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Aphelion
January 3rd, 2019, 01:46
I'm wondering if it is possible to create new item tables. Using the attached picture as reference, When I click on the item tab on the right side of the screen it brings up the items list (on the left). At the top of that list there are tabs labeled "Armor" and "Weapons". When I click on either of those tabs it opens the corresponding tables (on the right). I understand how to edit those tables but I'm wanting to create a new table specifically for vehicles. Is that possible within the program? Preferably I would like it to create a corresponding tab as well next to the Armor and Weapon tabs.

25812

LordEntrails
January 3rd, 2019, 07:16
Not from within the GUI. If you are comfortable, you can do it in the XML files manually with a text editor. I'm not sure how though, never had a strong enough desire to do so. But I know it has been discussed and detailed a few times in previous posts.

Talyn
January 3rd, 2019, 14:08
Since vehicle records were added to CoreRPG+ exactly one year ago today, but have never yet been added to the PFRPG ruleset (no Vehicles button on the library selection) I'd say the better idea would be to post an official request for Pathfinder Vehicle records to be included.

EDIT: I've just made the request, please go vote (https://fg2app.idea.informer.com/proj/fg2app?ia=123126) for it.

Doing a normal list of items sorted by type is quite easy within the .mod XML. Adding a button, however, requires a bit more effort and can only be done in an extension unless/until they get officially added to the ruleset.

Aphelion
January 3rd, 2019, 16:46
Thanks for the information!

Aphelion
January 3rd, 2019, 16:48
That's excellent. Thank you! I'll vote and post.

Trenloe
January 3rd, 2019, 18:00
Since vehicle records were added to CoreRPG+ exactly one year ago today, but have never yet been added to the PFRPG ruleset (no Vehicles button on the library selection) I'd say the better idea would be to post an official request for Pathfinder Vehicle records to be included.

EDIT: I've just made the request, please go vote (https://fg2app.idea.informer.com/proj/fg2app?ia=123126) for it.
Vehicles have been in the PFRPG ruleset for a number of years - they are a subset of NPC, selected using the radio button selected at the bottom of a NPC record: Creature, Trap/Haunt or Vehicle.

AlphaDecay
January 3rd, 2019, 18:03
When you export a module you get a file called "common.xml" that contains all of the information that goes into the equipment lists. There is a section called lists that you can edit/create to make one. First you need to tell it you want an equipment list, so in the example below you'll see a section called "equipmentlists" with an example list called Adventuring Gear. Now that you've referenced your Adventuring Gear category, you need to create a list of items. Below you see a "record name" called lists.equipment.gear. That means we need to make a "gear" section underneath lists, but also within equipment. Another thing is you'll notice in my below example references to "id-00066". That is the "id" for arrows in my example below and it matches the id number for arrows that comes from the item list (as it must exist as a separate item) and will be shown in the <item> section of common.xml. The same id number is also in the <equipmentdata> section of the common.xml file. Obnoxious, but thats what gets "arrows" placed into all of the appropriate places. I have added those bits in the example what that looks like for my "arrows" example so there's a complete sample. This is all work I had to do to import Adventures in Middle Earth to FG so maybe is a bit much, but does show what it looks like.

Here is what it would look like:


<lists>
<equipment>
<equipmentlists>
<name type="string">Equipment</name>
<index>
<r01gear>
<name type="string">Adventuring Gear</name>
<listlink type="windowreference">
<class>reference_adventuringgeartable</class>
<recordname>lists.equipment.gear</recordname>
</listlink>
</r01gear>
</index>
</equipmentlists>
<gear>
<description type="string">Adventuring Gear</description>
<groups>
<r01ammunition>
<description type="string">Ammunition</description>
<equipment>
<id-00066>
<link type="windowreference">
<class>reference_equipment</class>
<recordname>reference.equipmentdata.id-00066</recordname>
</link>
<name type="string">Arrows (20)</name>
<cost type="string">1s</cost>
<weight type="number">1</weight>
</id-00066>
</r01ammunition>
</groups>
</gear>
</equipment>
<referencemanual>...stuff here...</referencemanual>
<imagewindow>...stuff here...</imagewindow>
<item>
<name type="string">Items</name>
...65 other items above this one...
<id-00066>
<listlink type="windowreference">
<class>item</class>
<recordname>reference.equipmentdata.id-00066@Adventures in Middle Earth Player's Handbook</recordname>
</listlink>
<name type="string">Arrows (20)</name>
</id-00066>
...other items follow...
</item>
...bunch of other sections follow (npc, backgrounds, class, feat, race, skill)
</lists>
<reference static="true">
...bunch of data sections...
<equiptmentdata>
<category name="AiME - PHB" baseicon="0" decalicon="0">
...65 other items above this one...
<id-00066>
<ac type="number">0</ac>
<bonus type="number">0</bonus>
<cost type="string">1s</cost>
<description type="formattedtext">
<p></p>
</description>
<isidentified type="number">1</isidentified>
<istemplate type="number">0</istemplate>
<locked type="number">1</locked>
<name type="string">Arrows (20)</name>
<subtype type="string">Ammunition</subtype>
<type type="string">Adventuring Gear</type>
<weight type="number">1</weight>
</id-00066>
...other items follow...
</equipmentdata>
...even more data sections...
</reference>

Talyn
January 3rd, 2019, 18:11
Vehicles have been in the PFRPG ruleset for a number of years - they are a subset of NPC, selected using the radio button selected at the bottom of a NPC record: Creature, Trap/Haunt or Vehicle.

AHA! I could have swore I'd seen them before but couldn't for the life of me find them this morning. Never would have occurred to me that early in the am to look under NPCs rather than Items.

Should I delete that vote then? (Assuming the site allows that)

Trenloe
January 3rd, 2019, 18:15
Should I delete that vote then? (Assuming the site allows that)
I don't know if you can delete it. If not, maybe edit or add a comment.

Talyn
January 3rd, 2019, 18:26
Sadly, just like the forums here, it doesn't allow deletion so I added a comment.

Thanks for pointing that out. I knew damn well I'd seen it before and was quite frustrated at not being able to locate where this morning.

Aphelion
January 3rd, 2019, 19:18
Thank you Trenloe. That is very helpful but it does still leave me wanting a pretty little categorized table with pricing and links to the individual vehicles for my players to look through. I am glad they are there. I just wish it was a little more integrated like the items lists.

In general I just wish there was the ability to create new item tables and tabs. It seems like a relatively easy function to incorporate for neat freaks like me lol.

Hell with that in mind it would also be cool if the item tabs were editable so that you could write out your own features to the item

e.g

Vehicle name:
Hitpoints:
Hard Points:
AC:
Speed:
Acceleration:
Movement Type:
Load Capacity:

Etc..

Then I could fill out my own customized items.

Trenloe
January 3rd, 2019, 19:34
Thank you Trenloe. That is very helpful but it does still leave me wanting a pretty little categorized table with pricing and links to the individual vehicles for my players to look through. I am glad they are there. I just wish it was a little more integrated like the items lists.
The group lists attached to buttons are defined in a ruleset. You can write an extension to do your own.

Or, add a request to the FG wish list.


Hell with that in mind it would also be cool if the item tabs were editable so that you could write out your own features to the item

e.g

Vehicle name:
Hitpoints:
Hard Points:
AC:
Speed:
Acceleration:
Movement Type:
Load Capacity:

Etc..

Then I could fill out my own customized items.
Item records are based off the individual RPG system used, and the fields used in records from those RPGs systems. Individual records fields need to be defined within the ruleset with a specific purpose. If you just add new fields without any programming behind them, then they are just being displayed for informational purposes only. If you want to add data to items for informational purposes, then you can add then into the description field (the last field) - this is a formatted text control, so you can use formatting to make it look nicer. Otherwise, if you want to define custom fields, and then actually use those for something in the ruleset, you'll need to write code (an extensions) for that.

Aphelion
January 3rd, 2019, 20:24
Thanks again Trenloe! Ya, I'm a few steps into retarded when it comes to writing code. I think my eyes started glazing and I started drooling just from what AlphaDecay was trying to show me. I might see if I could get some stuff in the wish list. I don't think the record fields issue would be too big of a problem. Certain things like Hitpoints, AC, Toughness, etc... could be defined through the ruleset but then other things like speed, acceleration, load, etc... are technically only for informational purposes anyway. Who knows though. Maybe it would be much harder to incorporate than what I'm thinking. I guess I'll see. Thanks everyone.

Talyn
January 3rd, 2019, 21:01
Just from a super-quick Google it looks like 99% of the vehicles in Pathfinder are contained in Ultimate Combat so we may have to wait for someone to sign up to adapt that for Fantasy Grounds. (Don't look at me, I have three remaining Player Companions then I will probably bow out of doing Pathfinder projects.) That said, even Ultimate Combat does not have the 'equipment lists' we see for, well, equipment which the FG lists try to duplicate. So whomever adapts Ultimate Combat will likely just do either a reference_list or more likely a reference_groupedlist to group them into Air, Land and Water vehicles.

I do kinda question having them under NPCs though; but maybe there was a good reason for that decision back then? I've never had vehicles in play during PFS games yet to see if there's any specific reason for it yet. Should the 'dog sled' in the Core Rulebook be considered a vehicle?

Moon Wizard
January 3rd, 2019, 21:14
At the time; Vehicles had many characteristics similar to NPCs, and it allowed them to be added to tracker.

You gotta stop playing the looking on the rear view mirror game. :)

Just go with the system in place, and take advantage of new stuff when you can. It doesn’t have to be perfect.

Cheers,
JPG

Aphelion
January 3rd, 2019, 21:16
I'm sure they did it that way so vehicles could be added to the combat tracker. I don't see why they couldn't still be counted as an npc while also being linked to the items list though... Oh well.

Aphelion
January 3rd, 2019, 21:26
At the time; Vehicles had many characteristics similar to NPCs, and it allowed them to be added to tracker.

You gotta stop playing the looking on the rear view mirror game. :)

Just go with the system in place, and take advantage of new stuff when you can. It doesn’t have to be perfect.

Cheers,
JPG

I kinda have to disagree with you there Moon Wizard. If I looked at things like that in my business then I would go out of business relatively quick. Part of being a successful business entity is indeed listening to your customers and modifying accordingly. I'm not saying that what I am suggesting is necessarily worthy of change but overall I think that philosophy is a failing one and one that could see some other development company come forward and surpass FG if that wasn't their company policy as well. I personally can't see why any company wouldn't always want to better their product and make it more adaptable and customizable.

Moon Wizard
January 3rd, 2019, 23:16
Lol, I guess there's some missing context. Talyn has been doing a lot of revamping of content lately to use the latest features; and I was simply making a poke at him because he's always pushing for more.

On the features side, we have a lot of priorities to juggle in terms of what makes the best sense to spend time on. Additionally, what some people think of as minor changes actually have far reaching impacts when you consider that we have 10+ years worth of DLC and community content that people assume will continue to work without hiccup. Also, even if we think something would make a good improvement, it's not always a good business decision based on the improvement vs. amount of work needed; not to mention that not everyone agrees on what is an improvement.

Talyn is good at asking the questions anew; while I focus on all the compound effects across our DLC library, store system, rulesets, and client software. It's a balance.

Regards,
JPG

damned
January 3rd, 2019, 23:41
I kinda have to disagree with you there Moon Wizard. If I looked at things like that in my business then I would go out of business relatively quick. Part of being a successful business entity is indeed listening to your customers and modifying accordingly. I'm not saying that what I am suggesting is necessarily worthy of change but overall I think that philosophy is a failing one and one that could see some other development company come forward and surpass FG if that wasn't their company policy as well. I personally can't see why any company wouldn't always want to better their product and make it more adaptable and customizable.

As you can see the forums are littered with hundreds and hundreds of requests for Vehicles as a separate entry and... oh hang on...
Running a successful business is a lot more involved than investing coding hours on random requests...


In general I just wish there was the ability to create new item tables and tabs. It seems like a relatively easy function to incorporate for neat freaks like me lol.

combined with


I think my eyes started glazing and I started drooling just from what AlphaDecay was trying to show me.

makes for a compelling case...

Non programmers always think that their changes/improvements would be very easy to implement. Even programmers of another system sometimes think they know how easy something would be to do in someone elses system. This has always been the way and I suspect always will be.

Im not saying you are wrong... there is just far more to things than "it should be simple" and "you should do it".

Talyn
January 3rd, 2019, 23:51
Lol, I guess there's some missing context. Talyn has been doing a lot of revamping of content lately to use the latest features; and I was simply making a poke at him because he's always pushing for more.

On the features side, we have a lot of priorities to juggle in terms of what makes the best sense to spend time on. Additionally, what some people think of as minor changes actually have far reaching impacts when you consider that we have 10+ years worth of DLC and community content that people assume will continue to work without hiccup. Also, even if we think something would make a good improvement, it's not always a good business decision based on the improvement vs. amount of work needed; not to mention that not everyone agrees on what is an improvement.

Talyn is good at asking the questions anew; while I focus on all the compound effects across our DLC library, store system, rulesets, and client software. It's a balance.

Regards,
JPG

Oh just admit it, I'm a huge pain in your ***! :)

But yes, context is king. As MW stated, in addition to doing new content I've spent the last year doing a TON of remastering and updating older content that had little to no features to adding as many of the new features as I can, as well as taking up a considerable amount of his time in email conversations. I've only been around for two years (right? or has it been longer?) so I wasn't around for the Why Things Are This Way™ such as vehicles being NPCs back in the day.

I also often—such as this morning—leap without looking. I knew damn well I'd seen vehicles in PFRPG somewhere but I don't get to actually play PFRPG often enough to remember where, and instead of making my coffee and leaving things alone, I jumped right in and, well... here we are.

LordEntrails
January 4th, 2019, 07:17
Let me add one other unimportant opinion, if a vehicle is not an NPC, then how do I attack it and do damage to it? *G*

Darn it, can't things just be simple!