Subscription types, rotating DMs, and books/rulesets

[duus]

Hello. Sorry about this nOOb question. My table wants to migrate to Pathfinder 2 on this platform (we don't use FG yet.) If I were only going to be the DM, then I'd probably buy the Ultimate license and buy the rulesets/books and then the rest of my table would get free licenses. No problem.

However, our table rotates who is the DM. So I guess that means we all need to buy Standard licenses. That is also no problem. This is the problem: does that mean we *each* need to buy the rulesets/books too? Because that would be a significant increase in cost.

Is there a solution I'm not seeing here? (And surely there are other people who play the way my table plays?)

Thanks!

[Zacchaeus]

Hi duss, welcome to the community.

Indeed, only the DM can share modules such as rulebooks so if you are going to rotate then each of you would need to purchase whatever materials you wanted. One thing that some groups do that rotate GMs is to take out a subscription and when it's the next DMs go the first cancels and the next subscribes.

[Neovirtus]

Unfortunately that is the biggest limitation I see in the software, and the hardest thing to stomach as a new user. Even something as simple as keeping the current rules, but being allowed to change who is designated as the DM in the session would be a massive improvement.

edit: I will say that the way my group has dealt with it has been that I have been the DM for the first period of time, so my group pitched in to buy license/s (in my case ultimate, but all standards works too) and DM materials (DMG MM etc), over the course of my game the players have over time purchased their own licenses and PHB etc on sale as they come up. If you wait for sales, and don't buy everything in one go, it feels more palatable. Now we're starting up another game with a new DM, and he just needed to buy a pre-written module and PHB and Xanathars to share with the players. I can see how as you keep going around everyone eventually gets all the content. But there's no ignoring the cost in the long term.

[Talyn]

This situation, while common, isn't unique to Fantasy Grounds. Pretty much every digital media has very specific user/licensing. Your MP3s only work on your account. Your ebooks only work on your account. Wanna play Call of Duty or Division with friends? You all need to own it because the games only work on your account. An expansion came out? Everyone has to buy it to play together. And so on.

Now ... one thing FG users did for years before Wizards and Paizo signed on was to make their own data modules. There was basically no other choice, and at least Paizo is extremely generous with their OGL so there's tons of Pathfinder 1E OGL content here on the forums for free. Pathfinder 2E is much newer so not as much has been made yet, but it's coming (both community stuff and retail stuff). And with the OGL stuff, that is obviously freely available to use and to share with your friends and players. That's probably what I'd look into if I were coming in brand-new and wanting to shift not only to a new platform (FG) but a new game system (PFRPG2). The actual PFRPG ruleset comes free with your FG install. It just lacks content (at least I don't think the SRD module has been released yet???) which is where either community OGL content, retail content, or entering the data yourself will come in.

[LordEntrails]

Also note that one of the only times I recommend purchasing from Steam in in this case, they have a 4 for the price of 3 standard license pack. Not sure the link, but lots of people have mentioned it before so should be do-able :) Doesn't help with the DLC though.

[duus]

I will say that the way my group has dealt with it has been that I have been the DM for the first period of time, so my group pitched in to buy license/s (in my case ultimate, but all standards works too) and DM materials (DMG MM etc), over the course of my game the players have over time purchased their own licenses and PHB etc on sale as they come up. If you wait for sales, and don't buy everything in one go, it feels more palatable. Now we're starting up another game with a new DM, and he just needed to buy a pre-written module and PHB and Xanathars to share with the players. I can see how as you keep going around everyone eventually gets all the content. But there's no ignoring the cost in the long term.

Thanks Lavoiejh, that's a reasonable way to do it. After all, we may rotate but the plan initially is that I run a module to get our feet wet in the new system and then, if it all runs smoothly, I'll run an AP. By the time that is done, the next person can buy an Ultimate license and whatever books but that could be, like, years from now honestly. Thinking about it that way makes it more reasonable. I'll probably go that route. Thanks!

[damned]

I would definitely not aim to buy everything in this situation (or for many buyers).
each GM should have the PHB and the module they are running.
grab them when on sale.
if a player really needs a class/option in a particular sourcebook they can buy that and they can use that in any game they play - just others cant use it if the owner isnt also the gm.

[damned]

Also there are other systems that the group/gm might like to try instead of 5E that might be overall cheaper - Savage Worlds or Call of Cthulhu?

[LordEntrails]

Also there are other systems that the group/gm might like to try instead of 5E that might be overall cheaper - Savage Worlds or Call of Cthulhu?
OP said PF2 :)

[Neovirtus]

Glad my comment was helpful Duus, a couple other thoughts -

1)if you have a constant group, it may make more sense to use standard licenses, rather than buying multiple Ultimate licenses. (in fact it most certainly will, and there are other benefits, such as people being able to start their own instances to mess with their characters and such)

2) if a future DM is looking to run an Adventure Path, they will likely need basically nothing other than that, and player supplements. The prewritten adventures contain all the monsters and items in them, so you don't really need anything else. I personally recommend focusing on the books that contain player options, then Adventure module OR Bestiary if you're homebrewing.

edit: just remembered you are looking at Pathfinder. Sorry, edited to reflect that. Adventure paths provide everything you need, otherwise for homebrewing get the base books.

[duus]

Okay, additional nOOb question. So I downloaded the demo, tried to make a PF2 character, but there weren't any ancestries or classes or anything. I thought the PF2 "ruleset' was included, but i guess the ancestries, classes, etc., are part of the "rulebook" that I need to buy and that's not the "ruleset"?

I've noticed this:

> You don't have to re-purchase any add-ons for FGU.

So is the core PF2 rulebook an "add-on" which I would not need to repurchase for FGU?

(Maybe the FAQ can include a glossary of these terms?)

[JohnD]

Okay, additional nOOb question. So I downloaded the demo, tried to make a PF2 character, but there weren't any ancestries or classes or anything. I thought the PF2 "ruleset' was included, but i guess the ancestries, classes, etc., are part of the "rulebook" that I need to buy and that's not the "ruleset"?

I've noticed this:

> You don't have to re-purchase any add-ons for FGU.

So is the core PF2 rulebook an "add-on" which I would not need to repurchase for FGU?

(Maybe the FAQ can include a glossary of these terms?)

DLC that works with Classic is supposed to work with Unity. That's been the plan all along. So, if you get the PF2 book now, it will work with FGU when it comes out.

[duus]

DLC that works with Classic is supposed to work with Unity. That's been the plan all along. So, if you get the PF2 book now, it will work with FGU when it comes out.

Cool, thanks!

[damned]

From the home page:

Rulesets
2E, 3.5E, 4E, 5E, FATECore, PFRPG, PFRPG2, Numenera, SFRPG

Data Libraries
D&D 5e SRD , D&D 5e Basic Rules , D&D 3.5E SRD, FATECore, Pathfinder SRD libraries

All other content is mostly paid for.
There is a PF2 SRD bestiary on the forums I think.

There is lots of PF1 SRD content.

The rest of the PF content is an add on.

[duus]

From the home page:

Rulesets
2E, 3.5E, 4E, 5E, FATECore, PFRPG, PFRPG2, Numenera, SFRPG

Data Libraries
D&D 5e SRD , D&D 5e Basic Rules , D&D 3.5E SRD, FATECore, Pathfinder SRD libraries

All other content is mostly paid for.
There is a PF2 SRD bestiary on the forums I think.

The rest of the PF content is an add on.

Ok, I think I'm getting it, thanks. So if I understand it correctly...the core rulebook is the SRD (...right?) so if any of us get a standard license there's no reason to buy the core rulebook in addition. Right?

Again, sorry if this is obvious.

[LordEntrails]

The rulesets have the mechanics. They have the character sheets and they know what a weapon is and a shield is and how to change the attack and defense. BUT, the rulesets don't have the actual items (swords, classes, spells, etc).

The SRDs have a basic set of items (classes, etc) so that people can have enough to get a flavor of the game and so that third party publishers can create compatible information.

The DLC rulebooks have all the items (races, classes, weapons, etc). But, if you want to spend the time, you can create all (or mostly all) of those things yourself through the interface. It's a lot of typeing / copy/paste etc, so most people feel it's worth their time to buy the FG versions of the books (i.e. DLC). But you can buy them as you need/want them and in the meantime enter just what you need manually.

[damned]

Have a look here for more info on the Pathfinder SRD
https://www.d20pfsrd.com/

And here for the 5E SRD
https://dnd.wizards.com/articles/features/systems-reference-document-srd

There is a while lot of history but basically way back in D&D 3E or 3.5E the Wizards released a whole bunch of Core info as free to use and reuse providing you follow the terms of the Open Gaming License.

They still have products they sell, and still have much content that is not in the SRD.

The Pathfinder Core Rules are here:
https://www.fantasygrounds.com/store/product.php?id=PZOSMWPZO2101FG

and the other PF2 material that is available on FG is here
https://www.fantasygrounds.com/store/?sys=24&pub=43&typ=-1&search=&sort=1

For 5E the Core rulebooks are
Players Handbook https://www.fantasygrounds.com/store/product.php?id=WOTC5EPHBDELUXE
Monster Manual https://www.fantasygrounds.com/store/product.php?id=WOTC5EMMDELUXE
Dungeon Masters Guide https://www.fantasygrounds.com/store/product.php?id=WOTC5EDMG
but there are many more...
https://www.fantasygrounds.com/store/?sys=16&pub=29&typ=-1&search=&sort=1

Pathfinder 1 has more books again...

You do not need all books to play

Pathfinder 2 probably does require the DLC
5E you can start with the SRD (included) for no extra cost
Pathfinder 1 you can start with included and forum available material for no extra cost

[Trenloe]

The "Pathfinder SRD" mentioned with the base product is the first edition SRD. If you’re playing Pathfinder Second Edition you’ll either need to enter all the data you need manually as you need it (a lot of work) or purchase the Core Rules DLC.

[The High Druid]

For RPG systems that Fantasy Grounds doesn't officially support, our group's solution was to have each player responsible for creating a module with the data their character would use e.g. race, class/career, spells/powers, weapons/gear, etc.