5e Prestidigitation: murder and hiding the evidence!

[sorvan76]

One of my players wanted to use prestidigitation to catch blood being spilled (our thief was committing a murder) before it hits the ground and then use it to hide the evidence. Should this be allowed, and is it something the spell could reasonably do? :)

[Bidmaron]

Usually it is helpful to say the ruleset when you ask a game-specific question like this, as the answer can vary even for those having the same spell name.

[sorvan76]

Usually it is helpful to say the ruleset when you ask a game-specific question like this, as the answer can vary even for those having the same spell name.

Sorry, 5e. :)

[Bidmaron]

I apologize, as you had put it in the title of the thread. I would offer thoughts, but I don't own any of the 5e materials with which to see what the book says. I could probably load the SRD with the free stuff, but I feel unqualified to pass judgement on a 5e issue. There are plenty here who very much are though, and I'm shocked they haven't already answered.

[sorvan76]

I apologize, as you had put it in the title of the thread. I would offer thoughts, but I don't own any of the 5e materials with which to see what the book says. I could probably load the SRD with the free stuff, but I feel unqualified to pass judgement on a 5e issue. There are plenty here who very much are though, and I'm shocked they haven't already answered.

No need to apologise, I changed the thread title after your suggestion - so thanks. :)

[Bidmaron]

Man, I had no idea you could change the thread title after the fact, and you can see how long I've been around.

[sorvan76]

Man, I had no idea you could change the thread title after the fact, and you can see how long I've been around.

Usually on vBulletin forums, the thread poster can change the title by double clicking on the thread title. A bit of forum prestidigitation lol. :D

[Zacchaeus]

To answer your original question, one of the things you can do with the spell is clean an area or object, so the player could do that. You can't 'catch' anything since you don't create anything that could be used to catch stuff; unless you ruled that the player could create a trinket that could be used to catch something with. And even if they did that disappears after a turn.

In the end it's up to you.

One other point; I can't see how catching and hiding the blood would be concealing any evidence. After all CSI Vegas won't be around to come do their thing and the blood won't connect the rogue to the crime anyway (unless an examination of the rogue revealed blood on him that could then be traced back to the victim using DNA analysis). If he left his personalised dagger with his name etched into it in the wound; that's a different matter but blood alone isn't going to get him caught. So you could easily allow this but just ignore it as a means of determining if the rogue gets caught or not.

[sorvan76]

To answer your original question, one of the things you can do with the spell is clean an area or object, so the player could do that. You can't 'catch' anything since you don't create anything that could be used to catch stuff; unless you ruled that the player could create a trinket that could be used to catch something with. And even if they did that disappears after a turn.

In the end it's up to you.

One other point; I can't see how catching and hiding the blood would be concealing any evidence. After all CSI Vegas won't be around to come do their thing and the blood won't connect the rogue to the crime anyway (unless an examination of the rogue revealed blood on him that could then be traced back to the victim using DNA analysis). If he left his personalised dagger with his name etched into it in the wound; that's a different matter but blood alone isn't going to get him caught. So you could easily allow this but just ignore it as a means of determining if the rogue gets caught or not.

There was a need for swift action. Conveniently, a large cupboard was available to hastily hide a body in - but people were coming up the stairs and intended entering the room. The PCs knew it to be so. Blood spurts on the wall/floor would hint at foul play.

In this case, I let them away with it - but insisted our mage concentrate and not engage in any conversation lol. Which was almost as big a give-away as blood everywhere!

[LordEntrails]

Well, don't forget; Not only does the party have magic to help them, but any "investigator" may also have magic to help them. Depending upon the setting etc...

I mean, just because their is no physical evidence, in a world with divine magic, doesn't mean that scrying and divination couldn't reveal the truth.

So, if the victim has family that is powerful enough, then their is always a way. Though their is always magic to counter magic, to counter the magic that countered your magic that countered their magic that... *G*

[Nickademus]

Not really how it should have went, but if the players were happy and the story was good, then you did it right. Remember, story trumps rules.
https://memecrunch.com/meme/HO8M/story-trumps-rules/image.png?w=463&c=1

[sorvan76]

Oh my, I can see I've got some explaining to do! :D

It wasn't the FBI coming up the stairs, nor was it a pack of diviners. It was a bunch of normal peeps, who were scheduled to meet with the dead dude at the same time the party was. The party made sure they arrived before everybody else did. They murdered him (he killed our rouge's sister - and actually a bunch of others, but only I as the DM know this at this point) and hastily set about trying to hide the body and make it look like nothing is afoot. The wee man (a halfling) downstairs who signs people in to the building was drugged by our bard (Cha 16 human female). When yer man was found asleep on the job, this instantly caused suspicion with the folks climbing the stairs.

Oh yes, the party had some explaining to do!

[sorvan76]

Not really how it should have went, but if the players were happy and the story was good, then you did it right. Remember, story trumps rules.
https://memecrunch.com/meme/HO8M/story-trumps-rules/image.png?w=463&c=1

This! :D

But would still like to know if that cantrip could mask the immediate signs of a murder! (in other people's opinions) :)

[LordEntrails]

It can clean things up. So no blood on the floor. As long as killing him didn't break anything, I don't see why their would be any signs of struggle or death. Well, unless you want their to be, after all, their could be a smell as the bowels might empty.

[sorvan76]

It can clean things up. So no blood on the floor. As long as killing him didn't break anything, I don't see why their would be any signs of struggle or death. Well, unless you want their to be, after all, their could be a smell as the bowels might empty.

I reckon if anybody's bowels were open after that encounter, it was the party's lol.

In any case, after all the necessary deception and persuasion checks were passed, the party walked away. I was fully expecting a blood-bath, as I'd set the DC to talk their way out of it at 15.

They bullsh*tted well enough to walk out the door, but I had the local guard pursue them for questions.

Now, can a prestidigitation casting hide the evidence of a kill for 1 hour? Say, for example, nobody looks in the cupboard.

[LordEntrails]

IMO, until someone looks in the cupboard, or the body starts to swell/decompose (24 hours?), or divination was used; I think prestidigitation would be fine.

[sorvan76]

IMO, until someone looks in the cupboard, or the body starts to swell/decompose (24 hours?), or divination was used; I think prestidigitation would be fine.

I'm inclined to agree with you. It makes the spell quite powerful though, for a cantrip.

[Nickademus]

I believe the cleaning effect is permanent, not 1 hour. Though it becomes a timing problem. Each casting takes 6 seconds and only cleans up to 1 cubic foot. So it would depend on where all blood was splattered and the literal number of seconds before the people came into view (or hearing since presto has a verbal component). Not really as powerful.