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Matchstick
November 28th, 2006, 16:25
From the WotC site, here is the text of the survey they are presenting. Note the very last entry, about the Digital Gaming Table. Looks like they are going to move into competition with FG.

I did see the other thread that was sort of about this, but I thought it might be better to seperate this from the 4th Edition debate.

I have to say that this isn't something I would subscribe to, I don't go to the WotC site as it is.

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The Dungeons & Dragons Insider Package

Become a Dungeons & Dragons Insider and gain access to exclusive content designed specifically with D&D players in mind. As part of your monthly subscription, you gain access to features designed to enhance your D&D experience, including:

D&D Insider Magazine, online magazine with new content updated daily, including:

-Product Previews (articles showcasing upcoming D&D products)
-Class Features (articles expanding existing character class options and debuting new character and prestige classes)
-Strategy and Tactics (articles relating to D&D roleplaying combat and spellcasting, and to D&D Miniatures Skirmish play)
-Design and Development (articles and columns exploring the many facets of the D&D experience, written by game designers in D&D R&D)
-D&D Humor (comic strips devoted to the D&D experience)

D&D Product Enhancements (expanded content for D&D products you bought, including interactive content such as searchable indexes, extra features, behind the scenes articles, game designer and developer commentary, and more)

Exclusive Content that expands your favorite campaign world

-Eberron and Forgotten Realms ongoing content
-Interactive maps
-World events and adventure hooks

D&D University

-Rolling six-week course to help make you a better D&D player
-Course message boards
-Player tip of the week from D&D R&D

- MyCharacter.Com pages that you can design and populate, with a Premium Customization Kit that includes D&D art, frames, and icons
- Private Message Boards that give you a direct line to D&D R&D
- Premium RPGA Membership Card mailed to you
- Fast Lane Registration at all RPGA events (online and in the real world)
- The Magic Shop, a virtual shop where you can outfit your D&D character

D&D Character Builder, a program that helps you create and manage your D&D characters. This program allows you to create a character for any D&D game, walking you through the process of rolling the dice and assigning your game statistics, as well as creating a visual version of your character using "paper doll" models and "drag and click" selections of armor and weapons. At the end, you can save your character and print out a character sheet, as well as go to any D&D tournament and call up your character for use, or use the character at the Virtual Gaming Table (see below). With this package, you get to create and store up to 10 different characters or up to 10 different versions of one character (your character at different levels), or some combination of the two.

-Exclusive D&D-related novels and short stories written by your favorite authors
-Real-World D&D Search Engines (find D&D gamers, game stores, tournaments, and events in your area)
-In-Game D&D Search Engines (find feats, spells, magic items, and other D&D-related topics)

Digital Gaming Table, a program that allows you to play D&D using the Internet as your kitchen table, with a viewable play surface, dice rolling, virtual miniatures, and voice chat. Now you don't have to wait for your home gaming group to get together to play a game of D&D. You can still play your weekly face-to-face game, but now you can also play two or three more times a week by finding a game at the virtual table. Or, you might want to reconnect with your old gaming pals who long ago moved away-now you can all play together again on a regular basis! With this package, you get to play at the table 3 times per month.

Malovech
November 28th, 2006, 19:04
With this package, you get to play at the table 3 times per month.

3 Times per month? What a crock!

Veilel
November 28th, 2006, 20:02
Where did you find this info ?

Matchstick
November 28th, 2006, 20:49
It was posted on the front page of ENWorld (http://www.enworld.org) and has engendered some debate on the message boards there. I hadn't heard anything about them trying to do an online PnP app, and of course thought of FG right away, so I figured I'd post over here as well.

There has been no official announcement from WotC about this offering, or its price. That text, as I understand it, is the text from an online survey that you can get at the WotC site.

LordTomar
November 28th, 2006, 22:50
yeah it also sounds like its a pay per month kind of thing... since I dont need or want most of the benefits, I say no thanks.

sunbeam60
November 29th, 2006, 08:02
Ha ha ha ... things like this can only be a good thing, to be honest. If players start looking at this Digital Gaming Table, then surely the talk will turn to Fantasy Grounds too. Granted, there's the issue of data-availability, as in FG can only do SRD while the DGT can use all of WotC's product identity, but whatever the DGT is, it's bound to take a long time to catch up to FG.

Besides, I use FG because it rocks, not because it's the only one there. DGT, pffft bring it on.

Veilel
November 29th, 2006, 09:17
I am interested in it as well ...

Cantstanzya
November 29th, 2006, 11:44
The good thing about this is that all the people crying about the pricing of FG will realize that FG is a good deal.

Matchstick
November 29th, 2006, 14:34
Ha ha ha ... things like this can only be a good thing, to be honest. If players start looking at this Digital Gaming Table, then surely the talk will turn to Fantasy Grounds too. Granted, there's the issue of data-availability, as in FG can only do SRD while the DGT can use all of WotC's product identity, but whatever the DGT is, it's bound to take a long time to catch up to FG.

I agree regarding both the gaming table and the character generator. Up until this point WotC hasn't had a great (or even good) track record with the software they've tried to release, and I can't imagine these are going to be any better. I very much doubt that the gaming table will even approach the functionality of FG, at least initially. I'm thinking both of those pieces of software will be low functionality to begin with, just so they could be advertised.

devinnight
November 29th, 2006, 21:55
call me antagonistic, but if WOTC wanted to get into the game I think there app would be just as good as FG at launch... now, I think it won't be as good a deal if you have to pay to use it and are limited to certain times.

If they decide to make an app all they have to do is look at all the apps out there including this one, take notes on what works and what doesn't work, buy a few copies and reverse engineer out the parts they like and make their own app. (I know it's not that easy)

That is if they have been paying attention and really plan on doing this. They already have a huge market base, a large community of people that would pay for the use of their material, artists, writers, etc...
They could of course still screw it up, but I think they probably decided to get serious about it and have thier own team workin on it.

A lot of the work has already been done by other companies all they need to do is throw money and some talent at it and wham instant residual income.

I'll stick with FG's openesss and free playing.

Moebius
November 30th, 2006, 11:36
I think this answers the question of why did Wotc didnt renew the contract for licensing third parties to create datasets with their content.

They want to move into this market and I hope that fact does not hurt FG.

As long as FG can provide D&D playing service we will have a much cheaper option to whatever services they have in mind, that is our only weapon.

Matchstick
November 30th, 2006, 15:59
call me antagonistic, but if WOTC wanted to get into the game I think there app would be just as good as FG at launch... now, I think it won't be as good a deal if you have to pay to use it and are limited to certain times.

If they decide to make an app all they have to do is look at all the apps out there including this one, take notes on what works and what doesn't work, buy a few copies and reverse engineer out the parts they like and make their own app. (I know it's not that easy)

That is if they have been paying attention and really plan on doing this. They already have a huge market base, a large community of people that would pay for the use of their material, artists, writers, etc...
They could of course still screw it up, but I think they probably decided to get serious about it and have thier own team workin on it.

A lot of the work has already been done by other companies all they need to do is throw money and some talent at it and wham instant residual income.

I'll stick with FG's openesss and free playing.

All that makes sense. I think a lot (maybe the whole deal) will depend on the quality of the applications they put out. If the character generator is very good and includes all the expansion and splat books people will be more inclined to pay. If the digital gaming table is something more than just a vitual die roller with chat people will be more inclined to pay.

devinnight
November 30th, 2006, 17:19
The success really depends on how well they pull it off. If they incorporated the character builder into the program, and you used it when you leveled up, and had access to all the material online, that would be pretty slick.

If they really wanted to take over they could build the VGT to include such games as Heroscape (an introduction to mini wargaming, comes with a lot of great terrain) their own mini-centric games and even their board games.

Having a verstile and slick program would get a lot of people to enlist into virtual gaming.

I think FG would still do very well considering that you aren't limited by WOTC, and that the developers here listen more than the large corporation would. Just my opinion of course.

-D

neceros
November 30th, 2006, 23:05
The success really depends on how well they pull it off. If they incorporated the character builder into the program, and you used it when you leveled up, and had access to all the material online, that would be pretty slick.

To the contrary, I admire Fantasy Grounds for it's openness. Too many calculations and you start to watch the game play in front of you, witting on the sidelines. I enjoy the fact that I can enter "Anything" into the class property and FG doesn't yell at me for being retarded.

I do find a few things about FG annoying and would love to see improvements. Mostly in the map's area and the control the GM has over the players. GMs should be able to 'give' players maps and drawings, which the players can pull up when they want to. There's no need to force player's views on current maps to be stationed where the GM last Updated the picture. That's what fog of war is for.

The Velvet Souljah
December 2nd, 2006, 16:56
The licensing would be a huge difference in my mind...if WoTC adventures/books were simultaneously being made available in digital format and ready to go for a virtual gaming table then I think they would have a very compelling offering in the D&D market.

WoTC does a lot of things rather poorly in my not so humble opinion but what they do well...they do very well. By virtue of having more resources, more money, more expertise than most game companies, they're pretty good at setting expectations and meeting deadlines.

I have enjoyed playing with FG, but would jump at the opportunity to get on board with a bigger company thats a bit more adept at turning out product and has no licensing issues.

Price? Honestly, I don't care...I have money to spend on my hobby and not enough time to enjoy them. I'm not going to spend what little time I do have complaining about a monthly if the product really does deliver.

Dedeko
December 2nd, 2006, 17:24
while WoTC have an advantage in owning a lotta content, let the best program win like competition dictates. That 3 times per month just better be an idea that will get shot down when implemented.

richvalle
December 2nd, 2006, 17:41
And WoTC's track record for making quality software, 'big company and more resources' and all, is not good.

But, time will tell. If its decent, the other information provided is worthwhile and it doesn't cost a lot, I'd sign up. Nothing says you can only use one VT at a time!

rv

Griogre
December 2nd, 2006, 19:05
I have to agree with richvalle, but it should be noted that WotC never made any software they simply hired a developer or licenesed rights to developers - still as a producer they apparently are very poor with software. In the past they have shown no ability to ensure a quality product comes out.

I am keeping an open mind. If what comes out is usefull and works well then I would be willing to use it. However, from their track record, I would expect an ill born child at launch. One of the joys of such an online project is that over time mis-steps and mistakes can be corrected and you might well end up with a situation like e-Tools which was non functional on release but after several patches became worth while.

richvalle
December 2nd, 2006, 20:01
One nice thing is that >I< won't have to be the one to test it. With boards like ENWorld someone will sign up and I'll hear all about the good and bad. Then I can make an informed (well, as informed as I can based on others opinions) decision.

rv

Griogre
December 3rd, 2006, 03:35
*grin* You gotta love enworld. :)

The Velvet Souljah
December 3rd, 2006, 05:35
And WoTC's track record for making quality software, 'big company and more resources' and all, is not good.

It's certainly no worse than anyone else's in this industry...

Kalan
December 3rd, 2006, 10:11
The big thing I'd be concerned about is cost. Even the few PDF products they have released from their shelves cost the same as the hardcover books.

Unless they link it somehow to the purchase of the books, I could forsee them charging the same price for their electronic formats of the products as they do their print versions.

If that's the case...no thanks...I'll stick to SRD material...

V

Snikle
December 9th, 2006, 18:59
This will definitely be interesting to see how this plays out, and how the community reacts to it. I can see it doing very well (even given their track record, and even if it is made poorly) as the hordes of D&Ders will leap at the ability to play it online. Look at how many people play the online games like Everquest etc, there are many many people that would readily play using a VGT (that our new 'it' word?).
I see WotC releasing upgrades/modules through this medium either as add-ons or inclusive to a subscription method. Either way would be a boon to the industry and make them plenty of money, releasing something digitally has got to be cheaper than printing and selling hardback books.
And I agree, the only thing that will save FG is the fact that you can play other systems on it, but that doesn't mean WotC VGT wont crush everyone anyway. WotC just has the trademark and copyrights, everyone will jump to their program.

Sigurd
December 11th, 2006, 20:54
I'm currently in a good game and the DM does heroic work to make things 'just right'. FG is a wonderful tool for our campaign mostly because it doesn't get in his way.

With every appreciation of Smyteworks -- I'm still glad they don't have to keep a server for me to play Fantasy grounds.

If we want to change a rule we do. Our game is as public and as private as the dm wants to make it.


I think WOTC will fall down on all of those things. I'm not inherently against WOTC but I won't pay a monthly fee to another company, so my friend can do all the work. I dont want to wade through a thousand adds to then try and create my mythic world. I dont want to remove myself or my friend from the equation and play some sort of waterred down online game even if it is temptingly easy to do.

It may create a big pool of online players but I think experiamental players will gravitate to platforms with more freedom.

S

Aescleal
December 17th, 2006, 08:32
I would like a link to the page the OP copied this from. I search WotC pages and I can't find this anywhere.

A link would be appreciated.

Thanks!

Snikle
December 17th, 2006, 10:06
I believe I read somewhere that this was a random poll that popped up for some visitors to the WotC forum, after they finished polling it went bye bye.

Aescleal
December 18th, 2006, 03:03
Why are folks hung up on 3 games per month?
The quote is:

Digital Gaming Table, a program that allows you to play D&D using the Internet as your kitchen table, with a viewable play surface, dice rolling, virtual miniatures, and voice chat. Now you don't have to wait for your home gaming group to get together to play a game of D&D. You can still play your weekly face-to-face game, but now you can also play two or three more times a week by finding a game at the virtual table. Or, you might want to reconnect with your old gaming pals who long ago moved away-now you can all play together again on a regular basis! With this package, you get to play at the table 3 times per month.
Okay, so in there it also says
"but now you can also play two or three more times a week by finding a game at the virtual table"
Maybe it's just me, but I'm reading the 3/month part as an example... in light of it coming right on the heals of 2-3/week, in the same paragraph.
Also, I didn't read any of this as you have to pay a monthly fee to use a VGT. I read into this as any fee would be associated with being in the club, so-to-speak, and that is just how I would gain access to the VGT. That does not mean a VGT won't be a downloadable program, just like FG... in fact, unless told otherwise, the VGT could actually be FG. Staff here have not participated in these discussions to state otherwise at this point.
So a lot of speculation is going on, and while it's great to generate a healthy discussion about it, I think we should get grounded, and not jump to wild conclusions.
I read here alot but don't post. So chalk this up to just my 2cents!

richvalle
December 18th, 2006, 14:05
I see your 2 cents and raise you a nickel!

:)

I still read the number of games per month as a hard 3. Its possible they could have different levels of subscription and one of the things you get as you pay more is more games per month.

You are right about the VGT being part of a package deal. In fact, if the rest of the package is good enough I might sign up for access and just ignore the VTG.

I don't think they will go with a 'downloadable program' but something where players login to a central place where WoTC can control access.

Until WoTC comes out with more information the quoted poll is all we have to go on. Though I heard they have either cut down or stopped posting some information online and the speculation is that WoTC is stocking up to post content on the 'pay for information' site.

Aescleal
December 18th, 2006, 17:34
Fair enough! :) I understand what you mean, and I know everyone has their own spin on what they read. I'm going to wait for more information, but I'm really hoping someday soon we'll hear that Smiteworks has signed on with Wizards as the developer for a new VGT! :)
I know I'm dreaming, but FG is a wonderful tool; best I've seen for ease of use and a table feel.
Cheers

Aescleal
December 25th, 2006, 19:03
Merry Christmas to all,

I'm surfing about, and I thought I'd drop in here to see if any news was discovered about this, in the past week. I'm quite sure that if there were news, it would get posted, but I thought I'd ask anyways!

Cheers, and Happy Holidays!

Aescleal
January 10th, 2007, 00:58
Two weeks old, so I thought I'd bump this. :)

damned
January 3rd, 2018, 23:18
Hohoho for a thread necro to bring on the new year!
Well now we know how this panned out :)

LordEntrails
January 3rd, 2018, 23:27
Hohoho for a thread necro to bring on the new year!
Well now we know how this panned out :)
Ugh, I hope you feel some shame for necroing this!

Nylanfs
January 4th, 2018, 00:14
I'm glad I'm still ignoring that "other" thread.

damned
January 4th, 2018, 01:01
No shame. I was searching on something else completely unrelated and saw this old post and it was interesting in comparing the discussions from back then to even just a couple of years ago when the 5e deal hadnt quite been done.