A new era of voting?

[YAKO SOMEDAKY]

Moon Wizard's post about Idea Informer and possible developments for Fantasy Grounds Unity
Post: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?65277-Feature-Request-Tracker-Migration
Idea Informer: https://fgapp.idea.informer.com/
They generated some doubts:
There is a time to be voted on before being discarded.
Is there a minimum number of votes?
If the "goal" is not achieved, will we lose the possibility of any of these improvements forever, or would it be launched only in the indeterminate future?

[Jiminimonka]

Moving over to a new system and migrated more popular votes from the old location over, abandoning ancient and low vote items.

If you have an item you want migrated, do so.

That's what it seems to say, to me.

[YAKO SOMEDAKY]

I am satisfied with what I saw, especially:
The possibility of having the light sources, animated maps, sounds (effects and music) directly on the platform, the possibility of locking the players' spreadsheet and having the combat tracker connected to who is seeing the NPC on the map.

[LordEntrails]

I think this is close enough to the OP to not start a new thread.. But how does this differ from the Support Site Feature Request form? I was worried that one had no community visibility or means of voting, but since a few of us have been suggesting that for the last couple months... would like some clairification on use of Idea Informer vs the support portal form.

[Svandal]

Moon Wizard's post about Idea Informer and possible developments for Fantasy Grounds Unity
Post: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?65277-Feature-Request-Tracker-Migration
Idea Informer: https://fgapp.idea.informer.com/
They generated some doubts:
There is a time to be voted on before being discarded.
Is there a minimum number of votes?
If the "goal" is not achieved, will we lose the possibility of any of these improvements forever, or would it be launched only in the indeterminate future?

Good questions. I think it is neccessary to clean up the votung site once in a while.
The last on have dozens of pages of suggestions. I thought that it was no point in posting new suggestions there because it would just drown in the old suggestions.
It takes time to do, but deleting old ideas without votes, closing suggestions that have been implemented and merging suggestions should be done if smiteworks wants an actual voting site that works as intended.

[YAKO SOMEDAKY]

As I understand it Moon Wizard cleaned up the Idea Informer and took what was done, what could not be done and kept what could be done, but then I was left wondering what kept going, changing only the order that it will be prioritized by votes or it will not happen if it doesn’t reach an X number of votes, because it doesn’t help anything to vote for any of the options to hear it willn’t happen, to arrive, ah we would do it but there were few votes, we need to have palpable values direct answers .
(Sorry for the anxiety attacked! It gave me a lot of uncertainty and frustration to lose wonderful additions)

[Jiminimonka]

A lot of the old suggestions, (and unfortunately some of the new ones) are ridiculous.

But proper dynamic lighting is in the works!!

[Valyar]

Allowing delegation to another player to be GM rather than the host is probably the most important feature. This will allow to push back move to Foundry for some games where I am player and my friends don't own or don't want to invest in content, but I already have.

[YAKO SOMEDAKY]

Jiminimonka I like to make lives, in the few times that I have managed to play, yes some are and will be very welcome, such as being able to minimize desktop objects, the possibility of having audio and sound effects directly on my platform, giving the freedom of a player controlling a friendly npc, taking this responsibility from the master's hand, showing in each player's CT only what they can see on the battle map, being able to place the tokens above or below effect layers, with height control. I know I have listed a lot of things but it will bring me immersion, resources and ease.

[Jiminimonka]

Jiminimonka I like to make lives, in the few times that I have managed to play, yes some are and will be very welcome, such as being able to minimize desktop objects, the possibility of having audio and sound effects directly on my platform, giving the freedom of a player controlling a friendly npc, taking this responsibility from the master's hand, showing in each player's CT only what they can see on the battle map, being able to place the tokens above or below effect layers, with height control. I know I have listed a lot of things but it will bring me immersion, resources and ease.

They all sound reasonable, and I am sure most of those will be added eventually as well.

[Valyar]

The sooner the better! The competition is gaining momentum.

[Jiminimonka]

The sooner the better! The competition is gaining momentum.

Maybe, but a piece of dung moving fast is still a piece of dung. :)

[celestian]

The sooner the better! The competition is gaining momentum.

Indeed. I've a couple of friends that are using other platforms because of it ;(

[YAKO SOMEDAKY]

Celestian, I have friends who abandoned Fantasy Grounds and migrated to Foundry, these friends felt hurt by the delay and the non-delivery of what was imagined ... I take advantage of both platforms, because I want to have fun, but I confess that I I would not be sad to be surprised and to surprise many who speak ill of Fantasy Grounds, showing a remarkable improvement ... I know they will say, ah but Foundry has had this for a long time, and we can say I know, now Fantasy Grounds has also :D

[LordEntrails]

Something I find very interesting in these VTT comparison discussions, particularly about this feature or that feature, is the perspective of what a "long time" is.

To cite this specific example, Foundry was alpha released in Feb 2019 and Beta released in Jan 2020 and didn't reach full release until October 2020. That's less than 2 years since the first public alpha release. To me, that's not a "long time". Heck, I don't particularly think I've been using FG a long time, and it's been over 5 years for me. Maybe it's generational though.

Maybe it also depends upon how long you plan to be playing your RPGs and re-using your content, or how long you've been playing RPGs or into your hobbies. In that regards I'm a long hauler. Been playing RPGs for over 40 years, and expect to be playing, and using the content I've created on FG, for another 40 years. A year or three doesn't mean much in the larger scope of platform longevity and data re-use.

[YAKO SOMEDAKY]

I completely agree with you, because before there was no possibility, behold, Fantasy Grounds Unity is launched and Foundry appears and becomes due to already come with resources that I know we will have and that will meet our needs, I see this "competition" as healthy because both companies must always be moving to keep their audience, but the worst thing for both is the constant judgment and the immediacy of the consumer, no matter if something was done today or yesterday, if something works or not..what he wants is to criticize and yes I know that it frustrates many producers, content generators, programmers, that is, it annoys the people involved for him to have his leisure.

[Sulimo]

Something I find very interesting in these VTT comparison discussions, particularly about this feature or that feature, is the perspective of what a "long time" is.

To cite this specific example, Foundry was alpha released in Feb 2019 and Beta released in Jan 2020 and didn't reach full release until October 2020. That's less than 2 years since the first public alpha release. To me, that's not a "long time". Heck, I don't particularly think I've been using FG a long time, and it's been over 5 years for me. Maybe it's generational though.

Maybe it also depends upon how long you plan to be playing your RPGs and re-using your content, or how long you've been playing RPGs or into your hobbies. In that regards I'm a long hauler. Been playing RPGs for over 40 years, and expect to be playing, and using the content I've created on FG, for another 40 years. A year or three doesn't mean much in the larger scope of platform longevity and data re-use.

++

I've been using FG since 2014. Like LordEntrails, I have been playing pen and paper RPGs for even longer (over 30 years). When it was pen and paper (and I was much younger), I could not afford to purchase a bunch of books for different systems. All of my physical books are from one system (maybe 1.5 systems if you want to be really technical), so that is the system I DM/GM'ed. If players wanted to play a different system, they had to find a different DM/GM. If I purchase books (rulebooks, adventures, etc.) for a particular system, I DM/GM that system.

Maybe that is the difference, VTTs have given rise to one shots and strangers playing together. In Pen and Paper RPGs, you typically had a group of friends that played together for months or in some cases years. No friend would ever demand that the DM/GM change systems. It would have been rude, quite frankly, for someone to suggest as much.


Unless and until any other VTTs get automation, I have zero interest. I specifically purchased FG for the automation, everything else is gravy.

As the DM/GM, if people don't want to use FG, then they do not play my game. Players do not get to dictate to the DM/GM what tool(s) they choose to use, to me this is an extension of the DM/GM purchasing books.


Are you sure foundry has gotten out of beta? Their own web site shows the latest release as 0.7.9 on December 16th, anything with a version below 1.x is still beta to me.

[YAKO SOMEDAKY]

Yes Foundry is still BETA, as I heard when he gets to 1.0 he will stop being BETA.
I play in Fantasy Grounds Classic, Unity or Foundry but if I ever venture to teach, it will be in Fantasy Grounds Unity.
I have practice and knowledge to deal with Fantasy Grounds, but I don't have the guts of a GM | DM

[celestian]

Celestian, I have friends who abandoned Fantasy Grounds and migrated to Foundry, these friends felt hurt by the delay and the non-delivery of what was imagined ... I take advantage of both platforms, because I want to have fun, but I confess that I I would not be sad to be surprised and to surprise many who speak ill of Fantasy Grounds, showing a remarkable improvement ... I know they will say, ah but Foundry has had this for a long time, and we can say I know, now Fantasy Grounds has also :D

I expect it will show more improvement over time, believe me I certainly hope so as I am heavily invested in the platform. But, thats me, others are not and I would rather those folks choose FG because of the features it has and not another system for what it has over FG.

I look forward to seeing what they can add and improve... but, hoping for sooner rather than later. The world moves pretty fast these days and the old adage "you snooze, you loose" is fairly apt.

[Jiminimonka]

I'm not interested in the competition. They can't do what FG does.

[LordEntrails]

Are you sure foundry has gotten out of beta? Their own web site shows the latest release as 0.7.9 on December 16th, anything with a version below 1.x is still beta to me.
Nope :) I was just lookin at their release notes and noticed they dropped the beta tag. https://foundryvtt.com/releases/

But as you and Yako pointed out, they have not reached v 1.0 yet.

[celestian]

Nope :) I was just lookin at their release notes and noticed they dropped the beta tag. https://foundryvtt.com/releases/

But as you and Yako pointed out, they have not reached v 1.0 yet.

They came out of beta when they started selling the system.

[Valyar]

My biggest issue so far with Foundry and (surprisingly) publishers such as Posthuman studios and R. Talsorian is their refusal or inability to maintain proper forums! Discord or Facebook groups are not at all proper replacement of good forum - you can't really search for information, you can't have focused discussion due to being chat room as irc in the past, it is not indexed by search engine, you can't easily refer something... it is not even properly structured. It is one big messy swamp of text that I no longer try to follow or want to, it is repulsive. Very bad. Having a reddit forum is to some extent OK, but not real replacement for space to gather your people.

Discord is fine for many type of communications, to be connected, but not replacement. We live in very very sad times where Facebook managed to kill many online communities and it gets harder and harder now to keep or properly search for information.

So - I am extremely happy that Fantasy Grounds has real forums and the business recognizes and understands how to use the right tools for the right purpose. Salute to Smite Works.

[The High Druid]

The cynic in me says this was largely done to remove dual screen support from the top of the list.

So I added it to the new one.

(Yes, I know, technical obstacles, but as a GM I still think it's the most import feature missing from FG, and I would absolutely choose it above ranged lighting).

[celestian]

The cynic in me says this was largely done to remove dual screen support from the top of the list.

So I added it to the new one.

(Yes, I know, technical obstacles, but as a GM I still think it's the most import feature missing from FG, and I would absolutely choose it above ranged lighting).

Thats a good suggestion. For reference, the link is here https://fgapp.idea.informer.com/proj/?ia=135441

It's a difficult situation but I can think of at least 1 way to resolve it. Multiple applications that communicate through an API... but, im no expert on Unity so surely there is a better way.

[mozmonar]

Well it wasn't a super easy decision to make. I have a lot invested in FG both monetary and time invested entering in stuff. But letting that hold me back is Sunk Cost Fallacy. I have switched over to Foundry. FG has a lot to reccomend it. The degree of automation that's possible (if not always realized) is pretty amazing. But it just runs too slow and hogs too many resources. I feel that FGU has been a terrible let down in that it doesn't feel like an unqualified improvement. It does run 64bit and does have a barebones LoS implementation. These were welcome changes and I expect that the LoS will continue to improve and perhaps the sluggishness and resource issues will get resolved. But the timetable for such improvements is unfortunately beyond what I personally am willing wait for. Aesthetics are subjective so this is opinion but the interface doesn't feel like a premium upgrade from classic. I wish all the best.

[Kelrugem]

Well it wasn't a super easy decision to make. I have a lot invested in FG both monetary and time invested entering in stuff. But letting that hold me back is Sunk Cost Fallacy. I have switched over to Foundry. FG has a lot to reccomend it. The degree of automation that's possible (if not always realized) is pretty amazing. But it just runs too slow and hogs too many resources. I feel that FGU has been a terrible let down in that it doesn't feel like an unqualified improvement. It does run 64bit and does have a barebones LoS implementation. These were welcome changes and I expect that the LoS will continue to improve and perhaps the sluggishness and resource issues will get resolved. But the timetable for such improvements is unfortunately beyond what I personally am willing wait for. Aesthetics are subjective so this is opinion but the interface doesn't feel like a premium upgrade from classic. I wish all the best.

Oh, sad to hear that, but I hope you have fun time there with your group :) When you have fun playing with your group, then everything's chosen right :)

[Laerun]

We use Discord for day to day stuff in FGC, but Fisdcord does not hold long standing questions and content too well.

[Laerun]

Regardless of Classic vs Unity, hands down, 'offline' use is my sticking point, and this community. I honestly refuse to invest in something that always requires me to have online internet access. I need to be able to work on my prep work and modules when I want to. I have good reliable internet, but it is still not enough to convince me to go cloud or web only. Giving up on FGU when it's just begun is a choice, and your choice. You can always come back someday. The token lighting is due to release anytime now. I have to admit the interface needs some overhaul work.

@The High Druid, having dual monitors is a bonus, I believe that the necessity is less than 50% of the base users probably 65/35 of 100. There was some chatter about Unity not able to support it, and then later it was mentioned it might be able to. it's very low priority, especially most people can only afford or run one screen at a time. I would be more happy if we could have a more modular view option that we could customize, lock, and set for good.

Good luck!

ps. Is there officially licensed content yet via Foundry?

[Jiminimonka]

Regardless of Classic vs Unity, hands down, 'offline' use is my sticking point, and this community. I honestly refuse to invest in something that always requires me to have online internet access. I need to be able to work on my prep work and modules when I want to. I have good reliable internet, but it is still not enough to convince me to go cloud or web only. Giving up on FGU when it's just begun is a choice, and your choice. You can always come back someday. The token lighting is due to release anytime now. I have to admit the interface needs some overhaul work.

@The High Druid, having dual monitors is a bonus, I believe that the necessity is less than 50% of the base users probably 65/35 of 100. There was some chatter about Unity not able to support it, and then later it was mentioned it might be able to. it's very low priority, especially most people can only afford or run one screen at a time. I would be more happy if we could have a more modular view option that we could customize, lock, and set for good.

Good luck!

ps. Is there officially licensed content yet via Foundry?

There is no licenced content. Has to be leached off D&D Beyond.

[mozmonar]

Oh, sad to hear that, but I hope you have fun time there with your group :) When you have fun playing with your group, then everything's chosen right :)

Thanks man! Your extensions, among many others (whom I will not even attempt to enumerate for fear of unintentionally overlooking someone), are one of the things that kept me tethered to FG for so long. I appreciate all the work you, and the multitude of others, did and continue to do for FG even if I no longer will benefit from them. You are a gentleman and a scholar! The community that FG has is arguably its strongest selling point.


There is no licenced content. Has to be leached off D&D Beyond.

This is incorrect or at least not 100% correct. There is no licensed D&D content but D&D ≠ all RPGs. There are other sources apart from D&D Beyond for D&D content such as importers/converters from other VTTs.

There is official licensed content fSavage Worlds Adventure Edition and Warhammer Fantasy 4th Edition. Other licenses are in the works from my understanding.

[Jiminimonka]

Good luck with Foundry - you can come back to FGU at some point.

[mozmonar]

Good luck with Foundry - you can come back to FGU at some point.

Thanks! Appreciate it.