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Samarex
August 13th, 2018, 02:58
Morning, First off the first part of Rev 1.0.12 is on the Test server. This first part addresses Weapon Critical hits being automatically applied to the target(s) when you roll a Critical hit.
You can check it out if you like. I wanted to put it up so some field testing could be done and I can make any changes that might need done before it goes live after I get the second part of the Rev done.


But I do have one question as I have yet seen a answer from other posts and even posts on the Paizo Forum.
Burn and Corrode Critical Effect. ( they work the same other than the type Damage so Im just going to use Burn.
From the Core Rules Book
CRITICAL HIT EFFECTS Pg 182
Burn- The target gains the burning condition (see page 273).

CONDITION DESCRIPTIONS pg 273
Burning
You are on fire. As long as you have this condition, at the start of your turn each round before you take any actions (or attempt the Reflex saving throw described below), you take the listed amount of damage as fire damage (or 1d6 fire damage, if no amount is listed in the effect that causes burning). Fire damage from multiple sources that inflict the burning condition is cumulative.
At the end of each round you are burning, you can attempt a Reflex saving throw to remove this condition. The DC of this saving throw is equal to 10 + the amount of fire damage you took this round from the burning condition. If you succeed at this saving throw, you lose the burning condition. You can attempt a new saving throw each round you have this condition, and you receive a +2 bonus for each previous saving throw youíve attempted in consecutive rounds.
You can also automatically end this condition by jumping into enough water to douse yourself. If you donít have enough water on hand, you can spend a full action to roll on the ground or otherwise smother the fire to attempt a new saving throw with a +4 bonus (plus any bonuses from previously failed consecutive attempts) to end the condition.


I read this and it is not clear when it talks about the saving throw and stacked effects of burning.
It says " Fire damage from multiple sources that inflict the burning condition is cumulative." and "If you succeed at this saving throw, you lose the burning condition."

I seen this as the Effects stack and if you succeed at the saving throw ALL burning conditions are removed. But I was questioned by one of the other developers that he thinks we need to roll a Save for Each condition.

I would like to have some clarification on how this rule works.

Thanks

Torg Smith
August 13th, 2018, 03:36
I read this "Fire damage from multiple sources that inflict the burning condition is cumulative." as adding all the damage together.
"The DC of this saving throw is equal to 10 + the amount of fire damage you took this round from the burning condition." I believe this is the sum from before.

This is just my opinion from the reading.

damned
August 13th, 2018, 03:44
I believe that you are no longer burning once you have succeeded in the save. The save is vs the damage from the cumulative sources and so the save is vs the cumulative sources.

Samarex
August 13th, 2018, 03:50
I read this "Fire damage from multiple sources that inflict the burning condition is cumulative." as adding all the damage together.
"The DC of this saving throw is equal to 10 + the amount of fire damage you took this round from the burning condition." I believe this is the sum from before.

This is just my opinion from the reading.

Yes the damage and the DC are not really in question. The main question is if you have to roll a saving throw for each effect.
I.E
Round 1
Joe Blow gets Burning 1d4

Round 2
Joe Blow takes 1d4 fire damage

Joe Blow attempts a saving throw and fails.

Joe Blow gets hit again with a critical burn 1d4 ((burning 1d4, burning 1d4) for a total of burning 2d4)

Round 3
Joe Blow takes 2d4 fire damage

Saving Throw - (Does Joe Blow Roll 1 Saving throw to remove the condition or does he have to roll two saving throws one for each burning 1d4).

Samarex
August 13th, 2018, 04:10
I believe that you are no longer burning once you have succeeded in the save. The save is vs the damage from the cumulative sources and so the save is vs the cumulative sources.

Thats the way I read it also.

I set up the code to just replace effects so in Joe Blows case on round two in stead of his effects list having
Burning d4;DMGO:1d4
Burning d4;DMGO:1d4

The first Burning d4;DMGO:1d4 is deleted and replaced with Burning d4;DMGO:2d4

Now if he gets a Burn 1d6 then he would just have the effect Burning d6;DMGO:1d6 added to his list.

KillerRabbit
August 13th, 2018, 13:35
You throw only one save. You don't have multiple fires. The fire just went bigger and is doing more damage. Rolling on the floor (reflex save) puts out all the fire, not just one part of it.

Blacklamb
August 21st, 2018, 00:04
I have a question on a critical effect "Recharge" one of my players weapons has recharge 2 and when it crits it should get back two charges. Currently it looks like it just does not use the charge for that hit? I would expect it to not only not use that charge (the weapon uses 1 charge per use) but also give back a use in the ammo tracking.

I also have one other question, how would you enter two critical effects on a weapon? I have goblin modified weapons who are risky to use but have slightly better crits, for example Knockback & Recharge 1.

Overall I am really loving having crits auto apply the effects, and can't wait for 1.0.12 to be out.

Samarex
August 21st, 2018, 02:47
I have a question on a critical effect "Recharge" one of my players weapons has recharge 2 and when it crits it should get back two charges. Currently it looks like it just does not use the charge for that hit? I would expect it to not only not use that charge (the weapon uses 1 charge per use) but also give back a use in the ammo tracking.

I also have one other question, how would you enter two critical effects on a weapon? I have goblin modified weapons who are risky to use but have slightly better crits, for example Knockback & Recharge 1.

Overall I am really loving having crits auto apply the effects, and can't wait for 1.0.12 to be out.

Question. What weapon I don't recall a Recharge critical effect. So there is no coing for it. Where did the weapon come from.
Are other weapons marking off uses?

In regards to 1.0.12. Its allmost ready, We need to update the sourse books to adjust some class data structure before we can release, it will allow for new class content to be easly added to the system from other sourses.

Blacklamb
August 21st, 2018, 03:05
The weapon in question is the electrovore gloves (alien archive, pg:45). The recharge critical effect is explained on the bottom of that page. Speaking of charges there is also now a fusion in the Armory that gives you back the charge/ammo if you miss. On the topic of fusions a lot of them give you an alternative critical effect that you pick at the time of the damage roll do you have handling for that?

As for testing charges my computer that I have setup to test on I left at work so I’ll check tomorrow.

Samarex
August 21st, 2018, 04:54
The weapon in question is the electrovore gloves (alien archive, pg:45). The recharge critical effect is explained on the bottom of that page. Speaking of charges there is also now a fusion in the Armory that gives you back the charge/ammo if you miss. On the topic of fusions a lot of them give you an alternative critical effect that you pick at the time of the damage roll do you have handling for that?

As for testing charges my computer that I have setup to test on I left at work so I’ll check tomorrow.

Ok, I will look at that and add the effect.
As for multiable effects I will look into it. I have to see what happens if I put more than one effect in the damage string. But in the end what it will probally do is the same I have done with wounds. It will add both effects to the target and you remove the one you dont want.
This may improve later.

Samarex
August 21st, 2018, 06:40
Ok, I will look at that and add the effect.
As for multiable effects I will look into it. I have to see what happens if I put more than one effect in the damage string. But in the end what it will probally do is the same I have done with wounds. It will add both effects to the target and you remove the one you dont want.
This may improve later.

Now that I read your post again, You could for nw create the weapon too have two different damage strings one for each type of critical then just use the one you want.
For now it will require two seperate weapons. I have on my improment list to add a second damage string box to weapons to handle issues like this one. When done your damage editor will have a second damage area, you will be able to put one damage in the first one and a different damage in the second, it will roll only the damage fron the string you select. Of course you will still be able to put multi damage types in one section and it will roll all at the same time as it does now.
But thats on the todo list.

Samarex
August 21st, 2018, 09:43
The weapon in question is the electrovore gloves (alien archive, pg:45). The recharge critical effect is explained on the bottom of that page. Speaking of charges there is also now a fusion in the Armory that gives you back the charge/ammo if you miss. On the topic of fusions a lot of them give you an alternative critical effect that you pick at the time of the damage roll do you have handling for that?

As for testing charges my computer that I have setup to test on I left at work so I’ll check tomorrow.

I was looking and remembered.
The reason that the it does not use a Usage is because it is a Powered Weapon, so I have it set to be manual control of Uses for weapons with this special property
.
Powered (Page 181 Core Rules)
A melee weapon with an internal battery that must be charged
to function has the powered special property, which lists its
capacity and usage. Unlike with a ranged weapon, the usage is
for 1 minute of operation rather than per attack, though using
a powered weapon for less than 1 full minute still expends 1 full
usage. The number of charges expended is equal to the usage
◊ the number of minutes the weapon is used, rounded up to
the nearest minute. You can activate the power of the weapon
as part of the action used to make an attack with it, and it
automatically deactivates after 1 minute.
As with ranged weapons, you can recharge the battery of
a powered melee weapon using a generator or a recharging
station, or you can purchase new batteries for it. If you try to
attack with a powered weapon that’s out of charges, it functions
as an improvised weapon (see page 169).

And with that in mind the Effect Recharge right now does not apply to the Target. which is good because it should not. It does report to chat that there is a Critical Effect Recharge 2 and since the Usage is manual for Powered Weapons the Player can take off 2 Uses.