Alternate Critical Rolls

[Tielc]

In Roll20 we use an alternate critical roll system for Players and NPCs as follows. I'm wondering if this is possible within Fantasy Grounds to implement.

Critical Damage Dice

When you roll a critical damage roll, instead of rolling the damage dice a second time and adding this to the result of the damage, you add the maximum value for all of the damage dice to the normal damage roll. This eliminates the lack of heroism by rolling all 1s on a critical strike, and guarantees you will always do your full weapon damage plus variable damage.

As an example, a Rogue +3 Dexterity makes an attack with a Rapier (1d8 damage). On a normal hit the Rapier does 1d8 + 3 damage. Likewise, if the Rogue chose to use Sneak Attack, the damage would have been 1d8 + 3 + 1d6.

Using the above example, previously on a critical hit, the Rogue would have done 2d8 + 3 damage on a normal critical hit and 2d8 + 3 + 2d6 with Sneak Attack. With the new critical strike rules, the Rogue would now do 1d8 + 3 + 8 on a normal critical hit and 1d8 + 3 + 1d6 + 8 + 6 with Sneak Attack Damage.

This does not apply to abilities that add an additional dice to critical damage such as Savage Attacks.

Don't forget, this works for enemies too!

[Tielc]

I'm going to give this a shot - https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?34431-New-Extension-TheoGeek-s-Improved-Critical

[Trenloe]

See this extension: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?34431-New-Extension-TheoGeek-s-Improved-Critical It may need updating for FG v3.3.7.

EDIT: - You got there just before me. :)

[Tielc]

It seems to work. I may look into modifying this to support effect criticals. Likewise, it currently rolls all the dice, then overwrites one of them. I may look at not showing both the dice roll, and just incorporate rolling the dice, then adding max dice.

[Trenloe]

It seems to work. I may look into modifying this to support effect criticals. Likewise, it currently rolls all the dice, then overwrites one of them. I may look at not showing both the dice roll, and just incorporate rolling the dice, then adding max dice.
The good thing about this extension is that it doesn't mess around with the base 5E critical dice rolling mechanic, it just overrides the end result. So it's relatively robust in terms of future FG upgrades.

If you want to change the actual dice rolling then you're going to have to change the base 5E ruleset dice rolling mechanic - i.e. the damage action scripts. These scripts very often change with a new FG release, so you'll have to review and possibly update any such code every time there is a FG update.

[Tielc]

Ah, I'm wondering if I can catch the event that this does for weapon damage and apply to effects.

[Tielc]

It's really bizarre. If I create an action and add damage and an effect that do the same thing, the damage rolls the die on this extension properly, but the effect does not.

[TheoGeek]

Hey guys...original author here. Tielc - thanks for the interest! I created this with the idea of keeping it super simple, and didn't really look at side effects like you mentioned when adding effects. In the limited "off nominal" testing I did, it worked like I wanted it to, so I didn't mess with it much. If you want me to try some thing out, I will if i have time, but as Trenloe said, I didn't want to change anything about the base mechanics - I wanted to inject this as late in the process as I could find.

This was neat because it seemed like a fairly straightforward mod and coding it made me really appreciate the more advanced mods out there!

[Tielc]

I mean, I would love it if you took a look at this, but I can also understand that I'm probably the only one who's asked for this :D. I was hoping to take a look myself and see if I could start understanding what you've done vs what's done in the game. Time is just been no friend of mine lately.

[Zetesofos]

it's a great extension, but having the ability to max out effect dice would make it perfect. As it stands right now, things like Sneak Attack, Smite, or Hex don't gain the benefit, so they will fall behind a bit compared to other classes.

[deer_buster]

TheoGeek, I've done some work in my npc max damage option on LAE:ExpandedOptions that you might find useful. Take a look at the --Handle max damage option section of the code. Specifically where I check to see if the vClause contains the word ".critical". If I think about it, this whole section of code could simply be used (without the isPC check) at the end of the --Handle critical section right above it

[TheoGeek]

deer_buster: Thanks for the tips. I'll take a look!

I was able to do a quick change to my extension that makes effects behave the same way as damage dice. It works with sneak attack, but that's really the only thing I tested it with.

There are a couple of different ways to implement this simply in my extension, each has drawbacks, and result in different cosmetic effects in how the damage dice are displayed.

Damage dice are colored based on the kind of damage they are: "black" dice for normal damage, "green" for critical damage" and "purple" for effect damage.

Currently, my extension "maxes" the normal dice and rolls critical dice. This is why effect damage was not included in the maxxing.

There are a couple of ways to accomplish this:

1) Look for critical dice only and max those (leaving normal damage dice alone so they are "rolled")
2) Look for normal or effect dice and max those (leaving critical damage dice alone so they are "rolled")

Those two options give different results (see below) and display the damage dice differently.

Take for example a sneak attack with a weapon that does d6 damage.

A "standard" roll for sneak attack would display a black d6 and a purple d6 being with the rolled values.

Without my extension, a "critical" roll for display a black d6 a green d6 for the weapon damage with a critical roll, and a purple 6d and a green d6 for the effect damage with a critical roll.

With my extension the two cases above would result in the same colored dice being displayed with the difference being in what is displayed on the dice:

1) the black and purple dice would show the rolled damage, the green dice would be maxxed (display a 6)
2) the black and purple dice would show the maximum (6), the green dice would show the rolled damage.

It's either:

1) Roll damage, max crit dice
2) Max damage, roll crit dice

It's semantics, until traits like savage/brutal critical are taken into effect.

Each option has possible undesired effects:

1) By maxxing crit dice, Half-Orcs with savage/brutal criticals become WAY overpowered in that EVERY extra crit dice will always be maxxed. :)

2) By maxxing damage dice, it will also MAX damage on effects that should not benefit from the extra crit dice - namely any effect that requires a save.

I've update the extension thread with the updated whereby I implemented my option #2 mainly because maxing an effect that requires a save seems less dangerous than maxxing all the crit dice for things like savage / bruital critical - though those names would really mean something if they were maxxed!

Thanks!

[deer_buster]

With my extension the two cases above would result in the same colored dice being displayed with the difference being in what is displayed on the dice:

1) the black and purple dice would show the rolled damage, the green dice would be maxxed (display a 6)
2) the black and purple dice would show the maximum (6), the green dice would show the rolled damage.

It's either:

1) Roll damage, max crit dice
2) Max damage, roll crit dice

It's semantics, until traits like savage/brutal critical are taken into effect.


I think the intent that "most" people want is to have option 2 be the default. Perhaps an option selection to let the GM choose which s/he prefers, as well as an "off" option to turn it off if so desired without having to unload the extension.

[Tielc]

I was being extremely stupid, never mind. I was downloading the mod on my laptop which I am screen sharing with my workstation using Synergy. I was overwriting it in the wrong place.

I am still extremely excited you've done this. Super awesome!

[TheoGeek]

I think the intent that "most" people want is to have option 2 be the default. Perhaps an option selection to let the GM choose which s/he prefers, as well as an "off" option to turn it off if so desired without having to unload the extension.

Great idea. I am using your extension as a guide to create an options entry for my extension. I currently have it working where you can select "on" or "off", and I'd like to make it a cyclic option like:

"on", "maximize damage dice", "maximize critical dice", "off"

instead of just "on" and "off".

Maybe even add another option to include effects or not.

So many possibilities. :)

Thanks!

[TheoGeek]

OK, major update uploaded. See https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?34431-New-Extension-TheoGeek-s-Improved-Critical&p=293828#post293828.

From the update blurb:

---- Updated (25 February 2019) ------
Improved Critical (new version numbering 1.4) - Add settings item controls as follows:

Combat Settings:Improved Critical: Control = [Max Damage Dice | Max Critical Dice | Max Both | Off] - Defaults to "Max Damage Dice"

Max Damage Dice = All damage dice are maxxed, critical dice are rolled
Max Critical Dice = All critical dice are maxxed (including extra critical dice from features like Savage Critical, Brutal Critical, etc.), damage dice are rolled
Max Both = All damage AND all critical dice are maxxed
Off = revert to standard critical handler

Combat Settings:Improved Critical: Include Effect Dice [Yes | No] - Defaults to "Yes"
Yes = Damage dice from effects (such as sneak attack) are included in the calculations above
No = Damage dice from effects are rolled as normal

If you select "Control = Max Both" and "Include Effect Dice = Yes", on a critical hit, you will do the maximum possible damage from all dice so be careful.

Desired updates: Make the "Include Effect Dice" setting unselectable (or forced to "Off") if Control is "Off".

[TheoGeek]

Updated to v1.5 which handles MAX modifier.

I think this is a temporary fix as the HALF works with no modification as I'd expect (I assume as part of the DecodeDamageTypes method). I believe MAX should be computed there as well, but MAX doesn't work for me, even with my extension disabled.

I included support for it in my extension for now.

Thanks!

[TheoGeek]

Ignore my discussion about Max damage. It works fine, it was my extension that was not re-enabling the default handler upon disable.

I've uploaded version 1.7 that should have everything fixed.

I tested it with all the options using all combinations of Max and Critical, and I didn't see any strangeness. :) Finally!

[Broadcast Bard]

https://i.imgur.com/vNvWLSV.png

[TheoGeek]

https://i.imgur.com/vNvWLSV.png

See here:

https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?34431-New-Extension-TheoGeek-s-Improved-Critical&p=499671&viewfull=1#post499671

It's a conflict between LAE:Expanded Options and my extension. You can "fix" it by adjusting the load order as shown in that thread, but then some things in LAE won't work.