Rappan Athuk

[Fionavar]

Hi there,

My party of adventurers will likely finish Slumbering Tsar in May - after 6 years of adventuring face-face! I am - however - relocating out of town and we are seriously looking at RA to be run on FG. I know that the maps will be coming out soon for the PF system. I am wondering if there is a community pack for the adventure? I have all of the PDFs for RA. As well, could someone explain how the OGL works with FG? How do they get added to the game? As well, I have a license for Zoom and am thinking of using that for the audio/video connexion: anyone else using Zoom? Anything else you might have time to offer would be well received. Thanks for any wisdom you might be able to offer to a newb!

[Trenloe]

Welcome to the forums!

It is planned to commercially release Rappan Athuk. Some info here: Some info here: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?40186-Rappan-Athuk-coming-to-Fantasy-Grounds&p=355504&viewfull=1#post355504


As well, could someone explain how the OGL works with FG?
Anyone can share anything which is released under the OGL - as long as you share it with the OGL included. This does not include artwork or descriptive text, etc..

Only game mechanics are part of the OGL, and Frog God Games' copyright statement in the Pathfinder edition of Rappan Athuk is: " All characters, names, places, items, art and text herein are copyrighted by Frog God Games, Inc." So, you'd really only be able to reproduce NPC statblocks and item game mechanics, in theory you wouldn't be able to use proper names for key NPCs etc.. You couldn't include any maps, artwork, etc..

So, you can either wait for a Pathfinder FG version (maybe, or maybe not - they seem to be concentrating on 5e for the first release), or you can build it yourself in FG. The Creature Parser will help get the NPCs into FG (See the note in post #2 about FGG statblocks): https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?20522-Pathfinder-Creature-Parser-V2-Beta-Version Other than that, you'll need to export the maps from the PDF and import them into FG - or buy the new maps from the recent kickstarter.

[Trenloe]

You'll also find a lot of the monsters in the Tome of Horrors products available in FG format: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/store/?sys=9&pub=36&typ=-1&search=&sort=1

[Fionavar]

Thanks Trenloe! Is there any way to figure out possible timeframe for the PF release?

[Trenloe]

Thanks Trenloe! I was not aware the KS was also for PF. Will see if they can offer any clarity!
To clarify - No Fantasy Grounds Rappan Athuk product has been kickstarted by FGG for this. The Kickstarter mentioned in the thread I linked is for the 5E version of Rappan Athuk in PDF/book form.

All we know is that it is being planned for a 5E FG conversion, and maybe a Pathfinder one (maybe).

[Fionavar]

Okay - thanks again.

[Talyn]

Yes, Rappan Athuk is being made. @GunbunnyFuFu was the DLC Developer chosen for this project, but it's a massive undertaking so it's coming along slowly. The current plan is to do the 5E one first, then use that as the basis for the Pathfinder version. Couple things slowing it down: real life, first. Job, family, finishing his degree, etc. Then RA itself is a massive project. A big part of that massive project is eleventy bazillion NPCs; building those slow us all down.

[Blahness98]

Yes, as a person creating his own RA module, it is a beast and a half to make. I think I am about 170ish pages (was making the Demon's Gullet before I got side tracked) in and that is just with spare time between running other games and setting up for a Starfinder game. Just be patient and it might come otherwise, get cracking.

Oh and how did your players like Tsar? I have attempted a pair of groups into that desolate place and both groups died because they didn't have enough motivation to stay out there (that and the characters died.. a lot..).

[Trenloe]

How much data you enter to be able to run a game is pretty much a personal thing. At minimum you need maps and NPC stats. This will be made easier with the recent RA kickstarter for digital maps. For Pathfinder, as I mentioned above, a lot of the creatures are in the Tome of Horrors book (also a FG product). And with the couple of different Pathfinder creature parsers you can get the other creatures into FG.

How much work you then do beyond this is up to you.
- If you're running using voice you don't need all of the descriptive text. Just have your book/PDF handy and read from that.
- You might want to prepare the encounters ahead of time - perhaps drag the encounter links to the relevant location on the map. But, encounters can also be put together on the fly.
- You might want to add in custom item records.
- You might want to put together NPC equipment parcels. Or, if you have the relevant equipment modules ready, you could create these on the fly as required.
- Prepare relevant graphics tokens, or just use the auto applied letter ones, or do quick token searches through your token modules when needed.

Yes, we all know it's nice to have the whole product in FG. But if you want to run something, and you don't have the complete FG module, it can still be done without a stupid amount of work. As long as you're a little familiar with FG and have the data available in modules or the campaign data (maps, handouts, NPCs, items, etc.). You don't need to have everything at your fingertips and available for immediate use during the game. It's perfectly fine having a couple of minutes pause here and there where you put a random encounter together or an item parcel or something else. Take it easy, don't panic, put the stuff together you require and continue the game. Get the players to talk among themselves, whatever works for your group.

[Fionavar]

Yes, as a person creating his own RA module, it is a beast and a half to make. I think I am about 170ish pages (was making the Demon's Gullet before I got side tracked) in and that is just with spare time between running other games and setting up for a Starfinder game. Just be patient and it might come otherwise, get cracking.

Oh and how did your players like Tsar? I have attempted a pair of groups into that desolate place and both groups died because they didn't have enough motivation to stay out there (that and the characters died.. a lot..).

We loved Tsar - used some of the mythic pieces and turned into an epic style adventure. RA totally continues that tale of ours in ways that we hopefully ensure the opt-in in using this new environment

[Fionavar]

How much data you enter to be able to run a game is pretty much a personal thing. At minimum you need maps and NPC stats. This will be made easier with the recent RA kickstarter for digital maps. For Pathfinder, as I mentioned above, a lot of the creatures are in the Tome of Horrors book (also a FG product). And with the couple of different Pathfinder creature parsers you can get the other creatures into FG.

How much work you then do beyond this is up to you.
- If you're running using voice you don't need all of the descriptive text. Just have your book/PDF handy and read from that.
- You might want to prepare the encounters ahead of time - perhaps drag the encounter links to the relevant location on the map. But, encounters can also be put together on the fly.
- You might want to add in custom item records.
- You might want to put together NPC equipment parcels. Or, if you have the relevant equipment modules ready, you could create these on the fly as required.
- Prepare relevant graphics tokens, or just use the auto applied letter ones, or do quick token searches through your token modules when needed.

Yes, we all know it's nice to have the whole product in FG. But if you want to run something, and you don't have the complete FG module, it can still be done without a stupid amount of work. As long as you're a little familiar with FG and have the data available in modules or the campaign data (maps, handouts, NPCs, items, etc.). You don't need to have everything at your fingertips and available for immediate use during the game. It's perfectly fine having a couple of minutes pause here and there where you put a random encounter together or an item parcel or something else. Take it easy, don't panic, put the stuff together you require and continue the game. Get the players to talk among themselves, whatever works for your group.

Thanks Trenloe - what I am trying to figure out is which mods I need to add. We are thinking of using core, advanced races/players and mythic. As such, I am not sure which mods to use. It is more clear in Hero Lab for community add-ons. I will be using HL to build characters and then port to FG. It seems to me that using RA, I will still have to do the mechanics on my end and not rely on FG for that: does that make sense?

[Trenloe]

I will be using HL to build characters and then port to FG. It seems to me that using RA, I will still have to do the mechanics on my end and not rely on FG for that: does that make sense?
Will you be using Hero Lab for PCs or NPCs?

What mechanics are you referring to? FG doesn't do every single thing possible in terms of automation (it would simply be impossible), but it can do quite a lot.

[Fionavar]

I will be using HL to build PCs for the players. Mechanics I mean battles and such

[damned]

I will be using HL to build PCs for the players. Mechanics I mean battles and such

Yes you will have to prep them...

But its so very easy...

Check out a video or instructions on creating an encounter...

[Trenloe]

I will be using HL to build PCs for the players. Mechanics I mean battles and such
PC's will need some work - depending on the exact level of automation you need, and also how particular each player with in how they will run their PC.

Encounters (NPC lists and pre-placed tokens) can be built beforehand - as damned mentions.

Mechanics in encounters primarily rely on data being setup correctly, and on effects. The level of automation that you go to depends entirely on your group and your goals. You'll never get to the level of a computer game (thank goodness), so you will always need to know the rules of the RPG system you're playing. But FG will make things easier for you - like applying DR, Resistances, SR, critical damage, damage types, modifier stacking (if you setup the effects correctly), etc., etc..

A STRONG recommendation: Don't try to get everything setup and coded before your first game. This will be a huge task for someone getting used to FG. It is a common mistake for new GMs and players to try to automate virtually everything from the first session. Don't try this! Get used to FG first - so you slowly get to know the application, what it can do and, importantly, what you want to do with FG in your games. Start with the PCs setup - the usual information, HP, AC, Attacks, Spells, skills, etc. so that they can be rolled from the PC sheet and also can be targeted by enemies. Use NPCs from the OGL modules, or from FGG products or import them using the NPC parser. Don't try to add too many effects to start off with - if you have to roll and manually work things out ("Oh, I forgot the 20% miss chance for concealment" for example) then that's fine - play your game, get used to the interface and the group requirements and then learn how to add in the stuff you want/need. Don't try to do it all from the start - you, and probably your players, will get frustrated if you try this!

[Fionavar]

Thanks Trenloe - my plan was to first use it old school simply like a battle map and then - as you encourage - as I get used to it do some of the implementation. Make sense?

[Trenloe]

Thanks Trenloe - my plan was to first use it old school simply like a battle map and then - as you encourage - as I get used to it do some of the implementation. Make sense?
Absolutely.

You may want to look at basic PC and NPC sheets to start with too - you'll have more interaction and get basic dice rolls from the sheets. Apply all the modifiers etc. manually (old school), but get an idea of using sheets too. Otherwise your players won't have much to do, and they'll spend all their time spinning dice and tokens, and drawing on the map! ;)

[Fionavar]

In your experience - how effective is the HL import?

[Trenloe]

In your experience - how effective is the HL import?
It will get the basics in - attributes, saves, skills, weapons, equipment. There have been issues with some spells for some classes. It gets you most of the way. You could do a basic HL import for your first session - to get players using the character sheet.

I still use it for bringing PF characters into FG.

One gotcha - once imported into FG you need to do everything within FG - level up, etc.. As there is no export from FG back to HL. You can use HL as a guide for leveling, but you'll then have to apply the changes manually to the PC in FG, or do a new import as a new character (probably more hassle than it's worth as you'll lose current PC data stored in FG).

[Myrdin Potter]

I did one level of RA in 5e (Mouth of Doom from the 5e Kickstarter). I am pretty experienced at it and it took me a few hours. I had all the text, created new descriptive text where it did not exist, and the NPC’s ready in those few hours. The parcels and specific items took me another few hours but then everything was loaded and ready.

The new map pack is really needed as the older maps really are not good for VTT.

[Trenloe]

I did one level of RA in 5e (Mouth of Doom from the 5e Kickstarter). I am pretty experienced at it and it took me a few hours. I had all the text, created new descriptive text where it did not exist, and the NPC’s ready in those few hours. The parcels and specific items took me another few hours but then everything was loaded and ready.
It was well done. Probably more prep than most GMs would go to when running over voice, but very well done. :)

[Trenloe]

Once a GM has some familiarity with FG, and the tools they use to import maps/images and NPCs, you can quickly prep for a session. I reckon it takes me less than 1 hour to prep for a 5 hour Pathfinder session on FG. As I mentioned above, you don't *need* all of the descriptive text. Is it nice to have? Sure, but you don't need it! :o

[Fionavar]

It will get the basics in - attributes, saves, skills, weapons, equipment. There have been issues with some spells for some classes. It gets you most of the way. You could do a basic HL import for your first session - to get players using the character sheet.

I still use it for bringing PF characters into FG.

One gotcha - once imported into FG you need to do everything within FG - level up, etc.. As there is no export from FG back to HL. You can use HL as a guide for leveling, but you'll then have to apply the changes manually to the PC in FG, or do a new import as a new character (probably more hassle than it's worth as you'll lose current PC data stored in FG).

thanks - so that is where the mods come in then, as I assume if we are using other OGL not in the core, that would need to be added?

[Trenloe]

thanks - so that is where the mods come in then, as I assume if we are using other OGL not in the core, that would need to be added?
Not necessarily - you can always enter data manually.

But, if you want drag/drop of spells or items, look at the various modules in the community modules thread.

[Fionavar]

Not necessarily - you can always enter data manually.

But, if you want drag/drop of spells or items, look at the various modules in the community modules thread.

Thanks - I have downloaded everything I could find :) I am spoiled with the HL Community pack being all blended together.

[Myrdin Potter]

I really do echo what Trenloe said - start off light and don't try and put everything in. I did, but I like to drop the boxed text (read aloud) into chat. I took short-cuts, for example, there is a rumors table with 65+ different ones and I did not create a table with all of them, I just rolled dice and made chat boxes with the results to share. I created all the traps as NPC and made items for everything in the treasure description but that is overkill for the average session.

It does make the experience a little better for the players if you do more work in advance, but it is not that big a difference.

If you are really new to FG, I suggest buying a module and running it to see what can be done and going from there as a base.

[Fionavar]

I really do echo what Trenloe said - start off light and don't try and put everything in. I did, but I like to drop the boxed text (read aloud) into chat. I took short-cuts, for example, there is a rumors table with 65+ different ones and I did not create a table with all of them, I just rolled dice and made chat boxes with the results to share. I created all the traps as NPC and made items for everything in the treasure description but that is overkill for the average session.

It does make the experience a little better for the players if you do more work in advance, but it is not that big a difference.

If you are really new to FG, I suggest buying a module and running it to see what can be done and going from there as a base.


Thanks Myrdin Potter - should be finishing Tsar in May and then am going to play with FG and then hopefully start RA in September.

[Ken L]

RA is more of a classical dungeon delve along the lines of tomb of horrors but far larger. Tsar is more of a structured campaign with a similar level of deadliness. Starting at level 7 or so gives the players a better footing as opposed to RA's level 1. Though there are many entrances to start at for parties of varying levels, but if you take them, you shorten the dungeon as it effectively short-cut large sections of the module.

Regarding RA on FG, I'm not sure there is a PF version in the works given the focus on 5e, and if there is, it won't be released any time soon. I have about 1/3 of the module prepped in terms of maps, encounters, and story entries, given that there's an official version coming out it's not shareable due to CC.

[Fionavar]

I have heard from FGG for PFRPG that they did hand data over to FG in October - FG has informed me that it implementing it is in the beginning stages.