Sorry - probably stupid questions concerning steam and basics

[Karkong]

Hello,

I apologize for the possible stupidity of the questions and my apalling spelling and grammar but I can't find them answered. I'll try to be brief:


I bought the steam 4 pack and I wonder how I can invite my friends. I received only a single key I can see - is this key valid for four copies of the game? Or how can I give away the game to my friends? I bought it "for myself" and not "as a gift". Was this a mistake on my part and if yes, how do I rectify this?
Concerning addons, my friend would like to GM Symbaroum. As far as I understand, only he needs to purchase the addon and everyone else ("the players") can use his copy to create characters and read the books (allowed by the GM) using the "Library - Reference Manual" function. Can they still do so once they disconnect?
Can the GM use a book owned by a player in his campaign? Say, in D&D terms, can a player use special character rules in some kind of "Players Guide"?
Can everyone read that book (provided the GM allows access)?
If yes - can another player who doesn't own that book use these rules?


The last items make only sense in my opinion, that's just like a real pen & paper game works - but in the age of DRM and idiocy, I'd like to be sure.

Thanks

[Talyn]

I don't use the Steam store so I can't help ya with that first one. The rest, though:


Correct, the GM (host) is the only user who is required to have DLC, in your example, the Symbaroum ruleset. When players connect, all DLC the GM owns will show up as available for them in their Library window. FG is not a cloud service, however, so they'll have to make sure the GM has their FG running to connect in order to create/maintain their character.
No. Only the host (GM) will auto-share player-facing DLC. If a player owns some DLC and wishes to use it, the GM will receive a dialog popup to allow/deny use of that DLC in their campaign. So anything a player owns is only usable by that player, it will never be shared with either the GM or any other players.

[Karkong]

Thanks, I appreciate your answers.


Correct, the GM (host) is the only user who is required to have DLC, in your example, the Symbaroum ruleset. When players connect, all DLC the GM owns will show up as available for them in their Library window. FG is not a cloud service, however, so they'll have to make sure the GM has their FG running to connect in order to create/maintain their character.So I understand: The GM should own each and every book, because only he can share it for everyones benefit. He needs to run FG in the background so everyone can connect and read the books when not playing.



No. Only the host (GM) will auto-share player-facing DLC. If a player owns some DLC and wishes to use it, the GM will receive a dialog popup to allow/deny use of that DLC in their campaign. So anything a player owns is only usable by that player, it will never be shared with either the GM or any other players.
So the GM can't even build an opinion concerning a book before allowing or denying the use of it? Or even read the circumstances that restrict special classes in a roleplaying sense?

[Talyn]

Eh, I mean... if you already plan to restrict the use of certain things, then I'd say don't bother owning those things? Y'know? I don't see a "need" to own every single thing just because you're the GM. For that matter, if there's small bits of a certain source you want but not the rest, there's nothing stopping you from simply inputting that data manually within FG. Then you have it, can share it with the players, etc.

Also, no real reason to run FG when you're not using it unless a player directly asks you to because of timezone differences,etc. and they'd like to work on their character prior to the actual game session. Typically it's customary for GMs to fire up their FG server 30 minutes or more prior to the game so that people can connect, any downloads that need to take place will get done, character maintenance occurs, etc. so that the game can get started on time.


So the GM can't even build an opinion concerning a book before allowing or denying the use of it? Or even read the circumstances that restrict special classes in a roleplaying sense?

Eh... again I'm gonna just be hesitant on this particular attitude. Roleplaying is a social gaming construct. If you're unfamiliar with a sourcebook, class, whatever, and a player is requesting to load that DLC that they own but you don't, shouldn't you be having a conversation about it? But no, clients (players) cannot transmit their DLC to the host (GM) as stated. The box will show you what DLC they're requesting to load, but from that point it's on you to discuss it and make a decision.

[Zacchaeus]

As to your first question I think you click on Games at the top menu and select Manage Gifts from the drop down. Each user will have their own key.

[Karkong]

As to your first question I think you click on Games at the top menu and select Manage Gifts from the drop down. Each user will have their own key.Thank you, that's it.

[Karkong]

Eh, I mean... if you already plan to restrict the use of certain things, then I'd say don't bother owning those things? How would you know what you want to restrict and what not?


Also, no real reason to run FG when you're not using it unless a player directly asks you to because of timezone differences,etc. and they'd like to work on their character prior to the actual game session. Typically it's customary for GMs to fire up their FG server 30 minutes or more prior to the game so that people can connect, any downloads that need to take place will get done, character maintenance occurs, etc. so that the game can get started on time.

I suppose that's a different approach to roleplaying. I've played so many systems in so many versions I can't be arsed to know all the rules out of my head anymore, I rather have the story take precedence. So I rather have everyone know the game mechanics and know the world's background, so we usually share the books that apply to everyone. I mean, how would the player even know that he can play a halfling dragon rider unless he can access the sourcebooks? Or what kind of cyberware he'd like to buy?
At least in my games he doesn't have the time to browse the books while we play, I assure you.



Eh... again I'm gonna just be hesitant on this particular attitude. Roleplaying is a social gaming construct. If you're unfamiliar with a sourcebook, class, whatever, and a player is requesting to load that DLC that they own but you don't, shouldn't you be having a conversation about it? But no, clients (players) cannot transmit their DLC to the host (GM) as stated. The box will show you what DLC they're requesting to load, but from that point it's on you to discuss it and make a decision.I really think this is entirely retarded. I don't know if you're familiar with it, but in a pen and paper game you can simply give the GM the book untill the next date and not try to explain him the book but without letting him look, oh no!

[Zacchaeus]

What I think Talyn is saying is that for character creation for example all of the characters are in the Player's Handbook. Each of those comes with a variety of options for different archetypes, backgrounds, races etc. There are other books, such as Mordenkainen;s Tome of Foes, Volo's Guide to Monsters, Xanathar's Guide to Everything and Sword Coast Adventures Guide which have a variety of additional options for character creation; including many new archetypes, backgrounds, races, spells, feats and more.

So, your players can create perfectly fine characters with only the Players Handbook; but if one of your players wants to use a race or an archetype from one of the other books available you have a number of possible ways to handle it. The first is simply to disallow that race or whatever it is the player wants; the second is to buy the book yourself and share it with the player so that they can use it or third suggest that the player buy the book and you can allow them to use it or lastly if you have access to the paper copy you can enter the details yourself and create your own module which you can share with the players.

What you can't really do is share bits of a book. I think the impression that you gave was that you might not want to share a book if it contains an option you don't want the players to use.

Since the DM is the final arbiter of all things in a game it is almost essential that the DM knows the rules. If you do not have time to know everything from every book available then Talyn's advice is don't buy all the books.

[LordEntrails]

Welcome :)
And the only stupid question is one that goes unasked ;)

[Talyn]

Also, no real reason to run FG when you're not using it unless a player directly asks you to because of timezone differences,etc. and they'd like to work on their character prior to the actual game session. Typically it's customary for GMs to fire up their FG server 30 minutes or more prior to the game so that people can connect, any downloads that need to take place will get done, character maintenance occurs, etc. so that the game can get started on time.



I suppose that's a different approach to roleplaying. I've played so many systems in so many versions I can't be arsed to know all the rules out of my head anymore, I rather have the story take precedence. So I rather have everyone know the game mechanics and know the world's background, so we usually share the books that apply to everyone. I mean, how would the player even know that he can play a halfling dragon rider unless he can access the sourcebooks?

At least in my games he doesn't have the time to browse the books while we play, I assure you.

It's not an "approach to roleplaying" at all, it's simply acknowledging that file transfers must occur from the server (GM) to the clients (players) and since FG is a single-threaded application, it's less strain on the server if it's up ahead of time giving the players a chance to connect and hopefully not connect all at once which can make the GM's FG nearly appear to lock up for a bit.


I really think this is entirely retarded. I don't know if you're familiar with it, but in a pen and paper game you can simply give the GM the book until the next date and not try to explain him the book but without letting him look, oh no!

I'm very familiar with playing at a tabletop, but that's not what's happening here, and we're not dealing with physical books. Bottom line is that all DLC and campaign records are databases, so the "laws" of database ownership apply. In this case, the campaign databases are all owned by the GM because they're running the server. A client may have ownership of some unique DLC that is not on the server (ie. the GM does not own) but again, the GM is the one that sets master permission to this by clicking Allow or Deny. This particular topic comes up again and again, and I don't know if there's a realistic solution that satisfies both the users and the license agreements with the publishers, but so far, one has not been implemented, and until the Unity version ships they're not even going to consider this feature.

[LordEntrails]

Another aspect about product ownership and sharing to think about.


Yes with a printed book I can share that book to a person and they can use it until the next gaming session when they return it. You can't do that in FG. BUT, in FG I can start a campaign and have 10 people join it and I can share that "book" to all 10 of them all at the same time. And they can all be looking at different pages, building characters, browsing items, classes, etc. You can't do that with a printed book.

There are pros and cons to each format. imo, digital and FG far outweigh the usefulness of a printed book (and that's why I buy my books on FG, and not on paper). But, if you think a printed book is more useful/valuable, then you don't need to buy them in FG, you can share your book to your player and they can manually enter everything they want on their character sheet.

[Karkong]

@Talyn I understand what you're trying to say, you're explaining the way it is and I am of the opinion, that the way things are working right now aren't... optimal. Harebrained, even.

[Trenloe]

@Karkong - welcome to the FG forums. There are various reasons why FG does things the way it does - some technical and some commercial (e.g. required in order to get licensed material on FG). As Lord Entrails mentions, there are some advantages over traditional printed material as well. Just because you don’t agree with something, or can’t see all sides of something, doesn’t make it "retarded" or "harebrained".

This is a completely different way of playing and accessing data in the hobby that we love - some things have to be different otherwise you wouldn’t have the amazing Fantasy Grounds application that allows you to play RPGs with your friends wherever they are in the world, with full copies of the source material available for use in multiple forms (automated data records and reference manual resources).