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iiivsion
April 15th, 2020, 22:44
Hi,

branching that thread from 2nd ed to have a place to officially talk about a new approach to 4 ed (other than the "won't happen" post).

Common sense seems to most likely branching from Pauls WFRPG 2nd ed for the following reasons:
- 2ed offers far more functionality than 1st ed
- 3rd ed is well versed, but 4 is much more compatible to ed 2 than ed 3.
- Paul has offered to officially branch from the 2nd ed code as long as we refer to his base and publish here under same open licence and adhere to all official IP regulations.
- do not reuse stuff from a retracted 4 ed alpha since IP is not clear.

I personally am still in learning details from 2ed to 4ed and will need some while to adapt. I even master rounds with first edition (though second is functionally better).

So, anyone to draft a first rough version is welcome.

Valyar
April 16th, 2020, 04:33
What do you mean to "draft a first rough version"? To draft the features of the ruleset or to actually start working on the code?

iiivsion
April 16th, 2020, 17:38
Whatever brings us one step closer. If one could write down the needed changes would be a good start.

My first rough overview would be
- to change the script for attack rolls to calculate damage by successes instead of damage roll (though I do not 100% like the new opposed fighting test, I would keep the old script at hand to switch between both by option switch).
- add Fellowship (again)
- change list of skills and perhaps data type of skills (only if totally neccessary, I would try to keep as much datatypes stable as possible)
- to change how the skills work (taken and Mastery/Skill Levels removed, percentage value calculation changed) - here is the first part where I do have to read more of the 4 ed skill rules
- add a field for the "new" Weapon Damage Value (leave the old fields intact for optional damage die roll).

Mojosta
April 18th, 2020, 00:48
2e has fellowship but you will have to add dexterity and initiative to the attributes.

Skills will be a change like you said from buttons to being able to improve a single percentage at a time. (You can already do this in the xp tab, of the character sheet, for your attributes.

The exp spending system should actually work out well for 4e from the 2e system.
May want a way to highlight attributes you can advance via your career.

ShakyLuigi
April 18th, 2020, 10:55
I started two weeks ago trying to create an extenstion for MoreCore with the WFRPG 4th edition in mind. So far I have added all the characteristics and Basic skills with Base, Advances and Total values.
I have also finished the scripts that adds all of it together in a correct manner.

You can see how far (or short) I've gotten in the picture below (with much help from damned).

I have no experience in coding or xml besides what I've made here. But if it helps anyone, then I'm happy.

33919

damned
April 18th, 2020, 11:04
Looking good Shaky!

WyrdGM
April 22nd, 2020, 01:46
I got busy at work so have not had a ton of time to dig in, but I have been doing modifications to the roller that came with MoreCore to make a 4E roller for my group. It is contained and works with the Core ruleset.
When I am at my computer I will upload it if people want.

dmbrown
April 22nd, 2020, 03:19
Cool! So this could be incorporated into the branch of 2e to create a 4e version?

WyrdGM
April 22nd, 2020, 03:50
Cool! So this could be incorporated into the branch of 2e to create a 4e version?

Sure, I suppose, but with caveats.
1. I used MoreCore Diceroller as a basis. Right now I am learning lua, and the system. Someone else worked on that, and I don't know how permissions work for using someone else's extensions.
2. I still have some work to do on it. I want to give it an option for Quick Success Levels versus Standard Success Levels, etc
3. It is currently activated by typing /wfrp skill_percentage in the chat window
4. Modifiers, instead of modifying the die roll, modify the skill. I wanted this so that when I hook it up to sheets, it can just roll to the skill and add the mods.

I am unsure how everyone else is attaching their files standard, but this seems to at least have worked for me this time.
34181

Here is an image of it being used
34182

dmbrown
April 22nd, 2020, 04:52
Thanks. You’d have to ask permission and if it is Morecore than it is Damned.

We’re trying to put together a community ruleset for 4ed. I don’t know lua, but I am trying to learn a little. I could help out with graphics.

Who knows if we’re able to put together a nice ruleset maybe Smiteworks could approach Cubicle 7 and Games Workshop and try for an official one.

Pepor
April 22nd, 2020, 07:37
It looks promising!

ShakyLuigi
April 22nd, 2020, 13:25
Sure, I suppose, but with caveats.
1. I used MoreCore Diceroller as a basis. Right now I am learning lua, and the system. Someone else worked on that, and I don't know how permissions work for using someone else's extensions.
2. I still have some work to do on it. I want to give it an option for Quick Success Levels versus Standard Success Levels, etc
3. It is currently activated by typing /wfrp skill_percentage in the chat window
4. Modifiers, instead of modifying the die roll, modify the skill. I wanted this so that when I hook it up to sheets, it can just roll to the skill and add the mods.

I am unsure how everyone else is attaching their files standard, but this seems to at least have worked for me this time.
34181

Here is an image of it being used
34182

I am trying to build an extentsion for 4E in MoreCore. Could I try implementing this diceroll in this extenstion?

damned
April 22nd, 2020, 14:11
I am trying to build an extentsion for 4E in MoreCore. Could I try implementing this diceroll in this extenstion?

That looks a lot like the blackcrusade roll in MoreCore.

ShakyLuigi
April 22nd, 2020, 14:20
Well, he did say he used the MoreCore Diceroller as a basis, so it would make sense it looks like it.

WyrdGM
April 22nd, 2020, 16:45
It is the blackcrusade roll with some extra things built in, and some modifiers changed. I did use MoreCore for it. Like I said, still learning lua, so did not feel confident building one from scratch yet. These are my test examples. And it should be able to be imported into MoreCore without much issue at all.

iiivsion
April 26th, 2020, 03:19
I am also testing the possible ways:
- CoreRPG (lacks the diceroller), but with an extension could be pretty slim and quick
- MoreCore (works fine out of the box for all the basic stuff), have to say it has really good potential. With the blackcrusade diceroller you could start vanilla right out of the box... Create Attribute and Skills as diceroll based on the blackcrusade dice and p1-Parameter.
- Paul Pratts 2nd edition which is build on CoreRPG is also really good, feature rich and bug free and: Weapons and Armor and Carreers are just great... hard decision which way to go, especially since it is really important to keep the code maintenance at a minimum level for future releases...

dmbrown
April 26th, 2020, 17:55
I would go with branching Paul’s, which you mentioned he was ok with if he was given props and that it was posted back here. I looked through the 2ed forum and you can see here https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?34764-Warhammer-Fantasy-RPG-2-ed&p=475062&viewfull=1#post475062 item #6 that he added that because of a request a ways back for 4ed style combat. While it is not automated it is a good start and is built into the system. Maybe that could be taken as well as item #5 to add the fails and crits and expanded on?

ShakyLuigi
May 2nd, 2020, 17:53
Not sure if anyone else is doing something with this now, but I've tried to move forward with the extension I've started.

34779
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- Added Fate/Fortune and Resolve and Resilience frames.
- Added an experience frame.
- Added character info frame.
- Added ambitions frame.
- Made a script that calculates wounds based on characteristics (still missing to adjust for the Hardy talent, and Halflings Small talent)

Technically I think it is playable at this moment, though it needs some heavy work on the design.

Also, there is no automation with the dice rolls. I've tried to figure out how to make an object or square clickable for a dice roll, but that is way beyond what I understand.

I also need to figure out how to add advanced skills, including choosing which characterisic is relevant. I'm thinking a solution where you can add a line, where you write in the appropate skill, and choosing the characteristic. But how to make a dynamic list like that is also beyond what I understand right now.

Magic and prayers are missing atm. but I think this can be solved the same way as advanced skills. If I'm able to solve that. I've spent so many hours just trying to figure that out, and I don't feel any closer.

So, yeah, baby steps. If anyone knows how to solve the advanced skill and dice roll mechanics, I'd be really appreciative if they explained me how. Not afraid to put in the time to do the work, but the how is very puzzling for me.

ShakyLuigi
May 13th, 2020, 20:21
Just a quick update. I'm back working full time, so I don't have that much spare time mucking about with this.
But I have since last time:

- Added a corruption/mutation frame where it has a cell that calculates max corruption.
- Added an equipped armor and weapon with damage and armor (and total soak including Toughness and Willpower bonus). This is very simplified, but enough for simple use of the rules.
- I actually made a combobox with species, and added Hafling as a variable in the wounds total calculations.

So, not a whole lot since the last update, but I spent so much time on the combobox and wounds. "How hard can it be?", I thought. Very hard was the answer apparantly.

The rest with items, money and talents can basically be done in MoreCore natively.

All I am missing is the advanced skills, magic and prayers.
And of course dice rolls. But WyrdGM asked for my character sheet files to try and implement a few things. I of course gave them to him in the hopes his trying to add dice rolls.
Never thought of asking. Huh.

Tel Arin
May 19th, 2020, 22:37
The extension seems empty when i download it. I would like to test the extension

WyrdGM
May 19th, 2020, 22:53
I am also working full time, but I am still forging ahead with things. It has been a bit slow, but I should have time soon.

MiniCalvo
May 20th, 2020, 01:36
Very good, I would also like to try this extension, but it is empty.
Could you please upload the extension to test it?
Thank you and sorry for the inconvenience.

Altonath
May 23rd, 2020, 15:45
Hey! Nice job I'm very interested in triying the extension but like they said it looks like it's empty. Thank you WyrdGM!

WyrdGM
May 26th, 2020, 22:20
Hey! Nice job I'm very interested in triying the extension but like they said it looks like it's empty. Thank you WyrdGM!

My stuff is not ready. It's in a cowboy code state right now.
Work took over, so I had not been doing a ton. I hope to have some stuff maybe consumable by this weekend, but don't hold me to it.

My own group was also sad it took me so long. So much that one of the players went and bought Foundry. And while it definitely looks better than what I will be putting out, maybe I can at least do some cool things. Because I still like FG, and I already invested a bunch of time and effort into this. Maybe, though, I will put it on github soon, and then plenty of people can play. Have not decided yet.

https://imgur.com/a/km1g0G1

I am currently working on a dynamic skill list so I can predefine the basic skills, and then add in advanced skills. So far, this is where I keep hitting my biggest roadblock. I am tempted to fall back, create a static list, and then have a separate area for custom skills later.

In addition, I do want to figure out how to remove the Class, Level, Hero Points from the very top of the sheet, and just leave the Name, but my efforts have been stymied.

ShakyLuigi
May 27th, 2020, 18:07
I like the changes you've made to the extension I sent you. It really looks nice Wyrd!

Meanwhile, I've finally managed to find a solution to the advanced skill list, and have added that last sunday.
I prefer having two seperate lists, one for the basic skills everyone has, and one for the advanced.
But you can use this solution for adding a list of basic skills in the same list, and then just adding the advanced skills ad hoc in game.

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36161

I imagine I can use the same solution to add spells and prayers, and at that point it is a usable character sheet. Although without dicerolling, but it has everything to keep track of characters.

WyrdGM
May 27th, 2020, 18:37
I like the changes you've made to the extension I sent you. It really looks nice Wyrd!

Meanwhile, I've finally managed to find a solution to the advanced skill list, and have added that last sunday.
I prefer having two seperate lists, one for the basic skills everyone has, and one for the advanced.
But you can use this solution for adding a list of basic skills in the same list, and then just adding the advanced skills ad hoc in game.

36160
36161

I imagine I can use the same solution to add spells and prayers, and at that point it is a usable character sheet. Although without dicerolling, but it has everything to keep track of characters.

Yeah, I loved what you did with some things, and adapted it, though I changed some under the hood. The look you made was great. I have some auto updates and rolls built into mine. I hope to build them out more.
Currently, it's a single roll I have from the previous one I modified, but now that I know a bit more, I want to feed it things like [ATK] [DEF] [SKL] etc to have it do secondary read outs for the roll as well.

For example, you'd roll /wfrp 45 ATK (And maybe weapon mods codes?)
Then it would roll, determine SL, crits, hit loc, critical effect, etc
But if you did SKL it would avoid the hit location, crit effect (But would still advise that a crit was done)

iiivsion
June 8th, 2020, 21:33
Yeah, I loved what you did with some things, and adapted it, though I changed some under the hood. The look you made was great. I have some auto updates and rolls built into mine. I hope to build them out more.
Currently, it's a single roll I have from the previous one I modified, but now that I know a bit more, I want to feed it things like [ATK] [DEF] [SKL] etc to have it do secondary read outs for the roll as well.

For example, you'd roll /wfrp 45 ATK (And maybe weapon mods codes?)
Then it would roll, determine SL, crits, hit loc, critical effect, etc
But if you did SKL it would avoid the hit location, crit effect (But would still advise that a crit was done)

Hi, I wasn't around for a while. Looks very promising. From the screens I would guess you made an character and rolls extension for morecore? Would you mind to pm me your extension? If I could be of help with rolls/scripts or other mechanics, please tell me what you want to accomplish. Also, damned seems to be glad to include new dicerolls into morecore to be available for all users. Are you testing your extension also against FGU?

WyrdGM
June 8th, 2020, 21:45
Hi, I wasn't around for a while. Looks very promising. From the screens I would guess you made an character and rolls extension for morecore? Would you mind to pm me your extension? If I could be of help with rolls/scripts or other mechanics, please tell me what you want to accomplish. Also, damned seems to be glad to include new dicerolls into morecore to be available for all users. Are you testing your extension also against FGU?

Sorry, I am afraid not yet. I planned on doing this, then have been working 12+ hour days for the past couple weeks. I'll work on wrapping some together soon so people can play with it.
It is for morecore at the moment. leveraging what is already there with my limited time right now.
I have not tested FGU, as I only have classic.

iiivsion
June 9th, 2020, 03:05
Thank you :-)
As I have the same problem with my job, please do in no way feel pushed by me. I am struggling keeping my Warhammer 1e campaign going at the moment...

I do not have purchased FGU yet (still waiting for Steam availability to update my Ultimate FGC), but my Demo or Beta-FGU-Version (not really sure what I downloaded some time ago) allows me to load and test modules as long as I do not try to connect players. So I can at least run a basic test on FGU then. I do this every now and then with all campaign and modules to prevent developing in some unsupported or problematic fashion.

ShakyLuigi
June 10th, 2020, 19:46
Everything I made I did in FGU. I have the full version. So the basics should work there. I could test the things that Wyrd has added and changed if there are things that are uncertain would function there.

iiivsion
August 30th, 2020, 00:36
ShakyLuigi, WyrdGM: Could you please provide the extension in some way? Are you still testing it/developing it or in need for some automation? At the moment I am updating my Enemy Within campaign to the new 4th Edition version, it would be nice to check if I could also use the modules with morecore...

ShakyLuigi
August 31st, 2020, 19:48
I think I've gotten as far as I can get with this project. I just keep hitting challenges I can't solve within a reasonable time.
I'll see if I can manage to post the extension I've made so far on this thread within a short time. I just need to clean up the files a bit as I have quite a bit of "junk" files as reference at the moment.

iiivsion
September 1st, 2020, 20:39
Hi Luigi, thanks. Would be very nice.

I started some time ago with Warhammer 1st Ed campaigns and am moving all my campaigns now to Warhammer 2ed and have a development branch which maybe someday work also completely for 4th (still missing the Numbers in the skills and some fields).

In the end, I also tried to use CoreRPG and MoreCore as Basis. By now I would say I do not need all of the fields and automation offered by 2nd (which is really great). But for my style of prepping adventures I am into much more lightweight NPC-sheets. I even wrote an extension to 2nd to reduce the NPC data and inserted the "notes" field from CoreRPG and MoreCore again. Even after many hours of platesting, I am not fully sure if I would go rather with MoreCore and begin from scratch to program the few things I need or if I stick with 2nd, maybe "extend" it to be a little more lightwight on some objects.

Best Regards

ShakyLuigi
September 20th, 2020, 13:25
Okey, this took a lot longer than it should have, but work and other private matters came in the way.

I've tried to remove all of the junk files that I've used underways, but there are probably more things to remove.

This extension is by no means finished, but I feel I've reached the limits of my abilities, and if someone wishes to carry on the work they are more than welcome to.
All I ask is if this is used as a basis for an extension, that I am credited for the work that I did. Otherwise feel free to do what you want.
If there are things I can help with, questions to how I was thinking or other clarifications, feel free to ask. I will help to the best of my abilities.

Tel Arin
September 21st, 2020, 00:27
Okey, this took a lot longer than it should have, but work and other private matters came in the way.

I've tried to remove all of the junk files that I've used underways, but there are probably more things to remove.

This extension is by no means finished, but I feel I've reached the limits of my abilities, and if someone wishes to carry on the work they are more than welcome to.
All I ask is if this is used as a basis for an extension, that I am credited for the work that I did. Otherwise feel free to do what you want.
If there are things I can help with, questions to how I was thinking or other clarifications, feel free to ask. I will help to the best of my abilities.

I can't run it in the more core ruleset (FGU & FGC).

Thanks in advance!

Pepor
September 21st, 2020, 06:41
I cannot run it either unless I decompress the extension into a folder. Even though, I am getting different kind of errors once it works.

Trenloe
September 21st, 2020, 14:06
The extension have been compressed with RAR compression. It needs to be ZIP compression.

iiivsion
September 21st, 2020, 22:05
Hi, it works nicely for me. Thank you very much for uploading. I unrared/rezipped it so others could run it "out of the box". -> see two posts below

Pepor
September 22nd, 2020, 07:50
Hi, it works nicely for me. Thank you very much for uploading. I unrared/rezipped it so others could run it "out of the box".

39558

Sorry, but I have to tell you that you rezipped it wrong. You rezipped the folder. In order to make it work, you have to compress the content of the folder.

Anyway, I am getting different kind of error the first time I create a character or I click on the Main tab.

https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=39562&d=1600757390


https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=39563&d=1600757404


39562
39563

iiivsion
September 23rd, 2020, 21:04
[QUOTE=iiivsion;543789]Hi, it works nicely for me. Thank you very much for uploading. I unrared/rezipped it so others could run it "out of the box".
now zipped the right way ->
39622

ShakyLuigi
September 26th, 2020, 12:11
Sorry, but I have to tell you that you rezipped it wrong. You rezipped the folder. In order to make it work, you have to compress the content of the folder.

Anyway, I am getting different kind of error the first time I create a character or I click on the Main tab.

https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=39562&d=1600757390


https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=39563&d=1600757404


39562
39563

I had a quick look in the code trying to figure out the errors.
The errors on line 403 and 451 is because it is trying to calculate "Wounds" and "Defence" and trying to grab the value from "Toughness". This value is empty when creating a new character, and therefore you get an error.
Should function normally when you add some values.

The last error is probably some sort of remainder from a code I used from D&D 3rd edt. I think.

I hope this is of some use. As I said, I have never coded anything before in my life, so there is bound to be alot of errors in this.