >>)

[LordEntrails]

As a software developer I suspect that means you have the ability to go into your backups and recover the data out of the xml that you lost. I've never looked myself, but none of the FG data (except vault data) is particularly hard to decipher or figure out. I'm not a s/w developer and I've been able to go into the various campaign files to pull out various info without much challenge.

[fubeca150]

Yeah. It's definately able to be 'fixed' by just using a masking layer and manually revealing areas of the mask, too... but given that we have the really nice fog/los feature it would be nice to be able to use it (especially when you spent a LOT of time setting up the walls/doors/windows for it on your giant map expecting to be able to use it >>)

I'm not disagreeing with you, and think that it shouldn't auto reset. There's a button to reset it manually after all. But this has been asked for before, and if I recall correctly I the response was "won't fix, as intended".

[Weissrolf]

We digital natives type of people tend to forget that FGU tries to emulate the analog experience when it comes to maps and dice. Of course, that does not mean we have to like it, but it helps to understand the mind-set. :bandit:

On a side-note: I agree that FoW should be (optionally) saved, at least if it stays discernible. Just as I agree that it should (optionally) be possible to disable it, even though our groups will keep it enabled (in keeping with the analog experience).

[SilentRuin]

Personally, I still want an option to completely turn off the FOW. In real life you have to remember or make a map (especially if you play in person games). I've never really liked this "photographic" memory everyone gets by default. Battle, confusion, where am I? Should be a thing. But its not. I'd like the option to not have FOW.

[fubeca150]

Personally, I still want an option to completely turn off the FOW. In real life you have to remember or make a map (especially if you play in person games). I've never really liked this "photographic" memory everyone gets by default. Battle, confusion, where am I? Should be a thing. But its not. I'd like the option to not have FOW.

Maybe I'm missing something (it's been a stressful morning) but FOW is Masking, right? Maps you create default to not having masking, and you can turn off masking for module maps on a per-map basis.

[SilentRuin]

Maybe I'm missing something (it's been a stressful morning) but FOW is Masking, right? Maps you create default to not having masking, and you can turn off masking for module maps on a per-map basis.

FOW is fog of war. Its that less bright "memory" of where characters have been but can no longer see due to LOS (or lighting).

[fubeca150]

FOW is fog of war. Its that less bright "memory" of where characters have been but can no longer see due to LOS (or lighting).

Gotcha. I wasn't consciously aware FG even had that, but now that you mention it, yes, I've seen that reset after moving players off and back on.

I can see why you'd want to be able to not have it at all, especially in cases that you want to run a map that is supposed to be confusing and not leave breadcrumbs for the players.

[Zacchaeus]

Maybe I'm missing something (it's been a stressful morning) but FOW is Masking, right? Maps you create default to not having masking, and you can turn off masking for module maps on a per-map basis.

In Unity the mask is a different (additional) thing from Fog of War. FoW is a cleared area of a map where the PC tokens have been. It shows as a lighter colour than the 'darkness' areas where the PCs haven't been. You can right click and reset the FoW on each individual token - or remove them and re-add them to remove it.

[Weissrolf]

FoW can be reset, though, so at least partially it's already possible to make PCs forget the past.

[darrenan]

@SilentRuin: Just don't share the entire map with the players at all. Extract the maps for each battle into their own image files. Only present them with these maps when the encounter occurs. Then give them a blank image where they can draw their own full maps of the location. The FGU drawing tools are probably sufficient for that approach. I think if I did that my players would riot, but ymmv. It's not perfect, but it would probably get the feeling you're looking for.

Or is what you're looking for more like line-of-sight but without the 'remembering'? I think the approach above would mostly work for that as well. Once the encounter is over, remove their tokens or unshare the map.

[Weissrolf]

Well, yes, workaround are available. A simple on/off switch would still be appreciated by SR, I guess. Just as the original poster would like FoW data to be saved with the map like everything else as a simple solution.

I had to move tokens around to rebuild FoW data several times already. Either because I removed a player from CT for missing a session or because I had to remove/readd a PC to CT to solve an issue.

[SilentRuin]

I'd prefer to keep my DM laziness in tact where I don't have to manually reset anything. I'd prefer to simply turn it on when its ok to have it and turn it off when its not. Tracking everything myself defeats my goal of just running the game - and not running the data. Prep is for data. Running the game does not need a bunch of "don't forget to do this" etc. In the end its a "want" not a "need". It would be nice to have it as an on/off map switch, but not needed. Nor is some elaborate keep all FOW for all time required in my opinion either, especially if it is non optional and impacts performance.

[Weissrolf]

This was kind of a "I want my candy, but you cannot have yours" post. :P

[LordEntrails]

I hope everyone has voiced their opinions in the requested way, but voting on the items on the Wish List. Both of these ideas, keep FoW on multiple maps, and not keeping FoW even on the current map, already have items to vote for.

[SilentRuin]

This was kind of a "I want my candy, but you cannot have yours" post. :P

Not intended to be - just expressing I don’t want a bunch of performance overhead added in without an option to turn it off.