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celestian
April 21st, 2018, 06:54
If you roll initiative every round instead of once an "encounter" then you probably want this.

This tiny little extension will update the "initiative" value on a effect when the pc/npc's initiative changes.

https://i.imgur.com/AQFFxWv.png

And then I rolled again:

https://i.imgur.com/ctL729O.png

GitHub (https://github.com/CelestianGC/ChangeInitUpdateEffects) if you care for that sorta thing.

Initial version: 1.0

Download here:

rob2e
April 22nd, 2018, 01:47
YES! I'ma try and blow this up.

Bonkon
April 22nd, 2018, 01:53
Good Day All :)
We do roll initiative every round in my game.
I thought that number was there so if you have an effect that lasts longer than instantaneous it would end on the initiative it was cast instead of ending too soon or late depending on initiatives rolled after casting.

celestian
April 22nd, 2018, 05:39
Good Day All :)
We do roll initiative every round in my game.
I thought that number was there so if you have an effect that lasts longer than instantaneous it would end on the initiative it was cast instead of ending too soon or late depending on initiatives rolled after casting.

I'm not a 5e guy but I think the way spells work for some of them is they end on the casters initiative in some cases. If you roll initiative every round then that changes. Meaning the spell might not end on the casters turn.

Using this extension will change the effect to end on the player's turn.

Zacchaeus
April 22nd, 2018, 11:01
Good Day All :)
We do roll initiative every round in my game.
I thought that number was there so if you have an effect that lasts longer than instantaneous it would end on the initiative it was cast instead of ending too soon or late depending on initiatives rolled after casting.

I think I agree with you. If a character casts a spell which lasts until the character's next turn Fantasy Grounds notes the initiative that the spell was cast on and decrements the length of time when that number comes back around. Even if the initiative changes every round the 'initiative to end on' counter doesn't change. So, if a player in the first round on initiative count 10 casts a spell which lasts until its next turn then the spell will end on the next turn on initiative count 10 even if the character's initiative has changed to 5 or 25. Technically that means that the spell is not ending during the character's turn but on what would appear to be an arbitrary time. However the spell will last the correct length of time (in my view).

By changing the initiative count when a spell ends then in some cases the character will get a much greater benefit from the spell and in others they'll get no benefit at all. If we imagine a character in the first round casting a spell on an NPC which allows for all attacks against it to be rolled with advantage until the end of the caster's next turn. If the caster in the first round has initiative of 25 and in the second has initiative of 1 and the initiative to adjust on is changed to mirror the caster's initiative then the spell will effectively last two rounds making the spell much more powerful than is intended.

However on the other side of the coin if the player goes last in the first turn and first in the next the spell will effectively be wasted since it will come off immediately.

But some people like that kind of randomness.

LordEntrails
April 22nd, 2018, 16:48
It's an interesting discussion. And I don't think their is a single right answer.

Another thing to think about, Initiative is a construct, a way to help us resolve things in a coordinated way that our minds can comprehend without the chaos or reality, and in a way that generally can be accepted as "fair". Even if a character's initiative changes, their actions still take an entire turn to happen.

What does that mean for spells? depends on your views. Heck, one could argue that spell effects shouldn't start on the initiative count, but rather at the end of the round, and then always end at the end of a round as well. But, such would increase booking and discontinuities with non-spell actions.

Options are good, thanks for the extension :)

Pepor
April 28th, 2018, 11:45
Thanks Celestian!

I am going to try it for sure because we roll initiative every round in my games and we have to be paying attention to the effects duration and to that little number in the combat tracker. As Zacchaeus says, we like that kind of randomness XD.

Smoltok
May 3rd, 2018, 21:27
Thanks for this extension !

Very useful to be sure taht some effect will really end at the next round !

skj310
May 7th, 2018, 05:17
All things aside ... its nice to have an effect stay in the CT past round turnover with the auto-init in effect. Nicely done!

Eldarc
May 23rd, 2018, 22:52
Awesome! I asked for this in this very forum some weeks ago. I don't know if you read my post or not, but THANK YOU! :)

Fantell
October 17th, 2018, 11:09
this makes things like invisibility, one round, (from class effects etc) actually track properly. while it is cool having the option to track when a spell was cast by its turn in the initiativer order by exact number, this makes it so much easier to code a whole bunch of stuff that shouldn't last past a persons next turn, as per the games intentions. (after all, abilities that are worded "UNTIL THE END OF THE CASTERS NEXT TURN" mean its up for their initiative, whatever they happen to roll on the next round, and no longer or shorter than that. sure, the other way is fun, but isn't how it is intended to work.

rob2e
February 28th, 2019, 05:18
So in tonight's game, we had 2 instances of this not working.

One when the Help Action was applied, but as soon as the round changed, it disappeared.

The same thing happened with the Dodge Action.

celestian
February 28th, 2019, 05:53
So in tonight's game, we had 2 instances of this not working.

One when the Help Action was applied, but as soon as the round changed, it disappeared.

The same thing happened with the Dodge Action.

I'm not sure what either of those are unfortunately (not a 5e guy). Can you explain how you configured the effect exactly and I'll experiment.

rob2e
February 28th, 2019, 06:01
I'm not sure what either of those are, unfortunately (not a 5e guy). Can you explain how you configured the effect exactly and I'll experiment.

Dodge is just the word Dodge in the Combat Tracker and has a time of 1 round, it's supposed to stay on the PC until the START on its next turn.

Help is similar, it's an effect applied to a PC by another PC and it expires when used (which does work properly) or at the START of the appliERS next turn.

celestian
March 1st, 2019, 18:36
Dodge is just the word Dodge in the Combat Tracker and has a time of 1 round, it's supposed to stay on the PC until the START on its next turn.

Help is similar, it's an effect applied to a PC by another PC and it expires when used (which does work properly) or at the START of the appliERS next turn.

Okay, so Help is not going to expire on the "appliers" turn. The module only tracks the object with the effects turn.

As to Dodge you need to set the duration to 1 and set the round it's suppose to go on.

https://i.imgur.com/sb7efh8.png

If you don't set that to something valid (NOT 0) it'll just be decremented at end of round and expire. Set it to the current "turn" the player has like I did in the example above.

rob2e
March 1st, 2019, 20:22
So if I’m understanding, having to make manual adjustments kind of defeats the purpose. Also, you don’t know the initiative until FG rolls it on the next round so this kind of becomes useless in that case, no?

In other words, what is the benefit of the extension?

celestian
March 1st, 2019, 20:55
So if I’m understanding, having to make manual adjustments kind of defeats the purpose. Also, you don’t know the initiative until FG rolls it on the next round so this kind of becomes useless in that case, no?

In other words, what is the benefit of the extension?

For this effect? I've no idea. It works for the others because they persist for more than 1 round and thus I can set the initiative it triggers on. I can't know the future and set it... boy if I did I'd be a lot richer right now.

rob2e
March 1st, 2019, 20:58
I’m not an extension expert, but couldn’t you “mark” the players I it and then when the next round comes, reset all matching numbers? It seems that would be possible.

celestian
March 1st, 2019, 21:32
I’m not an extension expert, but couldn’t you “mark” the players I it and then when the next round comes, reset all matching numbers? It seems that would be possible.

Not sure what you're trying to say.

Here is what will work. On the PCs turn, If you want them to have DODGE up until their next turn, give them the effect Dodge with duration 1 and set the initiative to anything equal/greater than their current initiative. It will last until their next initiative is active.

The problem is the extension won't manage an effect with a activation round of 0.