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yako2020
August 19th, 2020, 02:19
It's getting so beautiful, too bad for me. Copyright I understand and respect. Ah it's just that page!

38637

ronnke
August 19th, 2020, 06:10
More people need to post Fantasy Grounds stuff on the SJG forums. If they see more interest, they might see value in pursuing official modules and such.

CD0369
August 19th, 2020, 22:28
More people need to post Fantasy Grounds stuff on the SJG forums. If they see more interest, they might see value in pursuing official modules and such.

It might help. I was tempted to send an email to the support address asking if they considered supporting official content on VTTs. I did notice that they [SJG] did the nod to VTTs in their most recent printing of the Basic Set. I would even strongly consider supporting a KickStarter for GURPS support in VTTs to get the ball rolling. While I am partial to FG for my own reasons, I can understand that needing financial support to have product support for the more popular VTTs can be scarce. I would imagine that support would pour in should SJG go the direction of KickStarting a campaign to get their product into VTTs.
With the situation as it is around the world, VTTs are even more crucial for gaming. In my area, I have four or five game shops but they are really restricted on how many customers they can have. Even hosting from home is challenging with the rules of social gatherings. Granted they are different from state to state and even country to country, but still. I do not see VTTs going away anytime soon.

yako2020
August 20th, 2020, 01:58
I'm Brazilian, here the public is scarce, but I'm trying to create something "simple" to show people that they like GURPS.
But I'm not sure, but I was thinking of making videos showing the operational, showing the creation of adventures.
As for a KS I would be happy and it would be a start to support those who made GURPS possible and decent in a VTT.

seycyrus
August 20th, 2020, 05:45
More people need to post Fantasy Grounds stuff on the SJG forums. If they see more interest, they might see value in pursuing official modules and such.

What sort of stuff, Ronnke?

TheMookNet
August 20th, 2020, 14:48
This post (https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?36043-GURPS-4E-Core-Ruleset&p=360419&viewfull=1#post360419) continues to haunt me and break my heart.

johniba
August 20th, 2020, 15:37
SJGames is wasting potential, and keeping themselves in the past.
If they had their products in FG and other VTT, they could reach more customers, and gather more interest in their system, which lets face it, has a lot of good competitors

I wouldnt even mind to buy again (i have the physical books and several digital) some stuff I already have, but in FG

CD0369
August 20th, 2020, 17:28
Hey All,
I definitely recognize that GURPS and other SJG products have a strong following. I see, in this forum and others, that the fan base is strong with many long time patrons. I got the hankering to dive into the weeds a little to find an adequate way to express my interest to SJG about going to VTT. I admit that I have next to zero business administration knowledge. Which is what SJG is. A business. One which I can tell receives avid support from their fan base for many of their products. This led me to the stakeholder report; which is published annually, if I understand correctly, located here (http://www.sjgames.com/general/stakeholders/). Which I also admit that I am working on reading fully. Below, I attempt to spark thought and hopefully bring collaboration together to help bring our desire for full support to VTTs.


More people need to post Fantasy Grounds stuff on the SJG forums. If they see more interest, they might see value in pursuing official modules and such.

How do we, the consumer/supporter, credibly show there is interest and support for SJG to go to VTTs? I have learned that when statistics are produced, opinions are heard a bit more closely. And help in deciding one way or the other. The other end of this is that there is not just one VTT that people invest in. The fans for competitors of FG will also want to receive support. Which brings a whole new ball of wax. How can a business support the various requests and which ones do they support? I have seen a thread or two at other forms where people suspected favoritism because their preferred platform did not receive recognition.
I am not a programmer. I do not know how much effort it would take to create the data files for the most popular game systems. But would imagine that many working hours would be required. I am also not sure how much it took for the developers to create the files necessary of the other games (D&D, PFRPG, etc.) but that could be a factor as well.

The two big takeaways are, qualitative quantifiable evidence that people would buy their product in VTT form and how much (money, time, effort, fill in the blank) will it take to get this off the ground? Having those two pieces would go a long way in helping garner support. However, many more questions could spawn from these two actions.


SJGames is wasting potential, and keeping themselves in the past. If they had their products in FG and other VTT, they could reach more customers, and gather more interest in their system, which lets face it, has a lot of good competitors

I wouldn't even mind to buy again (i have the physical books and several digital) some stuff I already have, but in FG

While the market is flush with potential right now, is it sustainable? I have had a devil of a time trying to put gaming groups together both in person before COVID struck and digitally after places went to various forms of stay at home requirements. Even trying to get into a game has been a challenge. But, your post does ignite the question of marketing.
An anecdote, I learned of GURPS's existence when I was just starting out in D&D back in the 90s. I did not investigate it until probably 2010 when, at a game store, a customer was selling their entire collection of GUPRS books. My first game in GURPS was not until 2012ish because I could not find anyone who was interested in playing. I fell in love with the system after that but find it hard to find players for that system near me.
Ok, now that I have the build up done. How does the SJG product find, reach and maintain the spotlight to get new players and keep the older ones? This is the challenge nearly every business faces. A rhetorical question: how did each of us first learn about GURPS? Though any name can really be put in there. I know that finding any GURPS book in print currently at a game store is rare. Though you can most likely find the competitors books in print on the shelves at nearly every game store.
Game stores, retailers and the like are all looking to make a profit. Products that sit on the shelf do not do the store, publisher, distributor or creator any good. I infer that the rarity of in print product is to help all those in the chain not lose money by product growing stale and sitting on the shelf.
I have read in other forums, supporters have addressed trying to get sponsorship to help bring products to the spotlight. Though I would imagine that comes at risk to both the sponsorer and sponsoree. And though some would take the valiant effort to do so independently, there is even risk there.

I do hope this opens the doors for collaboration. I, and looks to be many others, have an interest in seeing one of our favorite games come into the world of VTTs. A nod to all you who support this effort in whatever form or fashion you do.

Gigermann
August 20th, 2020, 19:54
I have learned that when statistics are produced, opinions are heard a bit more closely. Maybe not what Ronnke meant, but I would steer away from trying to directly influence the company's interest, and steer toward players' interest—that is, just talk about FG, games you're playing on FG, etc. Promote the platform—and the others, too (the more, the merrier).

@Mook: it's not over yet. Don't lose hope :P

The other side of this: SJG has said they don't have the resources to support this themselves. This will be a fan effort, just like GCA was in the beginning. Someone has to start that fan effort—we can start working on the content now that will become official later.

CD0369
August 20th, 2020, 20:19
Maybe not what Ronnke meant, but I would steer away from trying to directly influence the company's interest, and steer toward players' interest—that is, just talk about FG, games you're playing on FG, etc. Promote the platform—and the others, too (the more, the merrier).

@Mook: it's not over yet. Don't lose hope :P

The other side of this: SJG has said they don't have the resources to support this themselves. This will be a fan effort, just like GCA was in the beginning. Someone has to start that fan effort—we can start working on the content now that will become official later.

Excellent point with regard to interest. I notice that I did fail to identify my intent of "hey, we have X amount of people interested in supporting this." My apologies for any confusion. I am a late comer to scene and did not have the experience of watching GCA come to fruition. I could imagine that it was a project of love that developers invested their spare time in. I know that I lack the knowledge to do development work. I wouldn't mind learning but other responsibilities are holding priority presently. Though my hat goes off to those who are able to.

yako2020
August 20th, 2020, 21:23
I swear I'm trying hard.
I am thinking of making some videos, showing how to operate GURPS at FG.
I was thinking of having The Caravan as a base for Ein Arris, would I be in trouble?

Padre Moto
September 18th, 2020, 07:07
Maybe not what Ronnke meant, but I would steer away from trying to directly influence the company's interest, and steer toward players' interest—that is, just talk about FG, games you're playing on FG, etc. Promote the platform—and the others, too (the more, the merrier).

@Mook: it's not over yet. Don't lose hope :P

The other side of this: SJG has said they don't have the resources to support this themselves. This will be a fan effort, just like GCA was in the beginning. Someone has to start that fan effort—we can start working on the content now that will become official later.

First off, Hats Off to you folks who have spearheaded this venture on FG. I'm so impressed with the work everyone has generated.

Second, that YouTube video of you guys hosting a game for an SJG staffer was a great opportunity to showcase it.

Finally, I get the sense that SJG is very concerned about quality control of their products. I got that sense from watching the game you folks hosted

I would pay real money to subscribe to a SJG generated VTT, if that's what it took to get them to do it their way and I could invite players to enjoy playing GURPS.

But until that happens...keep up the good work fellas. Maybe we should be paying you guys some real money for your efforts.

yako2020
September 18th, 2020, 14:44
I agree with every word spoken by you, Padre Moto, I would pay and will be happy to pay if this beautiful material becomes available.
I don't know if the evolution of the ruleset is shown from time to time and with that the possibility of having something official here becomes closer.

ronnke
September 18th, 2020, 15:38
First off, Hats Off to you folks who have spearheaded this venture on FG. I'm so impressed with the work everyone has generated.
I would pay real money to subscribe to a SJG generated VTT, if that's what it took to get them to do it their way and I could invite players to enjoy playing GURPS.

Thanks!

I don't think SJG would ever make their own VTT, but the great thing is, they support (unofficially) our efforts here, so that's a good thing. I've been playing online weekly for over 10 years now, FG + GURPS ruleset has made that possible. I would love for SJG to get on board, as it would open up the possibilities for official content, but even if they don't, I will still be able to play GURPS every week for the next 10+ years with what we already have.

Padre Moto
September 18th, 2020, 16:24
Good stuff.

So with respect to accessing GURPS resources through the FG VTT, what is the current understanding to ensuring we aren't violating any copyright or intellectual rights?

For instance, with a licensed product, my understanding is that the Host and Players can access products such as rules, typically through some sort of embedded link in the interface itself.

However for our purposes that remains to be developed as I understand it.

So if one were to create an in-game embedded link to a PDF document on a cloud-like server (eg Google's My Drive) where a person could open GURPS Characters or Campaigns, but not download it (with that security feature engaged), would this be appropriate? My thinking is: if one were in a room physically with other players, passing around a resource book is perfectly acceptable and not a copyright infringement. If players could not save/download/copy the document, would that be a similar situation?

ronnke
September 19th, 2020, 00:01
I'm not a copyright lawyer so I can't say if that's appropriate or not, but I suspect it's not.

The community may create and share things like lists (equipment, skills, traits, effects, modifiers, etc). The content must be not contain descriptive text from GURPS published material.