Worth the switch to Unity yet?

[Jed Shields]

Hello all,

I've been running FG Classic Ultimate for a little while now, completed DnD5e LMOP and currently working through Curse Of Strahd. I'm loving the system so far.

I'm also a PC in a Roll20 Pathfinder 2e campaign and like the LOS system. I'm aware that this is available in the Unity version of FG and won't be coming to Classic. The current offer to upgrade is very tempting, roughly $80, £60. Is it worth the switch? What else does Unity bring to the table, and realistically, will the price get better than this?

Cheers,

Jed

[damned]

Its hard to say the price will never get cheaper than this
I dont know if the 40% upgrade offer will be indefinite - if it is then one day somewhere there is likely to be a better stack than the 40% + 10% but holding your breath waiting for that would be bad for your health
FGU seems pretty stable - I havent hit any issues in the few games Ive run on it
There are a bunch of bug reports, some new, some a bit older, but many are edge cases and they are getting knocked off
I imagine that they will be looking at more FGU feature improvements pretty soon as the bug list gets shorter

[Jed Shields]

Its hard to say the price will never get cheaper than this
I dont know if the 40% upgrade offer will be indefinite - if it is then one day somewhere there is likely to be a better stack than the 40% + 10% but holding your breath waiting for that would be bad for your health
FGU seems pretty stable - I havent hit any issues in the few games Ive run on it
There are a bunch of bug reports, some new, some a bit older, but many are edge cases and they are getting knocked off
I imagine that they will be looking at more FGU feature improvements pretty soon as the bug list gets shorter

Excellent, thanks.

[Valyar]

Don't think much! A switch to Fantasy Grounds is worth anytime and this discount is not bad. Considering Unity is the future of the platform and since it is out of the Early Access- quite stable it is no brainer. In time you will see the benefits of the platform and the licensed content, won't go back to the thing you mentioned. :)

Smite Works introduced so many new features over the years that Roll20's team will only dream to achieve.

[LordEntrails]

The big things that FGU brings over FGC are;
- LOS
- 64 bit architecture
- Native cross platform support
- Connection brokering (so almost no one needs to port forward)
- New Mapping ability including build from tiles, brushes and animated effects

[Modu]

The only thing that's really a big benefit for DMs is the new mapping features, they are nice and can save some time. Especially considering the old limitation of maps that you often ran out of room if people moved around too much.

The move to Unity and dynamic LOS is basically useless without being able to limit vision ranges and have real time lighting. In fact, it just adds a lot of overhead if you want to try to make it work, so you'll probably just end up ignoring it because here's the problem:

Right now, you have to expose what you want your players to see. With Unity, you need to hide what they can't see. In Unity, their LOS is infinite. So, dark dungeon crawling is a pain and outdoors you still need to use the mask so they don't see your entire map the whole time.

Given the above lighting/vision issues, I don't see any reason to upgrade at this point. I would wait until they actually give us real dynamic vision. Personally, I would just stick with classic until SW actually delivers on the full feature. I stopped DM'ing shortly after Unity because Unity just didn't live up to what I was expecting. If I was to DM again, I would DM with classic as the app runs faster and generally behaves better.

[Jed Shields]

Thanks for the info, much appreciated.

[Kelrugem]

I think the LoS system actually helps to determine LoS (in sense of rules stuff), and it adds some nice atmosphere :) (especially together with Fx etc.) Saying that LoS is completely useless at the moment is not fair in my opinion, because we have secret doors, terrain, invisible walls, pits etc. and for their intended purpose you do not need dynamic lighting :) But yes, for ranged visions you need to use FoW when the rooms of the map are quite big :)

(though whether that convinces you to switch is of course personal preference :) )

[allenw01234]

Something else to consider is that, as far as I can tell, Unity will *not* run on any Windows other than 10. Which is one of the main things keeping me from switching: My only available non-work-PC is still Windows 7, and some of my potential players may be in the same boat.

I also still don't get the impression that FGU is quite "ready for prime time". Sure, it's now out of beta, but I still see people saying "really, it runs fine... if you have a good gaming-optimized PC... and if you don't mind the occasional 5, 10, or 15 minute wait in the middle of a game."
If FGU really is smooth sailing now (assuming Windows 10 or 64-bit Macs), somebody let me know.

[Kelrugem]

There was a similar talk about that in the PF1 forum, you might want to take a look there because performance was also asked there (scroll down a bit there when others started to talk about their experience) :) Indeed, Win7 is not supported anymore, but that is also not supported by Microsoft anymore, too, so, it is in general a security risk. https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?63886-Running-a-PFRPG-campaign-on-FGU


(https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?63886-Running-a-PFRPG-campaign-on-FGU)

[bmos]

Something else to consider is that, as far as I can tell, Unity will *not* run on any Windows other than 10. Which is one of the main things keeping me from switching: My only available non-work-PC is still Windows 7, and some of my potential players may be in the same boat.

I also still don't get the impression that FGU is quite "ready for prime time". Sure, it's now out of beta, but I still see people saying "really, it runs fine... if you have a good gaming-optimized PC... and if you don't mind the occasional 5, 10, or 15 minute wait in the middle of a game."
If FGU really is smooth sailing now (assuming Windows 10 or 64-bit Macs), somebody let me know.

Windows 8.1 (and possibly Windows 8) work also, I think.
I haven't had any serious Unity issues in months on my Windows 10 machine.

[Jiminimonka]

I have had no real issues with FGU at all. A few bugs but nothing that hindered gameplay.

Is the 40% upgrade discount over now?

Upgrade to Windows 10 if you are on 7 or just get Linux installed and skip all that Windows nonsense.

[HywelPhillips]

I run FGU on a 2017 iMac Pro. My two groups have had no significant performance problem in months. A couple of people had permissions issues installing but they seem to be fixed now.

I would not want to be without FGU's image processing features now. The ability to quickly customise maps is great. For example this morning I quickly repurposed one for a spider lair and adding cobwebs over the top using assets I already had on disk was really easy.

Players really like the FX, too. I'm running a ghost stories game and using mist, cloud, time-of-day, change colour and so forth makes it really easy to turn a bright and cheerful map into a scary night-time one in less than a minute. It's even more powerful now you can mask off areas and selectively apply the FX.

And it runs natively on Macs which makes it a no-brainer for me.

[allenw01234]

I have had no real issues with FGU at all. A few bugs but nothing that hindered gameplay.

Is the 40% upgrade discount over now?

Upgrade to Windows 10 if you are on 7 or just get Linux installed and skip all that Windows nonsense.

Thanks, but even if I could upgrade to Windows 10, I wouldn't want to make my players do so.

So, you haven't found FGU to be slow to load, or subject to random pauses? What kind of system do you have?

[Jiminimonka]

Thanks, but even if I could upgrade to Windows 10, I wouldn't want to make my players do so.

So, you haven't found FGU to be slow to load, or subject to random pauses? What kind of system do you have?

Ryzen 3700 4Ghz and Nvidia 1080ti and 32gb ram. Its a bit slow to boot but I have so many modules I expect that. Takes about 1 minute to open the table.

[jfg1984]

I just made the switch from FG Classic too FG Unity. I wasn't even aware of the issue with incompatibility with earlier versions of windows because I tend to buy a new computer ever 3-5 years to keep up with any video games I want to play, and since Windows 10 has been the standard issue operating system since 2015 all my machines were already carrying it.

From an ease of use and experience perspective, I found the interface to look exactly like it does in classic from a player and GM perspective with the exception of how the battle maps are handled.

If you're a player, the difference in how the battle maps are handled seemed very small to me. All I had to get used to was the fact that I'm no longer free to move my token around the map with the freedom I formerly had in which to do so. Those line of sight barriers that block your vision also often block your token's ability to move as well, so if you try to click and drag your token through a line of sight barrier the game isn't going to allow it to do so. This is mostly a problem when you are near the corner of a hallway in a dungeon and you want to move around the corner, and you try to path your token straight through the corner like this:

41627

This might intuitively feel like you're just saving time because you're thinking of it like a board game piece being moved, but you're going to hit a barrier and get stopped. In actuality you have to move like this:

41628

Aside from that, everything feels about the same with some minor tweaks that I found to be quality of life improvements.

As a DM, those battle maps are a lot more complicated than they used to be to create because in classic all I had to worry about was putting a grid on an image, and then masking the parts of it I wanted to mask until my players went there. But now, I have to put a grid on the image, then trace walls over all the walls depicted in the image, then trace doors over all the doors, then pits over all the pits, then trace terrain over all the terrain, and windows over all the windows, then test it by moving a character around the map to make sure there are no gaps or glitches in the line of sight code. And then if I want to add FX effects to it I have to play around with putting an FX effect down and then masking it until only the section I want the effect to go on is unmasked, and laying that FX effect with other FX effects if I want more than one per map.

It can feel a bit overwhelming at first, but honestly a 30 minute tutorial video on Youtube had me feeling way more confident in how to use the different features.

Overall I'm glad I switched to Unity now. I think the product is already quite polished.

[Laerun]

I would lean more to 'yes', than no. You have more local memory to use now, and you have more options for connectivity. Inside FGU, you also have some great map tools and ways to create your own maps similar to Roll20. The thing you will NOT get anywhere else is THIS community, so based on 'community' alone,i would pick FG over all else. Most of the rest of the changes are minor and not as visible to the players side of things, except for maybe the movement and slight option changes. If you need help or want to see more join FGGC, Fantasy Grounds College.

Laerun
https://discordapp.com/invite/Ew6nYyw

[Sulimo]

Thanks, but even if I could upgrade to Windows 10, I wouldn't want to make my players do so.



I know a lot of people are still on Windows 7, however, Microsoft officially ended support of Windows 7 on January 14, 2020 (https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-7-end-of-life-support-information).

Anyone still on Windows 7 should upgrade asap, Microsoft is no longer releasing any security patches for Win7, so the number of vulnerabilities will just keep increasing as time goes on, making those users still on Win7 vulnerable to anything from cryptolockers to identity theft if they continue to use Win7.

Microsoft made Windows 10 available as a free upgrade for the first year of its release, however, they have quietly supported a free upgrade from Win7/8 even to this day (see here for how (https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2020/02/04/how-to-upgrade-to-windows-10-for-free-in-2020/)).

[allenw01234]

Ryzen 3700 4Ghz and Nvidia 1080ti and 32gb ram. Its a bit slow to boot but I have so many modules I expect that. Takes about 1 minute to open the table.

Sadly, what I have is an office-surplus Dell Latitude laptop with Windows 7 Enterprise, an i5-4310M CPU @2.70 GHz and 12 GB of RAM. So, I have my doubts about it's suitability for FGU, even if I could get Windows 10 on it.

[spoofer]

I play with FGU once a week and with FGC three times a week. We are over the port forwarding hurdle with FGC so now it works very well. FGU, on the other hand, tends to drop player connections mid session. In my experience, it happens on average at most about once per session per player. You know it happened you roll dice but do not see the result. You then need to log out, log back in, and everything is fine again. Some players get dropped more frequently than others. Some don't get dropped at all.

Otherwise, FGU has been a wonderful experience. LOS is really neat.

[amerigoV]

During the Kickstarter, I got FGC on sale then got the FGU upgrade. Used FGC until around January of 2020. Switched over to FGU and even with the bumps and bruises, I have not looked back. The core LOS is there (plus recent additions) - but it does need the lighting constraints, which from various posts is high on the enhancement list. Its really sweet to have access to all your images and token assets without having to load modules. While I am set up to get around the port forwarding on classic (I was travelling before all this and used VPN/Dedicated IP), it is really nice to have the cloud connection. Overall performance is solid (less of the 100% CPU issues). And everything just looks crisper.

[CD0369]

Hello all,

I've been running FG Classic Ultimate for a little while now, completed DnD5e LMOP and currently working through Curse Of Strahd. I'm loving the system so far.

I'm also a PC in a Roll20 Pathfinder 2e campaign and like the LOS system. I'm aware that this is available in the Unity version of FG and won't be coming to Classic. The current offer to upgrade is very tempting, roughly $80, £60. Is it worth the switch? What else does Unity bring to the table, and realistically, will the price get better than this?

Cheers,

Jed

I started with FGU earlier this year. I picked up FGC during one of SW's sales afterward. Initially, FGU had its quirks but it appears to be smoothed out significantly. I am not sure if I am just one of the lucky ones or what but, I have not had any major issues with FGU. My initial problem with FGC was getting my network and laptop to port forward so I could host. Through the support of the community, I was able to succeed. With FGU, it worked right out of the box with no configuration needed on my part. I have DMed in FGU and played in FGC. The features of FGU are welcomed and, in my opinion, better than those of FGC. The LoS feature is really a great feature and does work well with masking. Dynamic lighting is not a sticking point for me, which seems to be a must have to some. My players do enjoy the LoS capability FGU offers.
With only a few months of utilizing FG in any capacity under my belt, I would not change to any other system. Personally, I would recommend making the switch if your players and you have the hardware and budget to support it. I have noticed that SW and the supporting community does do a great job of listening to constructive feedback. I have reached out to the community on several occasions and received great resources, advice and assistance.
I picked up FGC because my books and dice group did not have computers that would support FGU. Sadly, my books and dice group fizzled and many had neither the desire nor capability to go digital. But I did find other groups to join with. After playing both systems (albeit different rulesets) I do like FGU over FGC. My FGU D&D group are just as inexperienced at utilizing the program as I am. I know there are many features that we are not utilizing to the fullest that FGU has to offer. Though I can say that we are happy just being able to play our favorite RPG with everyone being geographically separated by sever hundred miles.

[Aramis Dante]

I am a brand new user to the VTT world of gaming. I did a lot of research on several platforms including this one. I have found FGU to be very powerful in its capabilities. My only problem, and this would hold true to all the other VTTs out there, is taking the time to:
1. Read the Manual.
2. Watch the plethora of youtube tutorials out there.
and lastly, to read this forum and also to ask questions on this forum. In the less than a month I have been on this forum I have been helped not only by other players but also the Creators of this VTT format. I cant tell you how important and the impression it makes on you when the owners personally help you with problems. Also everyone has been very helpful and you can get a response usually within 24 hrs. That alone is worth FGU.

Sincerely Aramis

[The High Druid]

"really, it runs fine... if you have a good gaming-optimized PC... and if you don't mind the occasional 5, 10, or 15 minute wait in the middle of a game." If FGU really is smooth sailing now (assuming Windows 10 or 64-bit Macs), somebody let me know.
I've been running my weekly game on FGU for a good few months now. The players are happy with the result and think it's better than classic. My PC is ~9 year old i5-2500k; there are occasional *pauses* when something complicated happens, but (so far) never any 5 minute waits . . . or even 1 minutes waits.