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xscapebb
October 3rd, 2019, 04:28
If anyone finds useful...

[2nd Attack:AGILE]; ATK: -4; SKILL: -4

[2nd Attack]; ATK: -5; SKILL: -5

[3rd Attack:AGILE]; ATK: -8; SKILL: -8

[3rd Attack]; ATK: -10; SKILL: -10

[Blinded]; no sight & diff-terrain; SKILL: -4 status,perception

[Broken: light armor]; AC: -1 status

[Broken: medium armor]; AC: -2 status

[Broken: heavy armor]; AC: -3 status

[Clumsy:1]; ABIL: -1 status,dexterity; AC: -1 status; SAVE: -1 status,reflex; ATK: -1 status,ranged; SKILL: -1 status,dexterity

[Clumsy:2]; ABIL: -2 status,dexterity; AC: -2 status; SAVE: -2 status,reflex; ATK: -2 status,ranged; SKILL: -2 status,dexterity

[Clumsy:3]; ABIL: -3 status,dexterity; AC: -3 status; SAVE: -3 status,reflex; ATK: -3 status,ranged; SKILL: -3 status,dexterity

[Clumsy:4]; ABIL: -4 status,dexterity; AC: -4 status; SAVE: -4 status,reflex; ATK: -4 status,ranged; SKILL: -4 status,dexterity

[Confused]; DC11 flat; [FF]; AC: -2 circumstance

[Deafened]; INIT: -2 status; SKILL: -2 status,perception

[Drained:4]; ABIL: -4 status,constitution; SAVE: -4 status,fortitude

[Concealed]; CONC

[Drained:1]; ABIL: -1 status,constitution; SAVE: -1 status,fortitude

[Drained:2]; ABIL: -2 status,constitution; SAVE: -2 status,fortitude

[Drained:3]; ABIL: -3 status,constitution; SAVE: -3 status,fortitude

[Controlled]

[Cover-standard]; AC: 2 circumstance

[Cover-greater]; AC: 4 circumstance

[Dazzled]; others get [Concealed]

[Doomed:1]; dying levels reduced to 3

[Doomed:2]; dying levels reduced to 2

[Doomed:3]; dying levels reduced to 1

[Doomed:4]; Instant Death

[Dying:1]; Flat-check 11; [Unconscious]; AC: -4 status; INIT: -4 status; SKILL: -4 status,perception; SAVE: -4 status,reflex; [FF]; AC: -2 circumstance; [Blinded]

[Dying:2]; Flat-check 12; [Unconscious]; AC: -4 status; INIT: -4 status; SKILL: -4 status,perception; SAVE: -4 status,reflex; [FF]; AC: -2 circumstance; [Blinded]

[Dying:3]; Flat-check 13; [Unconscious]; AC: -4 status; INIT: -4 status; SKILL: -4 status,perception; SAVE: -4 status,reflex; [FF]; AC: -2 circumstance; [Blinded]

[Dying:4]; DEAD

[Encumbered]; -10ft speed; [Clumsy:1]; ABIL: -1 status,dexterity; AC: -1 status; SAVE: -1 status,reflex; ATK: -1 status,ranged; SKILL: -1 status,dexterity

[Enfeebled:1]; ABIL: -1 status,strength; ATK: -1 status,melee; SKILL: -1 status,strength; DMG: -1 status,bludgeoning,piercing,slashing

[Enfeebled:2]; ABIL: -2 status,strength; ATK: -2 status,melee; SKILL: -2 status,strength; DMG: -2 status,bludgeoning,piercing,slashing

[Enfeebled:3]; ABIL: -3 status,strength; ATK: -3 status,melee; SKILL: -3 status,strength; DMG: -3 status,bludgeoning,piercing,slashing

[Enfeebled:4]; ABIL: -4 status,strength; ATK: -4 status,melee; SKILL: -4 status,strength; DMG: -4 status,bludgeoning,piercing,slashing

[Fascinated]; no concentrate; SKILL: -2 status,perception

[Fatigued]; AC: -1 status; SAVE: -1 status

[Flat-footed]; [FF]; AC: -2 circumstance

[Fleeing]; RUN AWAY!!!

[Friendly]

[Frightened:1]; INIT: -1 status; ABIL: -1 status; SKILL: -1 status; ATK: -1 status; SAVE: -1 status; DC: -1 status

[Frightened:2]; INIT: -2 status; ABIL: -2 status; SKILL: -2 status; ATK: -2 status; SAVE: -2 status; DC: -2 status

[Frightened:3]; INIT: -3 status; ABIL: -3 status; SKILL: -3 status; ATK: -3 status; SAVE: -3 status; DC: -3 status

[Frightened:4]; INIT: -4 status; ABIL: -4 status; SKILL: -4 status; ATK: -4 status; SAVE: -4 status; DC: -4 status

[Grabbed]; DC5 flat manipulate; [FF]; AC: -2 circumstance; [Immobilized]; no move trait

[Immobilized]; no move trait

[Flat-footed]; AC: -2 circumstance

[Helpful]

[Hidden]; HIDDEN; targets get [FF]

[Hostile]

[Indifferent]

[Invisible]; [Undetected -or- Hidden]

[Observed]

[Paralyzed]; only mental actions; [FF]; AC: -2 circumstance

[Persistent Damage]; DC15 flat expires; PERS: 1 fire

[Petrified]; no move,action,perception; AC is 9; Hardness 8

[Prone]; [FF]; AC: -2 circumstance; ATK: -2 circumstance

[Quickened]; +1 Action

[Restrained]; only Escape or Force Open; [FF]; AC: -2 circumstance; [Immobilized]; no move trait

[Sickened:1]; no potions; 1action FortSave; INIT: -1 status; ABIL: -1 status; SKILL: -1 status; ATK: -1 status; SAVE: -1 status; DC: -1 status

[Sickened:2]; no potions; 1action FortSave; INIT: -2 status; ABIL: -2 status; SKILL: -2 status; ATK: -2 status; SAVE: -2 status; DC: -2 status

[Sickened:3]; no potions; 1action FortSave; INIT: -3 status; ABIL: -3 status; SKILL: -3 status; ATK: -3 status; SAVE: -3 status; DC: -3 status

[Sickened:4]; no potions; 1action FortSave; INIT: -4 status; ABIL: -4 status; SKILL: -4 status; ATK: -4 status; SAVE: -4 status; DC: -4 status

[Slowed:1]; -1 action

[Slowed:2]; -2 actions

[Slowed:3]; -3 actions

[Stunned:2]; -2 actions

[Stunned:1]; -1 action

[Stunned:3]; -3 actions

[Stunned:4]; -4 actions

[Stunned:5]; -5 actions

[Stunned:6]; -6 actions

[Stupefied:1]; DC6 flat to cast; -1 spellAtk & spellDC; ABIL: -1 status,intelligence,wisdom,charisma; SKILL: -1 status,intelligence,wisdom,charisma; SAVE: -1 status,will

[Stupefied:2]; DC7 flat to cast; -2 spellAtk & spellDC; ABIL: -2 status,intelligence,wisdom,charisma; SKILL: -2 status,intelligence,wisdom,charisma; SAVE: -2 status,will

[Stupefied:3]; DC8 flat to cast; -3 spellAtk & spellDC; ABIL: -3 status,intelligence,wisdom,charisma; SKILL: -3 status,intelligence,wisdom,charisma; SAVE: -3 status,will

[Stupefied:4]; DC9 flat to cast; -4 spellAtk & spellDC; ABIL: -4 status,intelligence,wisdom,charisma; SKILL: -4 status,intelligence,wisdom,charisma; SAVE: -4 status,will

[Unconscious]; AC: -4 status; INIT: -4 status; SKILL: -4 status,perception; SAVE: -4 status,reflex; [FF]; AC: -2 circumstance; [Blinded]

[Undetected]; not targetable; targets get [FF]; secret DC11 flat to attack

[Unfriendly]

[Unnoticed]; [Undetected] plus

[Wounded:1]; increase dying by 1

[Wounded:2]; increase dying by 2

[Wounded:3]; increase dying by 3

Larsenex
October 4th, 2019, 00:14
Xscabb, these are chat commands or ones we can use in various parts of the character/npc sheets?

Trenloe
October 4th, 2019, 01:22
... these are chat commands or ones we can use in various parts of the character/npc sheets?
https://www.fantasygrounds.com/wiki/index.php/PFRPG2_Effects

xscapebb
October 4th, 2019, 01:46
these are the text of "effects" that you could use if you desired... in custom made entries on the Actions Tab (PITA: but you CAN make a new Spell Type Container there, set to Caster Level 1 and create custom "Spell Actions", even though they aren't actually "spells")… or the GM can input these into CUSTOM Conditions Effects in the "Effects/Conditions" window (small menu button top right).

ALL of these have been thoroughly tested and they "work" and apply the rules correctly (or at least within current limitations of FG/CoreRPG/PF2-Ruleset)… the existing "Conditions" do not "work" for the most part, so this custom list is a stop-gap for the time being... Unfortunately some/most of them get rather long, and I did best I could to make at least some kind of sensical notes for the things that FG can't handle, but you will still want/need (I would think) to look things up in the Rules as well.

Hardbushido
October 4th, 2019, 01:52
Xscabb, these are chat commands or ones we can use in various parts of the character/npc sheets?

use the list to add custom effects. open effects (small button that looks like a person). in the white box, right click to add effect and then copy and past the effect from the above post.

xscapebb
October 4th, 2019, 02:11
Actually... here is the work-in-progress MODULE I've started for PF2... I call it "Tidbits" because it is just a library/collection of different tools, helpers, effects, tips, tricks, etc... nothing earth-shattering, just some... Tidbits... if some of it useful for anyone, enjoy!

- Copy into your FantasyGrounds Data Folder and then in your /modules/ folder
- Once in FG Desktop, PF2 Ruleset... goto Library and load the Module...
- Then goto STORY > "X0: About..." and this is like a "HomePage" or "Table of Contents" for the Module...
not too much there yet, but as I said "work-in-progress"...

Back to the original topic here... conditions... ALL of the above Conditions/Effects are included in the Mod for GMs AND PLAYERs in the (top-right of desktop) "Effects/Conditions" Button/Menu/Window

Bidmaron
October 4th, 2019, 04:22
Nice, xscapebb. Keep up the great work!

xscapebb
October 4th, 2019, 18:49
Example of My Ranger's Action Tab with Custom Actions/Effects from the Tidbits Module (and some that are not in the module)...

Pepor
October 5th, 2019, 07:57
Actually... here is the work-in-progress MODULE I've started for PF2... I call it "Tidbits" because it is just a library/collection of different tools, helpers, effects, tips, tricks, etc... nothing earth-shattering, just some... Tidbits... if some of it useful for anyone, enjoy!

- Copy into your FantasyGrounds Data Folder and then in your /modules/ folder
- Once in FG Desktop, PF2 Ruleset... goto Library and load the Module...
- Then goto STORY > "X0: About..." and this is like a "HomePage" or "Table of Contents" for the Module...
not too much there yet, but as I said "work-in-progress"...

Back to the original topic here... conditions... ALL of the above Conditions/Effects are included in the Mod for GMs AND PLAYERs in the (top-right of desktop) "Effects/Conditions" Button/Menu/Window

Thank you very much! You saved me a lot of work.

theMaXX
October 9th, 2019, 14:21
When should i expect fully coded conditions? Isn't it a high priority task? The community has already coded a huge amount of spells, powers and feat effects based on conditions that still ain't functional... expecting it to be funcional.
It's really holding back my game... and i feel like i can't trust enough the ruleset to start a major campaign, 3 weeks i keep refreshing FG tab every tuesday until i get the store content/updates, but just can't see any significant progress on PFRPG2.

Is there someone working full time on PF2? I was thinking that Trenloe was the one responsible for PFRPG2 ruleset full time, but i've just realized he works on 5e...

theMaXX
October 9th, 2019, 14:33
Great work! Will actually allow me to play in FG.

@xscapebb

Trenloe
October 9th, 2019, 14:50
Is there someone working full time on PF2? I was thinking that Trenloe was the one responsible for PFRPG2 ruleset full time, but i've just realized he works on 5e...
I don't work on 5E. I don't work full-time for SmiteWorks, I'm contracted on commission only, and I have a "normal" day job.

Please bear with me as I get over the hump of the initial large amount of content I need to convert and code in the ruleset. Conditions will be coming in the next few weeks - it's not a simple task and I don't want to release them piecemeal.

yarnevk
October 9th, 2019, 16:57
Why are you debuffing skills for 2nd/3rd attack - where is that in the rules? Should only apply to strikes unless the skill specifically says uses attack MAP.

Hardbushido
October 9th, 2019, 17:00
Why are you debuffing skills for 2nd/3rd attack - where is that in the rules? Should only apply to strikes unless the skill specifically says uses attack MAP.

What specifically are you referring to? Can you give the example.

Trenloe
October 9th, 2019, 17:09
Why are you debuffing skills for 2nd/3rd attack - where is that in the rules? Should only apply to strikes unless the skill specifically says uses attack MAP.
This would be for checks that have the attack trait - grapple, for example (page 242). There's nothing in the FG ruleset (yet) that takes the "attack" trait into account for skill checks and multi-attack-penalties.

Alex Craft
October 9th, 2019, 20:06
i think the Athletics and the Acrobatics skills falls under that too

Trenloe
October 9th, 2019, 20:20
i think the Athletics and the Acrobatics skills falls under that too
Only if the action/activity has the attack trait is the multi-attack-penalty taken into account. None of the standard acrobatics skill actions listed in the Core Rules have the attack trait (page 241), so a multi-attack penalty does not apply to standard acrobatics actions.

The Attack trait is listed in the glossary:


attack (trait) An ability with this trait involves an attack. For each attack you make beyond the first on your turn, you take a multiple attack penalty.

Alex Craft
October 9th, 2019, 20:34
ok,thank you

EDIT: still learning, not everyone knows the rules overnight

Trenloe
October 9th, 2019, 20:40
EDIT: still learning, not everyone knows the rules overnight
Sorry if I came across as not being helpful.

I provide as much info as a can, and try to be as clear as I can, so that everyone can learn the nuances of PF2.

Hardbushido
October 9th, 2019, 20:47
Since you're here trenloe, any estimate on that bestiary.

Trenloe
October 9th, 2019, 21:25
Since you're here trenloe, any estimate on that bestiary.
https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?50267-SR-Bestiary&p=455977&viewfull=1#post455977

xscapebb
October 10th, 2019, 02:59
Why are you debuffing skills for 2nd/3rd attack - where is that in the rules? Should only apply to strikes unless the skill specifically says uses attack MAP.

(as others have said) this is for Actions that use SKILL rolls but have the "Attack" Trait (Grapple, Shove, Trip, Disarm...) There a many things that FG does for us that make things easier for us, but you still have to think out when to add or to remove some effects, etc... and there are certainly times where just using the "Modifier" box might be simpler... I just provided a complete (or as complete as possible) list of the conditions/effects that can either be used as is -or- used to help remind how it all works, etc...

theMaXX
October 10th, 2019, 16:16
[QUOTE=Trenloe;456103]I don't work on 5E. I don't work full-time for SmiteWorks, I'm contracted on commission only, and I have a "normal" day job.

I'm sorry to suppose you were working on 5E... just got confused about PAR5E, i guess it's about the Bestiary? The thing is that i'm getting frustrated to see only a few ppl working on this ruleset... of course i understand the huge amount of coding it is... There will be a character's guide for lost omens in a few days with a lot of new stuff, maybe new mechanics... also the advanced class playtest (i guess this month)... how should one or two persons be able to do that part-time?
Anyway, i mean no offense...

Trenloe
October 10th, 2019, 16:42
I'm sorry to suppose you were working on 5E... just got confused about PAR5E, i guess it's about the Bestiary? The thing is that i'm getting frustrated to see only a few ppl working on this ruleset... of course i understand the huge amount of coding it is... There will be a character's guide for lost omens in a few days with a lot of new stuff, maybe new mechanics... also the advanced class playtest (i guess this month)... how should one or two persons be able to do that part-time?
Anyway, i mean no offense...
Like I said. Please bear with me as I work through the work load. There is a huge amount to get through with the first release (ruleset, 640 page core rules, 360 page bestiary plus ongoing settings guides) and I'm playing catch up. It will take me a few months, but I'll get there.

Even companies with full time employees are struggling to get Pathfinder 2.0 products to market - for example, have you tried HeroLab Online? They're struggling big time...

SmiteWorks only has a limited number of full time employees. None of these currently work on any of the rulesets full time. The sustainable business model is to employ community developers (commission based) to work on the rulesets - there is not enough revenue to employ anyone full time working on a specific ruleset - as it is, I earn way, way, way below minimum wage for the work I put in, and that's for products that sell relatively well (compared to other non D&D 5E products). SmiteWorks is a very small RPG industry company, not a massive computer gaming company - they can't devote full time employees to projects like these, the company wouldn't survive if they did.

I get your frustration, but please understand the dynamics going on here. Fantasy Grounds already has much more Pathfinder 2.0 material available than any other VTT on the market - and it'll stay that way. It will just take time for me to catch up and get everything to where I want it to be...

thelagermeister
October 10th, 2019, 18:28
So please excuse my Noob-ishness here, but is what xscapebb doing just kind of a stop gap for us until spell conditions and effects are all fully fleshed out in FG? I only got FG about a month ago and have only played the PF2 ruleset, so I'm not sure if something like DND5e already has a lot of these features or not. I know the mod community seems to be pretty strong to help with these fun upgrades, but something so critical to the actual rules and automation of playing I would assume is supposed to be part of the ruleset, right?

I have read what you, Trenloe, has said and this all makes me feel glad my gaming group decided to go with FG over others. I'm really enjoying it so far. I was just looking for some clarity, specifically with PF2, on if we are supposed to expect all this functionality to be baked in in the future or is this a normal thing for all rulesets to have mods to add modifiers to spells?

Thanks for all you guys do and I will use the mod to help me in my weekly game. We have struggled a lot lately with looking up modifiers and how to apply them and it has really slowed us down. This should make things much easier. Thanks again.

Trenloe
October 10th, 2019, 18:41
So please excuse my Noob-ishness here, but is what xscapebb doing just kind of a stop gap for us until spell conditions and effects are all fully fleshed out in FG? I only got FG about a month ago and have only played the PF2 ruleset, so I'm not sure if something like DND5e already has a lot of these features or not. I know the mod community seems to be pretty strong to help with these fun upgrades, but something so critical to the actual rules and automation of playing I would assume is supposed to be part of the ruleset, right?

I have read what you, Trenloe, has said and this all makes me feel glad my gaming group decided to go with FG over others. I'm really enjoying it so far. I was just looking for some clarity, specifically with PF2, on if we are supposed to expect all this functionality to be baked in in the future or is this a normal thing for all rulesets to have mods to add modifiers to spells?

Thanks for all you guys do and I will use the mod to help me in my weekly game. We have struggled a lot lately with looking up modifiers and how to apply them and it has really slowed us down. This should make things much easier. Thanks again.
Welcome to the FG forums thelagermeister!

Effects for abilities and spells will never (or very unlikely) be hard coded into the official products. Like 5E, the ruleset will be fine tuned to attempt to parse effects out of the ability/spell description - but this will never be 100% accurate across all spells and abilities, because standard language is not used in descriptions and there are many edge cases. Hopefully the ruleset will over time get better at this (i.e. I fine tune the parsing code). But, there will always be space for community contributions that go beyond what the base ruleset and products provide. Just look at Rob2e's DMs Guild 5E products as an example.

xscapebb
October 10th, 2019, 18:50
"Automation" of conditions|spells|effects is not universal in the 5E Ruleset either... it is "better" but not even what I'd call "mostly done"... Writing spell-effects yourself or finding (or purchasing) Mods to add "automation" effects-coding to FG is ALWAYS needed. FG is a "toolset" or a "platform", not a fully functional "video game".

If you were playing these RPG's with books open on a physical table, you would have to figure out the rules and adjudicate/apply them manually... FG give us many TOOLS (not 100% and "not perfect", but absolutely better than nothing) to help "Automate" some/much of the game play.

What I've shared here is stuff that (probably?) should be "baked into" the PF2 ruleset, but is not yet (for the most part). It is just the basic CONDITIONS that exist in the PF2 game-rules and how to use existing FG&PF2(ruleset) automation to guide your application of game mechanics... it is no substitute for looking up the full rules and thinking about how it might be applied (or in some cases, become non-applicable) in a given scenario/situation.

Trenloe
October 14th, 2019, 02:44
For all those who have asked and are interested... I'm close to finishing the first release of the full PFRPG2 conditions (i.e. as per the Core Rules). I hope to have this released this next week - ruleset release 7. There is a lot of complex code, and it's pretty hard to test fully, so I hope that there won't be too many issues. If there are any issues, questions, etc. then please raise them in a thread. If it's a definite bug, please report with as much info as possible in the ruleset bug reporting thread here: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?50246-Pathfinder-Second-Edition-PFRPG2-Ruleset-Status-issues-and-ongoing-development

I've updated the effects Wiki page to list what's been done - there's a "Ruleset version" column that shows what's there now (release 1-6) and what will be there next release (release 7). There is still some ares that need to be applied manually - some of that will be updated over time, and some will just remain manual as it's not realistic to try to accurately code.

The chat window after loading a PFRPG2 campaign will tell you which release you have.

Hopefully release 7 will go out this week - keep an eye on the City Hall announcement forum!

Bidmaron
October 14th, 2019, 04:31
This is really great news, Trenloe. Thanks so much for your hard work here.

Pepor
October 14th, 2019, 09:58
Amazing Trenloe. Thanks!

theMaXX
October 14th, 2019, 19:56
Great news!

xscapebb
October 16th, 2019, 05:51
confirmed - Conditions appear to now "worK" (applying game mechanics) in the new PF2 Ruleset Update... I haven't extensively tested all of them yet but they appear to work so far. Thanks Trenloe.

Pepor
October 16th, 2019, 08:01
Nice! But I think that Clumsy doesn't apply correctly to Reflex saves.

Jankomatic
October 16th, 2019, 14:11
Yeah, I can't tell that they are any different at all. They just apply the effect in the Combat Tracker, like before but don't actually do anything that I can see. I restarted and made sure I saw it say it updated the core rules.

Trenloe
October 16th, 2019, 14:38
Nice! But I think that Clumsy doesn't apply correctly to Reflex saves.
OK, I see the issue. Thanks for reporting. I've logged this as RS2.062. Fixed in next release.

This also effects Clumsy, Drained, Frightened and Sickened for save penalties only - other modifiers should work OK.

Trenloe
October 16th, 2019, 14:39
Yeah, I can't tell that they are any different at all. They just apply the effect in the Combat Tracker, like before but don't actually do anything that I can see. I restarted and made sure I saw it say it updated the core rules.
Please refer to post #28 in this thread for details of posting issues found. I can't fix anything without specifics. Thanks!

Pepor
October 16th, 2019, 14:53
OK, I see the issue. Thanks for reporting. I've logged this as RS2.062. Fixed in next release.
This also effects Clumsy, Drained, Frightened and Sickened for save penalties only - other modifiers should work OK.

Thanks!

yarnevk
October 16th, 2019, 18:59
ProneTakeCover is not clear to me. Does 'only applied' mean the engine is applying it as a special case, or that I have to apply it manually?

in TakeCover you just repeat the CRB rule, but not clear to me how this is implemented.

As I read the CRB Prone means you are flat footed for -2 circumstance, while Take Cover while prone means you get a +4 circumstance so you have a net modifier of +2 circumstance.

So why is there a ProneTakeCover - should it not just be in the general rules that opposing circumstance bonuses you do subtract rather than take the best one? Isn't that what happens if I combine flat-footed and greater cover already?

I tried to understand what it was doing last night and got confused what it is actually doing - is it because I updated with an active combat tracker?

Trenloe
October 16th, 2019, 19:46
ProneTakeCover is not clear to me. Does 'only applied' mean the engine is applying it as a special case, or that I have to apply it manually?

in TakeCover you just repeat the CRB rule, but not clear to me how this is implemented.
There's a few things we need to get clear about the "Prone" condition - by itself it gives you no defensive benefits whatsoever - you're flat-footed to all attacks. To get any benefits, you need to use the "Take Cover" action, which gives you only one specific benefit while being prone: "You can Take Cover while prone to hunker down and gain cover against ranged attacks, even if you don’t have an object to get behind, gaining a +4 circumstance bonus to AC against ranged attacks (but you remain flat-footed)."

Hence why there is the ProneTakenCover condition as this has specific bonuses not covered by other conditions. Apply it to a creature if they have taken an action while prone to take cover, which gives a +4 circumstance bonus to AC against ranged attacks only - hence the documented pseudo effect of AC: 4 circumstance, ranged and this bonus is only relevant if they are also prone - hence why the Wiki states "Only applied if you also have the Prone condition."


As I read the CRB Prone means you are flat footed for -2 circumstance, while Take Cover while prone means you get a +4 circumstance so you have a net modifier of +2 circumstance.
Correct. With the proviso that this is just for ranged attacks, melee attacks will be against an AC with the -2 circumstance penalty for flat-footed.


So why is there a ProneTakeCover - should it not just be in the general rules that opposing circumstance bonuses you do subtract rather than take the best one?
That's not quite right. The rules state that you take the best circumstance bonus and the worst circumstance penalty and apply it to the check - there could be many circumstance penalties and bonuses and you shouldn't think about things being opposing - just take the best circumstance bonus and the worst circumstance penalty.


So why is there a ProneTakeCover - should it not just be in the general rules that opposing circumstance bonuses you do subtract rather than take the best one? Isn't that what happens if I combine flat-footed and greater cover already?
As mentioned above - using the Take Cover action while prone is not the same as Greater Cover - which also gives bonuses to reflex saves (vs. area effects) and Stealth checks to avoid detection.


I tried to understand what it was doing last night and got confused what it is actually doing - is it because I updated with an active combat tracker?
It shouldn't make any difference updating to release 7 - as long as the conditions and effects follow the syntax documented in the Wiki.

yarnevk
October 16th, 2019, 21:20
So if behind a window then I drop prone so I can hide then I want to use Greater Cover from the modifier window (or gcover on the tracker), but if in the clear then I want to use ProneTakeCover from the effects window?

"just take the best circumstance bonus and the worst circumstance penalty" is that what the automation is doing or are you saying we manually have to do this and apply a net modifier.

Trenloe
October 16th, 2019, 21:32
So if behind a window then I drop prone so I can hide then I want to use Greater Cover from the modifier window (or gcover on the tracker), but if in the clear then I want to use ProneTakeCover from the effects window?
Yes.


"just take the best circumstance bonus and the worst circumstance penalty" is that what the automation is doing or are you saying we manually have to do this and apply a net modifier.
The ruleset will calculate the total modifier to a check correctly, based off the bonus/penalty types used.

theMaXX
October 16th, 2019, 21:51
Hi, Trenloe.
Started some tests yesterday, and it seems all good.

One thing i've noticed when i was trying to add an effect for sneak attacks:
IFT: Flat-footed; DMG: 1d6 precision
It worked allright, rolled two dices and the precision damage seems to be treated as piercing, wich is correct.

The thing is: precision damage is added to the normal damage for purposes of overcoming resistances, except for resist precision.

So, i've rolled against a monster with:
RESIST: 5 piercing
Unfortunately it reduced the damage of each dice, instead once for the total damage dealt.

I'm not sure if this is the right place to discuss this, but since i'm working with effects, i thought it would...


OBS.: This doesn't happen when i add the damage straight to the weapon attack action, but havin a permanent effect wich i can tick ON and OFF would be very nice.

Also, is it possible for the effects to have a property to use it only once per turn... then becoming available again? Right now there's no way for dealing with it automatically or am i missing something?

Trenloe
October 16th, 2019, 22:19
Hi, Trenloe.
Started some tests yesterday, and it seems all good.

One thing i've noticed when i was trying to add an effect for sneak attacks:
IFT: Flat-footed; DMG: 1d6 precision
It worked allright, rolled two dices and the precision damage seems to be treated as piercing, wich is correct.

The thing is: precision damage is added to the normal damage for purposes of overcoming resistances, except for resist precision.

So, i've rolled against a monster with:
RESIST: 5 piercing
Unfortunately it reduced the damage of each dice, instead once for the total damage dealt.

I'm not sure if this is the right place to discuss this, but since i'm working with effects, i thought it would...
This issue is logged as RS2.030.


Also, is it possible for the effects to have a property to use it only once per turn... then becoming available again? Right now there's no way for dealing with it automatically or am i missing something?
There's currently On, Off, and Skip. Can you give me a use case please? I'm thinking it might get complex with handling deciding when it's used, etc. but I'd like a use case so I can consider the process.

theMaXX
October 16th, 2019, 23:57
This issue is logged as RS2.030.


There's currently On, Off, and Skip. Can you give me a use case please? I'm thinking it might get complex with handling deciding when it's used, etc. but I'd like a use case so I can consider the process.

For abilities like the Precision Ranger:

PFS Legal Precision
Source Core Rulebook pg. 168
You have trained to aim for your prey’s weak points. The first time you hit your hunted prey in a round, you also deal 1d8 additional precision damage.

I'm not sure what else could use right now... but there might be more.

yarnevk
October 17th, 2019, 04:57
I put ProneTakeCover into the trackers effects, nothing changed when I attacked. When I switched back to Prone then [Effects-2] happened.

Trenloe
October 17th, 2019, 05:42
I put ProneTakeCover into the trackers effects, nothing changed when I attacked. When I switched back to Prone then [Effects-2] happened.
Please provide a screenshot showing the combat tracker and the chat window with an example where this doesn't work. Thanks.

xscapebb
October 17th, 2019, 05:54
I put ProneTakeCover into the trackers effects, nothing changed when I attacked. When I switched back to Prone then [Effects-2] happened.

From the Effects Wiki: You are prone and have used the "Take Cover" action. Only applied if you also have the Prone condition.

so, you need 2 Effects on the PC for it to DO something...
1. Prone (which gives you FF [AC: -2 circumstance; ATK: -2 circumstance] )
2. ProneTakenCover (which gives you COVER-GREATER [AC: 4 circumstance,ranged )

I tested and it works correctly for Melee Attacks [DEF EFFECTS -2] and for Ranged Attacks [DEF EFFECTS +2]
( so basically... ProneTakenCover is... IF: Prone; AC: 4 circumstance,ranged )

yarnevk
October 17th, 2019, 16:55
So it behaves as 'TakenCover when Prone' rather than 'Prone and TakenCover'...the compound name makes one think it is the latter behavior.

Also ProneTakenCover is not on the effects list, should not need the wiki open to remember what the ProperName used was, should be on the effects list.

xscapebb
October 17th, 2019, 17:13
this (ProneTakenCover) is not a proper "Condition"... it is a special case combination of conditions that (per rules) works SLIGHTLY differently than simply combining the 2 (Prone and Cover-Greater)... imo, Trenloe just happened to stumble across this and thought "hmm, I can add something special to make this easier", but it is not required and is not a normal/standard "condition"... imo, there are probably 10+ other such special case combos that we/he haven't seen/thought of yet...

Trenloe
October 17th, 2019, 17:13
Also ProneTakenCover is not on the effects list, should not need the wiki open to remember what the ProperName used was, should be on the effects list.
It's the result of taking an action, rather than a ruleset conditions. I'm still developing actions and I haven't decided where things like this will reside as there'll probably be quite a lot more and I don't want to add more condition buttons to an already pretty overloaded effects window. For now you'll just have to remember the effect name (ProneTakenCover) or manually add it to the custom list in the effects window.

Trenloe
October 17th, 2019, 17:16
imo, Trenloe just happened to stumble across this and thought "hmm, I can add something special to make this easier"
Pretty much! :)


there are probably 10+ other such special case combos that we/he haven't seen/thought of yet...
Yep, I'm sure there will be lots... and I may, or may not, provide action based conditions into the ruleset. I'm concerned that the effects system might get overloaded on lower spec computers - especially with the other plans I have for effects...

xscapebb
October 18th, 2019, 03:46
@TRENLOE

(100% understood that some of this is already known, but thought it might be useful to get a complete, in-depth testing review of the Conditions>Effects you've recently implemented)

BLINDED CHECK
CLUMSY:X Missing [ SAVE: -X status,reflex ]
CONC CHECK
CONFUSED CHECK
DAZZLED CHECK
DEAFENED CHECK
DRAINED:X Missing [ SAVE: -X status,fortitude ]
ENFEEBLED:X CHECK
FASCINATED CHECK
FATIGUED CHECK
FLAT-FOOTED CHECK
FRIGHTENED:X Missing [ SAVE: -X status ]
GRABBED CHECK
HIDDEN CHECK
INVISIBLE Small issue in that the Flat-Check for Undetected AND the Attack Roll is in the open and not in the tower (not sure there is a reasonable way to DO this).
PARALYZED CHECK
PETRIFIED Should be an effective AC of 9 and a Hardness (damage resistance) (not sure there is a reasonable way to DO this).
PRONE CHECK
RESTRAINED CHECK
SICKENED:X Missing [ ABIL: -X status; SAVE: -X status ]
STUPIFIED:X CHECK
UNCONSCIOUS CHECK
UNDETECTED Small issue in that the Flat-Check for Undetected AND the Attack Roll is in the open and not in the tower (not sure there is a reasonable way to DO this).

OTHER/FEATURE-REQUESTS:
Would be nice to "automate" the application and interaction of: Doomed:X, Dying:X, Recovery Rolls, Wounded:X, etc...

Let me know if anything is not fully clear, etc...

Trenloe
October 18th, 2019, 04:11
@TRENLOE

(100% understood that some of this is already known, but thought it might be useful to get a complete, in-depth testing review of the Conditions>Effects you've recently implemented)
This is fantastic! Thanks so much for testing and the sanity check!


INVISIBLE Small issue in that the Flat-Check for Undetected AND the Attack Roll is in the open and not in the tower (not sure there is a reasonable way to DO this).
UNDETECTED Small issue in that the Flat-Check for Undetected AND the Attack Roll is in the open and not in the tower (not sure there is a reasonable way to DO this).
I need to redesign the whole process for this. RAW has the flat check before the attack roll, and I'll need to make certain flat checks secret as you mention. It's on my list...


PETRIFIED Should be an effective AC of 9 and a Hardness (damage resistance) (not sure there is a reasonable way to DO this).
Missed the AC 9 part.


SICKENED:X Missing [ ABIL: -X status; SAVE: -X status ]
Oh right, I forgot the ABIL modifier. I've updated the code and this will be in the next release.


OTHER/FEATURE-REQUESTS:
Would be nice to "automate" the application and interaction of: Doomed:X, Dying:X, Recovery Rolls, Wounded:X, etc...
Yeah, I plan to do that at some point soon.

Thanks again for doing this - it's very much appreciated. :)

Pepor
October 19th, 2019, 09:18
@TRENLOE

(100% understood that some of this is already known, but thought it might be useful to get a complete, in-depth testing review of the Conditions>Effects you've recently implemented)

BLINDED CHECK
CLUMSY:X Missing [ SAVE: -X status,reflex ]
CONC CHECK
CONFUSED CHECK
DAZZLED CHECK
DEAFENED CHECK
DRAINED:X Missing [ SAVE: -X status,fortitude ]
ENFEEBLED:X CHECK
FASCINATED CHECK
FATIGUED CHECK
FLAT-FOOTED CHECK
FRIGHTENED:X Missing [ SAVE: -X status ]
GRABBED CHECK
HIDDEN CHECK
INVISIBLE Small issue in that the Flat-Check for Undetected AND the Attack Roll is in the open and not in the tower (not sure there is a reasonable way to DO this).
PARALYZED CHECK
PETRIFIED Should be an effective AC of 9 and a Hardness (damage resistance) (not sure there is a reasonable way to DO this).
PRONE CHECK
RESTRAINED CHECK
SICKENED:X Missing [ ABIL: -X status; SAVE: -X status ]
STUPIFIED:X CHECK
UNCONSCIOUS CHECK
UNDETECTED Small issue in that the Flat-Check for Undetected AND the Attack Roll is in the open and not in the tower (not sure there is a reasonable way to DO this).

OTHER/FEATURE-REQUESTS:
Would be nice to "automate" the application and interaction of: Doomed:X, Dying:X, Recovery Rolls, Wounded:X, etc...

Let me know if anything is not fully clear, etc...

Thanks!

Pepor
October 21st, 2019, 14:45
Should Encumbered apply Clumsy1 by itself as well? It doesn't work like that currently.

Trenloe
October 21st, 2019, 14:52
Should Encumbered apply Clumsy1 by itself as well? It doesn't work like that currently.
Thanks for reporting. Logged as RS2.065.

EDIT: Fixed in release 8 - hopefully out tomorrow.

Pepor
October 22nd, 2019, 18:52
Thanks for reporting. Logged as RS2.065.

EDIT: Fixed in release 8 - hopefully out tomorrow.

I have just tested it. It works fine.

Nice work! Thank you!

Trenloe
October 22nd, 2019, 19:16
I have just tested it. It works fine.

Nice work! Thank you!
Great! Thanks for testing.

Milke
November 3rd, 2019, 21:30
That's a nice list of effect commands. Thanks for that!

Milke
November 3rd, 2019, 21:54
Is there any guide as to how to use the Actions generator?

Trenloe
November 4th, 2019, 04:26
Is there any guide as to how to use the Actions generator?
Nope, because it's not implemented yet.

Milke
November 9th, 2019, 20:40
I can't figure out the command that makes you attack vs. the enemy's flatfooted AC. I know there's a button in the +/- tab, but I want to program into a button for the rogue on his sheet.
The wiki says the command is CA for combat advantage, but when I put the CA in, nothing happens.
Would it be easier just to add a +2 ATK?

ShadeRaven
November 9th, 2019, 21:12
I can't figure out the command that makes you attack vs. the enemy's flatfooted AC. I know there's a button in the +/- tab, but I want to program into a button for the rogue on his sheet.
The wiki says the command is CA for combat advantage, but when I put the CA in, nothing happens.
Would it be easier just to add a +2 ATK?Easiest way to do it is to apply Flat-footed to the target, much like you'd apply the +2 ATK to the actor.

Hardbushido
November 9th, 2019, 21:13
You could apply an effect on your target that gives AC: -2

Milke
November 9th, 2019, 21:47
Well, what I was doing was.. I have an effect on the rogue (that I saw someone from here give an example of) that puts sneak attack on his next damage when he hits, and it dissipates when the damage roll is done.
But I thought I could also add to the effect (on the rogue) one that gives him attack vs flatfooted. So he could just click it all in one button.
But the CA command I can't get to work.
I hope that all made sense.

theMaXX
November 9th, 2019, 22:29
Well, what I was doing was.. I have an effect on the rogue (that I saw someone from here give an example of) that puts sneak attack on his next damage when he hits, and it dissipates when the damage roll is done.
But I thought I could also add to the effect (on the rogue) one that gives him attack vs flatfooted. So he could just click it all in one button.
But the CA command I can't get to work.
I hope that all made sense.

I was working with a permanent effect on the rogue.
IFT: flat-footed; DMG: 1d6, precision

It means that if you attack a target that has the flat-footed condition, the extra damage will be added. But it won't work if you do not manually add the effect, however.

ShadeRaven
November 9th, 2019, 22:45
Gotcha. Yeah. Honestly, that's a tough one. Real problem is if the opponent is Flat-Footed from some other effect (say a spell like Chill Touch vs Undead or Confused as a Condition), having an all-in-one button that grants +2 attacks would effectively double-up the bonus to +4.

As much as I am with you (and if you see my all-in-one module or how much I put into the Bestiary), I love trying to keep things as compressed and concise as possible.. but sometimes you just have to take the long road to ensure accuracy.

So in this case, best to give the rogue a second entry that applies Flat-footed to the target (probably a one-action version if it's a personal boost such as from Flanking) and just remind the player to apply flat-footed before attacks and the precision damage for the damage.

All that said...
The Wiki should probably be updated and CA/GRANTCA is for other systems and could probably use replacements for Pathfinder 2 for things like applied Flat-Footed to enemies for just the actor (such as Flanking).

Trenloe
November 9th, 2019, 22:48
The wiki says the command is CA for combat advantage, but when I put the CA in, nothing happens.
The CA effect needs to be targeted - i.e. you have combat advantage against a specific target, not against all targets. When you apply CA to your character, drag the effect target icon (the cross-hairs to the right side of the effect line in the CT) to the target/s who will be flat footed to you.

I'll add this info to the effects Wiki page.

EDIT: You can also apply the targeting effect if you have "CA" set as an effect on your character sheet, set it as Targeting = Self and then hold down SHIFT and drag/drop the effect button onto the target that will be flat footed to your attacks - this will apply the CA effect to you (as the targeting was set to self) but the effect itself will bet set to target the creature the effect was dragged to (with SHIFT being pressed).

Milke
November 10th, 2019, 18:03
I actually really like the IFT: Flat-footed thing as a permanent effect.
I tried it. It doesn't work either.
But I've got some good advice from this thread so far.

UltimateGM
November 10th, 2019, 20:07
Missing [Cover-lesser]; AC: 1

Trenloe
November 11th, 2019, 01:44
The Wiki should probably be updated and CA/GRANTCA is for other systems and could probably use replacements for Pathfinder 2 for things like applied Flat-Footed to enemies for just the actor (such as Flanking).
I'll keep CA and GRANTCA there for backwards compatibility.

I'll change "Flat-footed" to be targetable in the next release (release 9) - so you can put it on a creature that will be Flat-footed and then use effect targeting if the condition only applies to certain attacks. This essentially will then work the same as GRANTCA now.

theMaXX
November 11th, 2019, 02:23
I actually really like the IFT: Flat-footed thing as a permanent effect.
I tried it. It doesn't work either.
But I've got some good advice from this thread so far.

If you drag and drop the Flat-footed effect to the enemy it works. It won't work if you use the modifier tab though...

IFT: flat-footed; DMG: 1d6, precision

See the gif here: https://gyazo.com/c87f8ded3998ff2bf5fb5ec094d45bd0

MaxAstro
November 11th, 2019, 19:21
For the hard-coded conditions on the left of the Effects page, is there a way to quickly reference their effects? There's no little dragon icon for them to bring up more details...

Trenloe
November 11th, 2019, 19:25
For the hard-coded conditions on the left of the Effects page, is there a way to quickly reference their effects? There's no little dragon icon for them to bring up more details...
Go here: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/wiki/index.php/PFRPG2_Effects

I've just checked and the ? button at the top of the Effects window goes to the 3.5E ruleset Wiki page. I'll fix that for the next release.

Milke
November 11th, 2019, 21:10
Ohhhh. I get it. So, the IFT thing will work if the creature has the flatfooted effect on it, but not just if the attacker is attacking vs. flatfooted AC.
Wow. There are so many moving parts to this. It's all so fascinating.
So, Trenloe is going to make flatfooted targetable, then I can just have the two effects. One permanent effect to add sneak attack on flatfooted, and another to make a creature flatfooted.
This stuff is all new to me. But I'm keeping the wiki open and tabbing over to my FG and playing with stuff usually every day. So I can hopefully eventually have to stop asking so many questions. haha

Trenloe
November 11th, 2019, 21:15
So, Trenloe is going to make flatfooted targetable, then I can just have the two effects. One permanent effect to add sneak attack on flatfooted, and another to make a creature flatfooted.
To clarify. You can add the "Flat-footed" condition to a target now.

Adding a condition to a target is not the same as targeting a condition - targeting a condition allows you to apply that condition but make it only applicable to certain targets - i.e. it's filtering when the condition is applied.

theMaXX
November 11th, 2019, 21:58
To clarify. You can add the "Flat-footed" condition to a target now.

Adding a condition to a target is not the same as targeting a condition - targeting a condition allows you to apply that condition but make it only applicable to certain targets - i.e. it's filtering when the condition is applied.

I'm not sure i understand what you mean...
Does it mean that after flat-footed is "targetable" the line IFT: [flat-footed] will work also when i apply flat-footed modifier before a damage roll?

Trenloe
November 11th, 2019, 22:24
Does it mean that after flat-footed is "targetable" the line IFT: [flat-footed] will work also when i apply flat-footed modifier before a damage roll?
Nope, not that. IFT works on conditions as standard.

See my posts over the last 2 pages - describing targeting the CA effect.

With release 9 of the ruleset (probably tomorrow), which includes "Flat-footed" being targetable - it means you can specify for who the condition actually applies. As mentioned above, it's a filter for targets.

An example: If "Goblin Warrior" was only Flat-footed to "Gnomio" then you could target the condition as follows:

https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=30138

You can see that the Flat-footed defensive modifier is only applied to attacks from Gnomio, not Dwarfy:

https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=30139

theMaXX
November 11th, 2019, 22:30
Got it.

How will IFT: work with that?
If someone else (besides Gnomio) had a IFT: [flat-footed] it should not work, right?

Trenloe
November 11th, 2019, 22:32
Got it.

How will IFT: work with that?
If someone else (besides Gnomio) had a IFT: [flat-footed] it should not work, right?
Correct.

And the syntax is IFT: Flat-footed; ... For example: IFT: Flat-footed; DMG: 2

theMaXX
November 11th, 2019, 22:33
That will be awesome!

Milke
November 12th, 2019, 01:30
Oh. That will be absolutely fantastic. So, if I understand correctly.
I could program a Flat-footed button and set it to last one whole round, but only for the person who is pushing the button.
So, if the rogue was flanking, and attacked all 3 times, it would apply FF to all 3 of his attacks, and dissipate before his next round, and wouldn't make the creature FF to others at all. And the IFT button would add his sneak attack.
Trenloe. You're a genius.

UltimateGM
November 12th, 2019, 01:34
Seems it will be good for players who play Rogues and use sneak attack but forget to drop the sneak attack damage on themselves. Now you can "hard code" an effect so that as long as the creature has that effect it will trigger the sneak attack off that. Makes my job a lot easier cant wait to see what other things come out of this.

Do you think it will be possible to stack effects ie. Dropping clumsy 1 on a character 3 times will apply clumsy 3 or stunned or any other numbered effect or do you think just making a separate effect for each one is an easier way to go?

Milke
November 12th, 2019, 01:37
I'm actually very excited about this. I was never much into VTT's until I found Fantasy Grounds. And PF2 has me checking message boards and looking up how to automate things constantly. But in a good way, because I'm fascinated by it.

Trenloe
November 12th, 2019, 02:39
Do you think it will be possible to stack effects ie. Dropping clumsy 1 on a character 3 times will apply clumsy 3 or stunned or any other numbered effect or do you think just making a separate effect for each one is an easier way to go?
I've thought about it. I still haven't decided on exactly what I'm going to do. I had originally thought of allowing multiple drops to accumulate like what you mention, but the problem with this is that if there is, for example, already Clumsy: 1 on a creature with a certain duration and then they become Clumsy: 2 from a separate source, FG needs to track the duration of each if the lower value lasts longer. So I need to come up with a nice and easy way to add conditions with values - outside of the current manually editing of condition values once added to the creature in the CT.

Milke
November 12th, 2019, 23:41
I love the flatfooted is targetable now.
Just curious. Is the only way to do it, to drag the target icon onto the recipient? Or is there a way to program the effect button to where it applies to the person who clicked the effect?

Trenloe
November 12th, 2019, 23:56
Just curious. Is the only way to do it, to drag the target icon onto the recipient? Or is there a way to program the effect button to where it applies to the person who clicked the effect?
1) Add an ability (a spell record, but you'll use it as an ability) in your actions tab and then add an effect to that ability. Set the effect to Targeting = Targets, and give it the condition text Flat-footed
2) Target as normal the creature you want to add the targeted condition to.
3) Press the SHIFT key and drag/drop the effect you setup in step #1 - but drop it on your PC that has the end creature targeted.
4) The SHIFT key is telling FG that this is a targeted effect and to target that effect on the entry in the CT the effect is dropped on. As the PC has the creature targeted, and the effect is set to apply to the target, the effect will be placed on the creature (even though it was dropped on the PC) and the target of the effect will be the PC.

Too many targets ?? ;)

https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=30170

Bidmaron
November 13th, 2019, 04:23
Trenloe, the adds this week to PF2 were really awesome, including this. Thanks for the hard work, sir!

Milke
November 13th, 2019, 19:24
I echo Bidmaron that your updates were great.
Okay, so I see about the shift key targeting.

Just a question. Is there a way that a command could be made that could be added to the effect code. So that I could make one that would just go with a click?
So that the rogue player could target the creature, and just click his hotkey button, and the command coded in adds flat-footed targeted to him?
If not, it's still great. Just curious.

Trenloe
November 13th, 2019, 19:27
Just a question. Is there a way that a command could be made that could be added to the effect code. So that I could make one that would just go with a click?
So that the rogue player could target the creature, and just click his hotkey button, and the command coded in adds flat-footed targeted to him?
There could be a way, but it would be a long way down the development list.

Milke
November 13th, 2019, 20:49
Okay. Just wondering. If you can add it to the very bottom of the list, that'd be great.
As it stands even, it's pretty darn cool.

noalco
November 14th, 2019, 12:24
Hello everybody,

I think the Enfeebled condition is wrong. The condition sais that "When you are enfeebled, you take a status penalty equal to the condition value to Strength-based rolls and DCs, including Strength-based melee attack rolls, Strength-based damage rolls, and Athletics checks", so it must not apply any penalty to dexterity-based neither ranged weapons damage rolls, but it does. The alternative effect described here "ABIL: -1 status,strength; ATK: -1 status,melee; SKILL: -1 status,strength; DMG: -1 status,bludgeoning,piercing,slashing" neither does it work because ranged or dexterity-based damages with bludgeoning, piercing, or slashing damage types are also affected. Is there any way to implement the correct enfeebled condition?

Thank you in advance.

Trenloe
November 14th, 2019, 15:34
Is there any way to implement the correct enfeebled condition?
Use the Enfeebled: X condition. If this doesn't work correctly, please provide an example of it not working in FG (with a screenshot). Thanks.

Note: There's one issue where Enfeebled applies to all NPC damage checks. Logged as RS2.070.

noalco
November 14th, 2019, 17:56
Note: There's one issue where Enfeebled applies to all NPC damage checks. Logged as RS2.070.

Ok, that was the problem, i checked with an NPC. I have just used with a PC and it works correctly. Thank you ;)

Trenloe
November 14th, 2019, 18:21
Ok, that was the problem, i checked with an NPC. I have just used with a PC and it works correctly. Thank you ;)
Thanks for drawing my attention to the issue.

Release 10 will have an update to only apply the enfeebled penalty to NPC melee damage, or NPC damage that has the "thrown" trait. The one thing it won't do is differentiate if an NPC melee attack is a finesse attack and using the DEX bonus instead of STR for the attack check - as this could get quite complex, I've seem some NPCs with finesse weapons that still use their STR modifier to attack. So this will have to remain a manual adjustment by the GM if appropriate.

noalco
November 15th, 2019, 08:00
The one thing it won't do is differentiate if an NPC melee attack is a finesse attack and using the DEX bonus instead of STR for the attack check - as this could get quite complex, I've seem some NPCs with finesse weapons that still use their STR modifier to attack. So this will have to remain a manual adjustment by the GM if appropriate.

May be I have a solution based on any creature will attack with its best ability: if a creature has better DEX than STR and it is using a finesse weapon, it will attack using dexterity. Taking into account this premise, enfeebled will be only applied for finesse weapons in case that STR is greater than DEX.

Even more, if you want to implement a more flexible condition, I would take into account the difference between (attack with STR and the enfeebled penalty) and to attack with DEX, I explain it: let supose that one creature has STR 18 (+4) and DEX 14 (+2), and it attacks with STR and a finesse weapon; if that creature is enfeebled: 4, it attacks with a -4 penalty, but the creature could change its attack ability and using DEX (only a -2 penalty). In this case, the penalty of enfeebled would be the minimal value betwen the enfeebled value and (StrBonus-DexBonus)

I hope this can help you with the problem.

Larsenex
November 15th, 2019, 13:23
In the Modifiers is the modifier button 'Flat Footed'. Ive been following this thread but can I get a quick re-clarification on use of the button?

Player has flanked goblin. Does this player use the flat footed prior to attack to get the ac reduction for his attack?

Or do I (the gm) drag this button on the goblins CT effects/conditions?

Trenloe
November 15th, 2019, 16:41
In the Modifiers is the modifier button 'Flat Footed'. Ive been following this thread but can I get a quick re-clarification on use of the button?

Player has flanked goblin. Does this player use the flat footed prior to attack to get the ac reduction for his attack?

Or do I (the gm) drag this button on the goblins CT effects/conditions?
Modifier buttons apply a modifier to the next roll.

Effects are much more powerful, but can take longer to setup. So the modifier window is a quick way to apply situational modifiers to the next roll.

Trenloe
November 15th, 2019, 16:48
May be I have a solution based on any creature will attack with its best ability: if a creature has better DEX than STR and it is using a finesse weapon, it will attack using dexterity. Taking into account this premise, enfeebled will be only applied for finesse weapons in case that STR is greater than DEX.

Even more, if you want to implement a more flexible condition, I would take into account the difference between (attack with STR and the enfeebled penalty) and to attack with DEX, I explain it: let supose that one creature has STR 18 (+4) and DEX 14 (+2), and it attacks with STR and a finesse weapon; if that creature is enfeebled: 4, it attacks with a -4 penalty, but the creature could change its attack ability and using DEX (only a -2 penalty). In this case, the penalty of enfeebled would be the minimal value betwen the enfeebled value and (StrBonus-DexBonus)

I hope this can help you with the problem.
Yeah, I completely understand the maths behind it. I just don't want to over complicate things. Especially as NPC statblocks in PF2 don't follow the exact same rules as PCs - which is born out by some Bestiary statblocks I've looked at not making sense in terms of the pure maths calculation for finesse attacks. But I also don't want to penalise PCs if they enfeeble enemies. I'll look at more bestiary examples (it may be they're just wrong) and see what I can come up with in a future release.

theMaXX
November 18th, 2019, 17:02
Hi trenloe.
Is it possible to automatically set an effect to the current initiative -0.1?
That would be useful to automatically preset an effect to last until the end of my next turn without messing with the initiative everytime i add it.

Trenloe
November 18th, 2019, 17:21
Hi trenloe.
Is it possible to automatically set an effect to the current initiative -0.1?
Nope, that's not possible currently. You'll have to keep doing it manually.

In the future I plan to address end of turn effects - but it's a way off.

Rugburn
April 27th, 2020, 22:54
Is there a step-by-step example of putting this into play? I feel like I'm almost understanding. For example, if my party's bard uses Inspire Courage and I want to add an effect to my PCs to grant them +1 to attack and +1 to damage, would I add that to each individually or is there a way to automate it?

Weissrolf
April 27th, 2020, 23:40
Edit: Turns out that the "AC:" effect does not change the AC listed on the PC sheet, but it is still applied when an enemy tries to hit the PC.

Weissrolf
April 27th, 2020, 23:42
I managed to create a spell action effect that applies the bard's "Inspire Courage" effect of ATK:+1;DMG:+1 to all targets for 1 round. Now I wonder if I can create the effect in a way to automatically apply to/target all allies?

Will these kind of spell effects be pre-included in later iterations of the PFRPG2 module, so that players don't have to create them themselves?

Edit: Turns out that the "SR Drag N Drop" module has these kind of spell effects already pre-build into its spells for easy drag n drop into the action tab. They are not free of errors, but I will use those for the time being (or copy them) until PFRPG2 gets them built in, too.

Weissrolf
April 28th, 2020, 16:18
Today we had Frightened:1 effects on several party members. According to the description the Frightened value decreases at the end of a player's turn. The combat tracker only decreased the rounds, though, and then left the effect active at 0 rounds without ever removing it even after cycling through several rounds. Is this meant to work this way for the time being or is this a bug?

Larsenex
April 28th, 2020, 22:28
Weissrolf, I notice this as well. Its not quite fully automated and my players keep me on my toes > "HEY remove that Frightened 1' from me on the CT. I will remove them manually which is fine.

Weissrolf
May 1st, 2020, 10:49
Turns out that the automation works alright, but the effects are added with wrong duration and partly wrong initiative value.

The duration part should be easy to fix, because currently effects are added with a duration of zero (0) instead of 1. Once you manually change the value to 1 the effects is automatically removed at its initiative count.

The initiative value is just a tiny bit more complex, because some effects stop at the beginning of the initiative count they were cast at (usually beneficial ones), but others stop at the end of the initiative of the target (usually malign ones).

So "Frightened:1" should have a duration value of 1 and an initiative value at least 0.1 lower than the target's initiative (target ini 20 = frightened ini 19.x).

Also concerning conditions: I would really like for conditions to be double-clickable in the CT for getting a description of what the respective condition does. Until this is hopefully implemented I have to fill three F-key shortcut-bar entries just for condition descriptions and then still have to scroll through the list to find the correct one.

PS: "List of conditions: A to E" is not listed in the index of the reference manual. I had to click on the previous index entry and then click the next arrow to get to this part of the list, from there I could pull it into the shortcut-bar.

Trenloe
May 1st, 2020, 11:06
PS: "List of conditions: A to E" is not listed in the index of the reference manual.
It is in mine.

When was the last time you ran an update? Check the reference manual Credit and Legal -> Module Versioning - what is the latest version number you see?

EDIT: and this one too was updated just after the errata came out months ago:


- The Adventurer's Kit is listed as 2 bulk, despite the errata having decreased the bulk to 1.

Trenloe
May 1st, 2020, 11:37
Also concerning conditions: I would really like for conditions to be double-clickable in the CT for getting a description of what the respective condition does.
Like I said to you a couple of months ago. There are plans to do this. As mentioned here: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?53694-Adventures-Easy-access-to-skills-items-and-traits-descriptions&p=475278&viewfull=1#post475278

One of the things mentioned in that thread has since been implemented - double-click on NPC attack entry weapons traits. For other things I've mentioned, please have patience as this ruleset evolves.

Weissrolf
May 1st, 2020, 12:29
Thanks for the quick reply. Version is v1.11.

Turns out that I confused the reference manual's real index with the quick links that are offered in the library window. There were links for "Conditions" (short list) and the conditions descriptions "F to P" and "Q to Z". Curiously these are all gone now from said quick link list, likely after moving them to the shortcut-bar. Trying to move other entries of the list to the bar does not remove them, so no real idea.

Anyway, opening the reference reveals the correct index on the left side of the window.

Weissrolf
May 1st, 2020, 12:33
Workaround hint for people needing higher condition levels, like Frightened:2 and the like. When you rename the first condition entry in the combat tracker to a higher number then FG allows you to drag & drop the :1 condition to the CT again and thus stack the effects.

If anyone knows an easier way to handle this, I'm all ears and listening. ;)

MaxAstro
May 1st, 2020, 15:57
Oh, that's actually clever, Weissrolf. So you could for example apply Frightened:3 with a 1-turn duration, Frightened:2 with a 2-turn duration, and Frightened:1 with a 3 turn duration, and it would all work out correctly since they don't stack.

Weissrolf
May 1st, 2020, 19:26
Just don't forget to give them a duration other than zero (=default). Else they never vanish automatically. Also make sure to change their initiative value to 0.1 (or 1) below the affected character's initiative count, because frightened decreases at the *end* of the turn.

Weissrolf
May 1st, 2020, 19:35
Edit: created new thread

phumano
June 23rd, 2020, 12:45
Do you have this similarly for PF2 items? Now that we are reaching level 7, I've been adding effects to some of the items but it's tedious to go back and forth to the wiki and figure out commands. I'm not trying to learn FG as a coding language :)

Would you happen to have all the typically effects in one place? After this post, I only trust someone like you with this :)

phumano
June 23rd, 2020, 12:49
Love this. So do you drag the condition onto the creature if you say, demoralize them? Onto the token, or the combat tracker. Or can you just click it and the targeted creature is effect?