Rollable Table or Non-rollable Story Table?

[Jay_NOLA]

Got a question on what is the best way to do some tables from a module and game rule book reference tables.
I'm not sure if I ought to set theses up as a controllable in FG or just make a Story text with just a table in it (non-roll able) or do both.

1.) The game has critical hit and fumble charts. These are just a d100 roll on a table the results that can be gotten are about short paragraph each in description. So if making a reference module to just reproduce the info on the reference charts in the game ids it better to just do it as a regular table or as a story entry with a table. Is it better to set it up in both formats?

2.) One module has a d10 rumors chart. The results for each roll are several paragraphs each, and this takes up several pages in the module Best to do this just as a Story entry with a text table or as a roll-able table? Plus, the module also says that the GM can assign or chose an appropriate on e to give to the player?

3.) One table has multiple columns when you roll you get a a modifier which is in one column and a big block of text that is in the next column. The text various in length from a sentence or two to a long paragraph depending on the table entry. The table is several pages long in the book. So is this best done as a roll-able table or just a text one in as story entry one given that you need to display data from multiple columns on each roll And if it is best to do it as a roll able one who do you set up the multiple columns to display properly

[Bidmaron]

What ruleset are you using? The only reason it matters is because #1 is probably going to be hard to do anything more useful than rolling on a table and text-spitting out the results (either to chat or a story window). If the results of the crit/fumble are anything that can affect damage that you might want automated, it is almost certainly going to require an extension with current functionality of either the Tables feature or the Story Template feature.

So, as it seems you are aware, you have two options: Tables or Story Template. For straight rolling on a table and spitting out the results, I prefer tables because you can get it to go to the chat window for output and it does not (have to) spawn a new window (although it can if you set the output to anything except chat). However, tables currently has one fatal flaw: If you have nested rolls there is no predicting the order that the rolls come back in, which can cause the wrong roll to register. This is because the current implementation of the Table feature simply gangs all the rolls together and dispatches them to the dice management feature set. Since the dice roll using real physics, there is no telling which roll will complete first.

#1: Go with tables. If the text is long enough that you don't want the output going to chat, set the output drop-down to 'Story'. The advantage of a table is that it will look fairly close to the source format and still be able to actually roll the result. The other advantage is that you can use the /rollon slash command to roll on the table without even opening the table window if you prefer. In fact, you can hot key the command if you want.

An alternative: If you want to include any instructions before or after the table, use a story template. I'd put the table into the story template in-line, but I'd also make a rollable table, and then you could have the store template actually do the roll off the rollable table (there is a video showing you how to do this and a good tutorial on the wiki for it, as well).

#2: I am inclined to say table again, but if you want to make the output more contextual based upon adding additional sub-tables, you can do so using the story template.

#3: I'd use a table again. You have more control over the column appearance if you use story templates in the current tables implementation, but if you do that you won't be able to roll on that kind of a textual table. Follow the tutorial video to set up your table using the tables feature for multi-columns. It is really easy. In fact, with your experience, I'll bet you could open one up and figure it out without watching any videos.

[LordEntrails]

I think rollable tables for all of them. The ones with long paragraphs as the results can have a story entry for the results can't they? A lot like magic item tables have a link to the magic item.

As for text tables, I don't see a need for any unless you are talking inside the reference manual.

[damned]

I dont know if this is relevant to your situation but if you are using a niche game system MoreCore supports using /rollon Rolls on the character sheets... :)

[Myrdin Potter]

For story entries that are long and have formatting, I suggest that you make story entries for each result and then put the link to the story entry in a rollable table.

And if need some form off damage or effect applied, the story entry can have an encounter link in it with an NPC to apply the damage or effect.

[Bidmaron]

Myrdin how do you use an NPC to add an effect?

[Myrdin Potter]

You give the NPC and ability and use it via the combat tracker - encounter goes to tracker and then you can use saving throw is stunned or just is stunned as the NPC set-up. Like hazards and traps.

[Bidmaron]

Thanks

[Jay_NOLA]

I was doing this for Maelstorm and ran into the same problem in the past with other games in trying to decide if I ought to set up a table or not.

For the critical, serious wounds tables I just need those spit out in chat and for reference, as one or two results tells you to look at another entry on the table for a rule. One or two results refers you to consult e. If they indicate a separate roll setting up the table to do that works for most stuff. I did have

One the problems is that one story bit of text from the adventure I was prepping would require about 20 additional tables. As you get a result like "players find cart" roll to determine this about cart which then gives if it is abandoned or not and can require even more rolls. Plus a GM can chose stuff instead of rolling so pulling up lots of sub tables can get slow especially when it isn't big tables. (10 big encounters with lots of separate sub roll that can occur in them.) I thing just having the text in the story and having the table to set up also might work better as I can look at everything easy and quick if I want to chose stuff and having an option to just do everything random.

Also if you have an encounter that says like players encounter 1d6+1 guards do you just want to set up one encounter with the maximum number gotten. And just remove any not needed from the Combat Tracker or do you nee to set up a table and encounters for each specific amount that can be gotten.

I'll play around with the Story Template and see if that resolves everything.

[Myrdin Potter]

The tables functionality includes generating random and populated encounters, so you should be able to do that if you have the right NPC created.

The issue is if the encounter is just one small sub-option and the main table branches into several others.

[Jay_NOLA]

The encounter is just one small sub-option and the main table has lots of branches with sub branches depending on the roll given. The table is a street encounter one.

I tried doing the table as a story template and it didn't work well and just went with a table with out put set to story and sub tables I also am having a problem with just a normal table and the various sub tables displaying correctly.

Example: Players come across a a cart which is the result generated on the main table. description call for a roll on a sub table and depending on the result and in some cases another sub table. Some of the results aren't showing up. like it will roll show one sub text skip another and then show another, despite everything being set up correctly from what I can tell.

[Bidmaron]

If you can post the text of your table we might can help but I suspect it is The asynchronous roll problem manifesting. I am working a fix for that but it will be a little before testing is complete.

[Myrdin Potter]

That is the issue I have, no control over which result is actually returned first. Story templates are the only solution of things need to be in a specific order.

You can always have tables reporting results that tell you to roll on other tables or use specific results.

[Bidmaron]

Myrdin I am working hard to fix that. Did you have to abandon your mother of all tables project because of that?

[Myrdin Potter]

Nope. I am working in the two large table books in the background. I have all the tables created for MTT and they all work fine. I just need to create over 1000 items for that one. The other one if did chapter 1 and am slowly doing manual work-around for it rolling off into other subtables. I pretty much need to create a master roll for what path it will go down and then a proper table for each other thereafter.

What I have found is that treating some products like they would be as a book is better. As long as you record each roll result, people like to see what table they go to and roll again. The problem is when you try and take a 5 minute process of reading and rolling and make it a 5 microsecond button click just because it is a computer and you can.

[Bidmaron]

Wil these ultimately be for sale? What game system are they compatible with?

[Myrdin Potter]

I hate to discuss future products, but, assuming they get approved, will be for 5e and Pathfinder.

The adventure design one is actually pretty system neutral. The treasure table needs to be specific because items are unique to rulesets.

[Bidmaron]

Cool, Myrdin.

[Jay_NOLA]

@Bidmaron- It is a big section from the Sward and the Stone module for Maelstorm RPG in the Pembroke Burning part of the module the Encounters on the Streets part. I can't post the text as its from a copyrighted module.

@Myrdin Potter - Story Templates doesn't work at all for this section of the module and several rolls are not being displayed at all. Example: Table 1 is rolled and result is displayed, which calls for a roll on Table 2 which result calls for a roll on Table 3. Tables 1 & 3 results are shown but 2nd isn't. If the roll on Table 2 didn't call for any sub tables it does show though. Same thing happens if it is requiring other sub-tables.

[Zacchaeus]

Example: Table 1 is rolled and result is displayed, which calls for a roll on Table 2 which result calls for a roll on Table 3. Tables 1 & 3 results are shown but 2nd isn't. If the roll on Table 2 didn't call for any sub tables it does show though. Same thing happens if it is requiring other sub-tables.
That is correct since there is no result to output for table 2 since all you are doing is calling for a result from another table.

[Jay_NOLA]

Actually there is a text ou put for each table roll, even if a sub one is called up.

The street encounter is a 1d10 roll on a result of 7 you get this:

The characters pass [Street Encounter 7A]

The 7A table is a sub 1d10 table that is called up.
On a result of 1 on the 7 A table you get:

a broken down cart [Street Encounter 7B]

The 7B table is another 1d10 table:

On a result of 1-6 the 7B result:

is abandoned.

The text isn't being displayed properly and tables are being skipped in output:



This is what is displayed when I get an output with those resaults

The characters pass
abandoned

Instead of:
The characters pass
a broken down cart
is abandoned


The 7A, etc. tables are how Id designated the sub rolls as the table and sub rolls are just a huge block of text in the module.

[Zacchaeus]

Ok, I see what you mean now. I'm not sure if that is expected behaviour or not - since if you output to chat the second table string is output. I'll try and find out if this is correct or if there is an error. I suspect that there probably isn't a quick or easy fix if it is wrong.

[Bidmaron]

You are getting The asynchronous rolls problem. When you do multiple sub rolls theee is no controlling which comes back first. I am working to fix that problem in an extension

[Jay_NOLA]

Does the asynchronous roll problem also cause when you have a random roll inside a block of text to not show right too? I'm guessing it does and will this be something fixed.

Example that I just made up a critical hit table you get a result like on a say a 7 on a 1d20 roll you want this text to show:

The attack destroys the [side table] eye of the target and the target takes -5 penalty on actions due to losing the eye on a.

and the side table is just a 1d6: 1-3 right 4-6 left result. To determine left or right for a couple of the results on the table.

The rest of the text after the random left/right get dropped. Had that happen in the past.

Looking forward to the extension. I guess the best thing is to just have the block of text for tables with the asynchronous roll problem.

[Bidmaron]

The asynchronous roll problem is not really responsible but the table feature doesn’t always do well with mixed text and table results. Generally subtable rolls will come after all text.
I am working to fix all these problems.