Severe Window lag and map lag

[fallofenosis]

Ok, let me start this post off by saying that I have read extensively on this issue and it seems to be something that has plagued FG for a few years now. Most of the posts I have seen with people have framerate issue/laggy dice etc. have been on computers with specs that are overqualified for FG. I even read of some gaming PC's that have lag issues. Is there a definite way to solve this?

I am using ultimate, 5e ruleset. I only have the module active that I am using and the monster manual. This laptop is less than a month old and has no other applications on it. It's running windows 10 home, 8 gigs of ram and yes it unfortunately has an integrated Intel video chip in it. The odd thing is that on my work laptop which is five years old, has half the ram, and also an integrated chip it works smooth as silk. This current computer can run Overwatch (Trademark Blizzard lol) at low specs at 60 fps (I installed it just for testing purposes).

So why does it seems my computer is overqualified to run FG but I can't move windows around or zoom maps around? Yes, the dice roll laggy, but honestly I don't even care about that as my games are done live, and I roll real dice. I would just like everything else to run smoothly.

I have seen many posts on this, but each thread just seems to die with no answer as to how it was resolved?

Thanks for any insight you gents have, it would be appreciated! :D

PS: I have done all of the "normal" recommendations: Make sure compatibility mode is off, enhanced update logging, etc.

[JohnD]

Do you have dx 9 on this machine? Stab in the dark.

[fallofenosis]

I have DX12 installed by default. Does FG require an older version of DX? Will DX12 not work?

[Trenloe]

This will more than likely be a 3D graphics driver issue. Go into your graphics card advanced setup and you'll have to experiment with settings. The first thing to try is turn off anti aliasing. Then look at fine tuning other settings. Fantasy Grounds uses DirectX v9 for it's graphics engine, and some 3D features can clash with this on certain graphics cards. So, it will be a case of you experimenting with settings so see which works for you.

[Trenloe]

Belated welcome to the forums fallofenosis


I have DX12 installed by default. Does FG require an older version of DX? Will DX12 not work?
You wouldn't be able to even start FG if the DirectX engine couldn't be started. You're OK with what you've got, it's just a case of fine tuning your specific graphics card advanced 3D settings.

[fallofenosis]

Turning of anti-aliasing was one of the first things I did. I've experimented with many options. Including running it at lower resolutions, running it in compatibility mode, running at lower color settings. Nothing in the video card settings seems to work. I just don't understand why I can run much more graphically demanding things on here (albeit a poor video card) and not FG. Thanks for the replies guys, I'd love to nail this down! :)

[Trenloe]

I just don't understand why I can run much more graphically demanding things on here (albeit a poor video card) and not FG.
Like I said above "Fantasy Grounds uses DirectX v9 for it's graphics engine, and some 3D features can clash with this on certain graphics cards." More graphically demanding applications won't be using DirectX v9 - they'll be using more recent versions.

[fallofenosis]

Like I said above "Fantasy Grounds uses DirectX v9 for it's graphics engine, and some 3D features can clash with this on certain graphics cards." More graphically demanding applications won't be using DirectX v9 - they'll be using more recent versions.

Hmm, would it be worth a shot to downgrade to DX9? I game on a much beefier desktop PC, and I bought this laptop just for DM'ing with FG. I'm fine with fudging with things if I have to.

[Trenloe]

FG is already using DirectX 9.

Try downgrading your graphics card drivers. See if you can find some old ones that will work better with DirectX 9.

[LordEntrails]

... Thanks for the replies guys, I'd love to nail this down! :)
If you are patient enough to see this through and nail this down, many of us will be very grateful. We posts like your often enough and I know it pains me not to be able to give a decisive answer.

As mentioned (and you tried) the only two things that have been reported in specific cases to fix this is either anti-aliasing or an-isotropic filtering.

[fallofenosis]

If you are patient enough to see this through and nail this down, many of us will be very grateful. We posts like your often enough and I know it pains me not to be able to give a decisive answer.

As mentioned (and you tried) the only two things that have been reported in specific cases to fix this is either anti-aliasing or an-isotropic filtering.

Yeah, I've seen many posts like this just through my research. My DM for my group uses a 6+ year old computer. Half my ram, worse processor, and an integrated chip. His runs like butter. Has Smiteworks looked into this? They have to know this is an issue? Would be handy if the built in some better controls into the settings. There's no options to adjust anything which is kinda a bummer.

For the benefit of future DM's, I'll try and see what I can and report back with details.

[Trenloe]

The next major version of Fantasy Grounds will be much more up to date in terms of the graphics libraries it uses, so should be more compatible with recent graphics cards etc. as it will use the Unity engine. It is not something that can be fixed in the current version through "better controls [in] the settings." It would require a complete rebuild of the graphics engine, which is what is happening for the new version and won't be done in the current version.

[fallofenosis]

The next major version of Fantasy Grounds will be much more up to date in terms of the graphics libraries it uses, so should be more compatible with recent graphics cards etc. as it will use the Unity engine. It is not something that can be fixed in the current version through "better controls [in] the settings." It would require a complete rebuild of the graphics engine, which is what is happening for the new version and won't be done in the current version.

Hey man, that alone is GREAT news. It's completely understandable that they aren't tweaking so many things with the current version if they're working on a newer, more stable version. That means that there's light at the end of the tunnel! Has SW offered an ETA for this new version? (Still looking into my current setup and will report back any findings here)

[Trenloe]

Has SW offered an ETA for this new version?
Nope. It's a way off yet.

[Moon Wizard]

No ETA yet. We still have a fair bit of work to do, since it's a complete re-architecting of the product to provide better graphic and network support, while maintaining full backward compatibility. we don't want to put any dates out there until we're more sure of the timing.

Regards,
JPG

[Moon Wizard]

Do you happen to be running any programs that provide overlays, such as Steam, FRAPS or something like that? Can you try turning them off?

Regards,
JPG

[fallofenosis]

Well I dumbed down the Antialiasing as well as as few other things. This severely "fuzzed" all of the lines in the application (as it should when antialiasing is lowered) and the funny thing is that the dice rolls got slightly better (but not good), and the choppy window movements and map zooming stayed the same. Man if I could just get those fixed... I don't use the in game dice as my games are live.

[fallofenosis]

Do you happen to be running any programs that provide overlays, such as Steam, FRAPS or something like that? Can you try turning them off?

Regards,
JPG

Steam is installed (but I did not purchase FG through it) and is always off. It doesn't start up on boot up. No fraps. In fact there are no applications whatsoever on this PC, outside of the preinstalled ones from Windows. It's brand new, and I have only installed FG and excel on it.

[Moon Wizard]

Hmm, can you verify that your 3D graphics card is being used, and not your on-board graphics card? If you have a dedicated graphics card installed, try disabling the on-board graphics card in your BIOS settings.

Regards,
JPG

[fallofenosis]

Hmm, can you verify that your 3D graphics card is being used, and not your on-board graphics card? If you have a dedicated graphics card installed, try disabling the on-board graphics card in your BIOS settings.

Regards,
JPG

I only have the integrated graphics. There is not an external card by NVidia/ATI. Unless I'm missing something. My experience with NVidia tells me I should have a "catalyst center" or something of the sort. Nothing like that here.

[damned]

Can you post a couple of screen grabs of the Graphics Control Panel options you do have?

[LordEntrails]

I mentioned this in another thread, so you may have already considered this. I had problems with a driver for a USB Display dock (i.e. a port replicator for my laptop to connect to external displays and other USB devices etc) using DisplayLink software. It didn't affect FG, but did cause graphic crashes with other applications. Rolling it back to a previous version solved my problems, so maybe, just maybe there is something else interfering.

Wish I could give you better suggestions.

[Moon Wizard]

Also, what kind of graphics chip are you using?

Most integrated graphics cards do not perform well with Fantasy Grounds, since they either don't support any 3D in hardware, or possibly don't support DirectX 9 3D in hardware.

Regards,
JPG

[fallofenosis]

Can you post a couple of screen grabs of the Graphics Control Panel options you do have?

Yeah, sure can. Thanks for the help again. https://imgur.com/a/37XJU


I mentioned this in another thread, so you may have already considered this. I had problems with a driver for a USB Display dock (i.e. a port replicator for my laptop to connect to external displays and other USB devices etc) using DisplayLink software. It didn't affect FG, but did cause graphic crashes with other applications. Rolling it back to a previous version solved my problems, so maybe, just maybe there is something else interfering.

Wish I could give you better suggestions.

I did roll back the latest driver update for the GPU but it didn't help.


Also, what kind of graphics chip are you using?

Most integrated graphics cards do not perform well with Fantasy Grounds, since they either don't support any 3D in hardware, or possibly don't support DirectX 9 3D in hardware.

Regards,
JPG

See above link. It is integrated, but I'm safely assuming it has 3D acceleration (of some kind), due to the fact that I've ran/tested more demanding software on this since I've started this troubleshooting.

[fallofenosis]

Can you post a couple of screen grabs of the Graphics Control Panel options you do have?

Sorry Damned misread your post, here are the pathetic available options I have lol. Thanks again you guys.

https://imgur.com/a/37XJU

[damned]

fallofenosis - yeah my Intel Graphics card software doesnt give me many more options. If you would like me to connect up and have a look with you send em your email via PM and I can do some testing with you.

[fallofenosis]

fallofenosis - yeah my Intel Graphics card software doesnt give me many more options. If you would like me to connect up and have a look with you send em your email via PM and I can do some testing with you.

Sure mate, I'd appreciate it! Will do.

[fallofenosis]

Damned was very kind to take a look at my computer but sadly we came up empty handed. But three cheers for Damned helping a complete stranger. Thanks mate!

But it got me to thinking.... And I found an interesting turn of events....

When I run my games, these are done at home, with my family. And my FG is setup and extended to another monitor via HDMI. But I don't drag the entire application across both screens. I open another FG instance, logon to the server and take over my sons character as everyone is in the room right there, and people just tell me where they want to move. This way I can easily control the combat tracker and maps and whatnot without everyone accidentally seeing something I don't want them to.

Well I checked tonight after I left damned and hooked everything up like I would for a session. I have the GM's session open on my laptop, and a players session open on the other monitor. So two FG instances total. Well, the player instance runs WAYYYYYYYYYY better than the GM's instance. Moving windows is much more manageable. Resizing etc. Dice roll better. Not perfect, but if it ran this way on my DM's instance I'd be pleased as punch.

Doesn't this kinda rule out PC performance and settings possibly? The computer can run two full instances of FG, just one runs better than the other.

What could be bogging down the DM's instance but not a players? Super strange....

I did read somewhere that having too many modules/token packs open can bog a session down. But I only have about two open. But what about maps? Damned did say some of my maps where a little on the big side. Does fantasy grounds load these on startup and keep them in persistent memory? Or do these only open and load when opened? If the latter is the case then that shouldn't be an issue as I only always have one map open at a time.

Hmmm did these give anyone any ideas?

PS: Going to bed now, but I will check the thread while I'm at work, but I obviously won't be troubleshooting till I get home. Thanks again everyone!

[Moon Wizard]

Mostly tokens (including module tokens) are loaded immediately, so large numbers of tokens could be a culprit. Also, opening multiple large images, or using images larger than 2048x2048, can sometimes impact depending on the drivers.

The easiest way to check is to rename your tokens sub folder under the FG data folder to something else, and start a new campaign in FG. In that way, you have no images, tokens or modules in memory yet.

Regards,
JPG

The easiest way

[damned]

Yeah we loaded a brand new campaign and also the 5e sample campaign.
Zero additional tokens (not even a tokens folder either in the mail data folder or campaign folder) and the only purchased module was the MM.
There are some large images that exceed recommended sizes but the lag was just the same in the fresh campaign with no images loaded.
RAM usage under 300mb.

There were few gfx options available to the driver but we did add Fantasy Grounds to the application list and create a new profile with various settings.

[Nylanfs]

I thought the ETA was set (https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/RealSoonNow)?

[Nylanfs]

Also I'm sorry to for anyone that clicks on that link. :bandit:

[Trenloe]

Try downgrading your graphics card drivers. See if you can find some old ones that will work better with DirectX 9.
Don't just roll back your graphics card driver, go to Intel's site and see if there are older drivers available.

[fallofenosis]

Ok, I can do that no probs when I get home from work. Any thoughts on why it would run well on the players side but not the DM? If it runs well at all that tells me that the graphics settings should be ok?

[NotRussellCrowe]

Damned was very kind to take a look at my computer but sadly we came up empty handed. But three cheers for Damned helping a complete stranger. Thanks mate!

But it got me to thinking.... And I found an interesting turn of events....

When I run my games, these are done at home, with my family. And my FG is setup and extended to another monitor via HDMI. But I don't drag the entire application across both screens. I open another FG instance, logon to the server and take over my sons character as everyone is in the room right there, and people just tell me where they want to move. This way I can easily control the combat tracker and maps and whatnot without everyone accidentally seeing something I don't want them to.

Well I checked tonight after I left damned and hooked everything up like I would for a session. I have the GM's session open on my laptop, and a players session open on the other monitor. So two FG instances total. Well, the player instance runs WAYYYYYYYYYY better than the GM's instance. Moving windows is much more manageable. Resizing etc. Dice roll better. Not perfect, but if it ran this way on my DM's instance I'd be pleased as punch.

Doesn't this kinda rule out PC performance and settings possibly? The computer can run two full instances of FG, just one runs better than the other.

What could be bogging down the DM's instance but not a players? Super strange....

I did read somewhere that having too many modules/token packs open can bog a session down. But I only have about two open. But what about maps? Damned did say some of my maps where a little on the big side. Does fantasy grounds load these on startup and keep them in persistent memory? Or do these only open and load when opened? If the latter is the case then that shouldn't be an issue as I only always have one map open at a time.

Hmmm did these give anyone any ideas?

PS: Going to bed now, but I will check the thread while I'm at work, but I obviously won't be troubleshooting till I get home. Thanks again everyone!

Hi, Fallfenosis.

This sounds like perhaps your second monitor is running out of a different video card. Did your computer come with integrated video plus some sort of mobile graphics card? Perhaps by default the second monitor is running on the better graphics processor but your main is running on the Intel chip?

Try swapping the GM and Player instances to alternate monitors and see what happens. If the GM instance running on the second HDMI monitor runs fine then I'd say this is very possible...

[Teufelhunde87]

Make sure map sizes are small. I had a large one I loaded a few months ago, and it effected my server big time. I played the same game the next night after downsizing the map , and the lag was gone. also watch how many modules you share, and tokens .

[fallofenosis]

Hi, Fallfenosis.

This sounds like perhaps your second monitor is running out of a different video card. Did your computer come with integrated video plus some sort of mobile graphics card? Perhaps by default the second monitor is running on the better graphics processor but your main is running on the Intel chip?

Try swapping the GM and Player instances to alternate monitors and see what happens. If the GM instance running on the second HDMI monitor runs fine then I'd say this is very possible...

I believe I tried this last night but verify. I know for sure that there is only the integrated chip however. Nothing else.


Make sure map sizes are small. I had a large one I loaded a few months ago, and it effected my server big time. I played the same game the next night after downsizing the map , and the lag was gone. also watch how many modules you share, and tokens .

Stuff lags when no maps are open. Even when I have just the story window open. It jumps everywhere. I'm don't share anything. Nor do I roll dice. My games are live.

[fallofenosis]

Interesting update for those of you still watching this thread. Once I got home I hooked up fantasy grounds again, but this time removed ALL my images from the images folder except a ~250 kb JPG map. Some of the other ones I had were 2-7 Mb. Note to self: PNG's are not a good file format. WAY too big. I need to save all my maps as JPEG's going forward. Drawing and using the mask etc on a smaller map was WAY smoother. Almost perfect.

However, this did not alleviate the window or dice lag. Window lag is still very prevalent. Lag in general still plagues me.

Now, I'm just gonna come out and say it. I have to admit, I'm a little bummed that I shelled out roughly 120 bucks for software that is really buggy (ultimate license, monster manual etc.) According to the developers website I far surpass requirements for this. We all know this isn't some crazy resource heavy video game. I know that my intel on board GPU isn't ideal, but these are VERY common chipsets out today. This software should work on this GPU. Plain and simple. But for some reason it doesn't work on my new PC but will work on my DM's five year old PC with worse hardware than mine. This shouldn't be so guys.

On the upside I LOVE FG. I know it may seem like I'm complaining, but this thread has been some of the best service I've ever had. I will continue using FG (lag and all) and I will always recommend it for D&D. These are mainly my feelings, I just feel like I've spent a ton of money on something that doesn't work properly and it should.

It's like having a Ferrari. That is in the shop. It's SOOOOOO cool, but it just doesn't work right. Ya know?

/rant

Thanks for the help guys. I'll continue looking into if I can smooth things out and will report to this thread if I see anything else. Other than that, Smiteworks, please move fast (but smartly) on the new FG. I look forward to using it. Or if it's a long ways out, maybe try and fix this lag? I know this is not just happening with me.

Cheers guys, thanks for all the help, and happy adventuring!

[Beldak]

Are you still noticing that FG running on HDMI is a lot smoother than the PC's screen?

[NotRussellCrowe]

Out of curiosity have you tried running Fantasy Grounds with only one monitor hooked up to your computer?

[fallofenosis]

Are you still noticing that FG running on HDMI is a lot smoother than the PC's screen?

It doesn't run better, it runs SLIGHTLY smoother on a characters instance. The DM's is laggier. Doesn't matter which screen it's on. Neither runs smooth.


Out of curiosity have you tried running Fantasy Grounds with only one monitor hooked up to your computer?

Yes. Damned was nice enough to look over my computer last night. We were single monitor then. I'm more single monitor than not as I always build encounters, test maps etc before bed, and it's always super laggy. Extended monitor or not.

[Trenloe]

A few things to try:
1) Check in the settings window (accessible from the main FG start page) and see if "Cross-platform compatibility for Linux and Mac" is set. If it is, uncheck it; if it isn't, check it. Then see if that makes a difference.
2) Run DirectX diagnostics. select the Start "windows" button, then in the search box next to Start, type dxdiag.exe. Choose dxdiag.exe from the list of results and run it. When the application comes up, click the "Save All Information..." button, save the dxdiag.txt file and post that in this thread.
3) Make a note of the current version of your graphics driver and then Uninstall it (and "Delete the driver software for this device" so it doesn't just use them again). Info here, use "Uninstalling the Intel Graphics Driver via the Device Manager Method": https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/graphics-drivers/000005598.html When you reboot make sure it is using an older version (check the version number). If this doesn't make difference then try uninstalling again and delete the drivers) so that it will hopefully step back to an older version. Keep testing/uninstalling until the driver version doesn't change. But, see if you can uninstall back to the Microsoft Basic Display Adapter - to see if that runs OK.

[Trenloe]

And, what is the exact make and model of your laptop?

[damned]

Hi fallofenosis - FG runs well on most systems but not all systems. It uses an older game engine that does not have all the bells and whistles of newer game engines. This is not something they can change in a hurry (eg its a multi-year project that is well under way). Smiteworks are not going to be able to fix this for you. Your GFX and other Specs are powerful enough but the GFX are not interacting efficiently with the game engine. Installing Alternate (usually older) Drivers or Control Panel software is the next course of action to try. If you unable to resolve and find it unworkable you may have to send an email to support@ and discuss the issue and see if a refund can be arranged.

Ninja'd by Trenloe... again!

[fallofenosis]

A few things to try:
1) Check in the settings window (accessible from the main FG start page) and see if "Cross-platform compatibility for Linux and Mac" is set. If it is, uncheck it; if it isn't, check it. Then see if that makes a difference.
2) Run DirectX diagnostics. select the Start "windows" button, then in the search box next to Start, type dxdiag.exe. Choose dxdiag.exe from the list of results and run it. When the application comes up, click the "Save All Information..." button, save the dxdiag.txt file and post that in this thread.
3) Make a note of the current version of your graphics driver and then Uninstall it (and "Delete the driver software for this device" so it doesn't just use them again). Info here, use "Uninstalling the Intel Graphics Driver via the Device Manager Method": https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/graphics-drivers/000005598.html When you reboot make sure it is using an older version (check the version number). If this doesn't make difference then try uninstalling again and delete the drivers) so that it will hopefully step back to an older version. Keep testing/uninstalling until the driver version doesn't change. But, see if you can uninstall back to the Microsoft Basic Display Adapter - to see if that runs OK.

1. Way ahead of you. Read this tip before I posted yesterday and it's been done. Not checked. So I checked it and reloaded. Same results. Very laggy.:)
2. I have ran this from reading other threads as well, but I'm happy to post the results for you fine, helpful gentlemen. I've ran it and uploaded the text file to my google drive. https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BxmH6h0QE69pak5BVERLaEhzc3c Please let me know if it doesn't work for you, but the link should be good.
3. I will try this and report back.


And, what is the exact make and model of your laptop?

This is the model I'm using: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MRS3MIS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 Keep in mind i upgraded the RAM from 4G to 8G after I got it. Because, well, you never have too much RAM. ;)


Hi fallofenosis - FG runs well on most systems but not all systems. It uses an older game engine that does not have all the bells and whistles of newer game engines. This is not something they can change in a hurry (eg its a multi-year project that is well under way). Smiteworks are not going to be able to fix this for you. Your GFX and other Specs are powerful enough but the GFX are not interacting efficiently with the game engine. Installing Alternate (usually older) Drivers or Control Panel software is the next course of action to try. If you unable to resolve and find it unworkable you may have to send an email to support@ and discuss the issue and see if a refund can be arranged.

I get this mate, and I am wholeheartedly thankful for all of you trying to help me. I want you guys to know that I LOVE FG. It's so powerful! And handy for DM'ing! I am just bummed ya know? I know that they've been working on a new version for quite sometime, but if i'm not mistaken hasn't that been ~3-4 years? I've seen full games and their sequels come and go in that time man. Destiny is just an example off the top of my head. Just seems off. I don't need a refund man. I like the software, I've spent my money, and by God, I'll get my money's worth. Whether it be know or a year from now. I'll see this through. I may be a slightly disgruntled customer. But an optimistic one. :D

Ninja'd by Trenloe... again!

[fallofenosis]

Hi fallofenosis - FG runs well on most systems but not all systems. It uses an older game engine that does not have all the bells and whistles of newer game engines. This is not something they can change in a hurry (eg its a multi-year project that is well under way). Smiteworks are not going to be able to fix this for you. Your GFX and other Specs are powerful enough but the GFX are not interacting efficiently with the game engine. Installing Alternate (usually older) Drivers or Control Panel software is the next course of action to try. If you unable to resolve and find it unworkable you may have to send an email to support@ and discuss the issue and see if a refund can be arranged.

Ninja'd by Trenloe... again!

Apparenly this didn't get quoted. But I don't need a refund. I'm just bummed ya know? And I know that SW has been working on a new version, but hasn't that been ~3-4 years? I don't know the size of their staff, but I've seen full games and their sequels come and go in that time. I'm gonna stick with it mate. I've spent my money and daggumit, I'll get my moneys worth. I may be a slightly disgruntled purchaser, but a hopeful one at that. Stoked to see where they go with the new version! Me? I'll just studder and lag my way through games until then. ;) All will be well in the end. I'm a patient man.

[fallofenosis]

3) Make a note of the current version of your graphics driver and then Uninstall it (and "Delete the driver software for this device" so it doesn't just use them again). Info here, use "Uninstalling the Intel Graphics Driver via the Device Manager Method": https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/graphics-drivers/000005598.html When you reboot make sure it is using an older version (check the version number). If this doesn't make difference then try uninstalling again and delete the drivers) so that it will hopefully step back to an older version. Keep testing/uninstalling until the driver version doesn't change. But, see if you can uninstall back to the Microsoft Basic Display Adapter - to see if that runs OK.

Only took one uninstall to get to the "basic" driver. FG wouldn't even load. Sat there for over ten minutes. Rebooted and tried again to no avail. Plus the whole laptop has gotten very unstable with that uninstall. I'll be updating the drivers back up to current. Was an awesome thought though! Thanks!

[damned]

Ooooohhh.. you have a N3710 CPU. These are not fast CPUs. They dont have very good graphic processing capabilities.
https://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Pentium+N3710+%40+1.60GHz

My laptop is/was a decent computer but is a solid four years old and my CPU benchmarks at around 7,000 compared to your 1,900.
You mention your older computer ran fine - can you post a dxdiag output from that computer?

Your new computer does meet the minimum specs but the CPU is right at the minimum end of the specs and it may well be this component that is slowing your experience down.

[damned]

Apparenly this didn't get quoted. But I don't need a refund. I'm just bummed ya know? And I know that SW has been working on a new version, but hasn't that been ~3-4 years? I don't know the size of their staff, but I've seen full games and their sequels come and go in that time. I'm gonna stick with it mate. I've spent my money and daggumit, I'll get my moneys worth. I may be a slightly disgruntled purchaser, but a hopeful one at that. Stoked to see where they go with the new version! Me? I'll just studder and lag my way through games until then. ;) All will be well in the end. I'm a patient man.

it is only a small company - like 4.5man size and they are continuing to develop the current system, the current rulestes, new DLC and the new engine so yeah - progress is slower than we (users) and they (owners) have hoped but from all accounts it is progressing.
Im glad you want to stick with it because it really is a good platform.

[fallofenosis]

Ooooohhh.. you have a N3710 CPU. These are not fast CPUs. They dont have very good graphic processing capabilities.
https://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Pentium+N3710+%40+1.60GHz

My laptop is/was a decent computer but is a solid four years old and my CPU benchmarks at around 7,000 compared to your 1,900.
You mention your older computer ran fine - can you post a dxdiag output from that computer?

Your new computer does meet the minimum specs but the CPU is right at the minimum end of the specs and it may well be this component that is slowing your experience down.

Hmmmmmm bollocks.

Well. That "older" computer was a work laptop, which has just been replaced with a newer Lenovo Yoga. If all else fails, I'll try and get it installed on my work laptop, but that laptop is locked down tighter than fort knox so it might be hard.

Well rats.

[Trenloe]

Looking at that graphics driver version it doesn't tie in with the ones on the Intel website for your processor (the GPU is embedded in the processor). The one you're running is the one from the laptop manufacturer (HP), but I think it's worth trying the ones from Intel.

Try installing this graphics driver: https://downloadcenter.intel.com/download/25313/Intel-Graphics-Driver-for-Windows-10-and-Windows-7-8-1-15-33-?product=91830 This is the oldest from the Intel website list. Try it first.

If that doesn't change anything, try Intel's latest: https://downloadcenter.intel.com/download/26682/Graphics-Intel-Graphics-Driver-for-Windows-15-40-?product=91830

If still no good. People have reported improvements by installing this DirectX package: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=8109 Run the downloaded file, it will ask you where you want to extract the files to. Once extracted, go to the directory where the files were extracted to and run DXSETUP.exe

[Trenloe]

Ooooohhh.. you have a N3710 CPU. These are not fast CPUs. They dont have very good graphic processing capabilities.
https://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Pentium+N3710+%40+1.60GHz
Yeah, I was reading up on the embedded GPU: https://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-HD-Graphics-405-Braswell-Benchmarks-and-Specs.169241.0.html

[fallofenosis]

Yeah, I was reading up on the embedded GPU: https://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-HD-Graphics-405-Braswell-Benchmarks-and-Specs.169241.0.html

Ok, I really do understand that it's an utter POO GPU. The reason I purchased this PC was for the fact that I didn't think that FG would require a lot? And also remember that I've stress tested this PC with other graphical/3D heavy games such as Overwatch. It didn't play pretty, but was playable. And I'm sure a game like this demands more of a PC than FG does.

Maybe I'm just not savvy enough to know that goes into making software, but I'm sorry it just doesn't make sense. :(

EDIT: Tried the DX9 version you offered was no help man. I tried and installed it. but it didn't work out. Still laggy.

[Trenloe]

Try what I've suggested in post #51 above.

[fallofenosis]

Try what I've suggested in post #51 above.

See my edit, post 53.

[Trenloe]

That edit suggests you just tried DirectX. Have you tried the Intel graphics drivers I linked? Try the older once first.

And remember to reboot after every uninstall/reinstall of drivers - even if it doesn't force a reboot.

[damned]

Fingers crossed...

[Trenloe]

And, if running on the Intel drivers doesn't make any improvements, I think we're down to trying to keep your laptop running efficiently as possible.

Things reported about the N3710 CPU and other general things to try to help run smoother:

1) If cooling is not good, it can run very slowly (reducing the CPU speed to keep cool). Make sure you're running on a table (not on your lap) and also raise the back of the laptop off the table to give good ventilation.
2) Run on power, not on battery when using FG. when on battery the CPU speed is usually stepped back to save power.
3) Check Windows task manager to see what applications are taking up CPU. Close those that show regular activity.
4) Avoid having other applications running, even in the background.
5) Try to avoid plugging in additional monitors - this uses more GPU power/memory and so slows things down.

[damned]

I wonder also if the CPU doesnt adjust appropriately for Fantasy Grounds and may be using a 1.1GHz clock speed instead of 2.5Ghz...

[fallofenosis]

That edit suggests you just tried DirectX. Have you tried the Intel graphics drivers I linked? Try the older once first.

And remember to reboot after every uninstall/reinstall of drivers - even if it doesn't force a reboot.

Yes I have tried this. It only took one uninstall to get to the basic driver and still no good. In fact the PC ran so poorly that I had to immediately install the old (but newest) drivers.

[Trenloe]

Yes I have tried this. It only took one uninstall to get to the basic driver and still no good. In fact the PC ran so poorly that I had to immediately install the old (but newest) drivers.
I think you've missed what I've subsequently suggested. The old drivers that you mention are the most recent drivers from the HP website, right? In post #51 I link two different graphics card drivers - provided by Intel (the chip manufacturer), not HP and not DirectX drivers. One is an older one and one is the most recent. These are newer than the HP ones.

Please try installing this one first: https://downloadcenter.intel.com/download/25313/Intel-Graphics-Driver-for-Windows-10-and-Windows-7-8-1-15-33-?product=91830

If that is no good, try this one (the most recent): https://downloadcenter.intel.com/download/26682/Graphics-Intel-Graphics-Driver-for-Windows-15-40-?product=91830

[Nylanfs]

Hmmmmmm bollocks.

Well. That "older" computer was a work laptop, which has just been replaced with a newer Lenovo Yoga. If all else fails, I'll try and get it installed on my work laptop, but that laptop is locked down tighter than fort knox so it might be hard.

Well rats.

Solution: Get your IT dept in your FG game and they will fix your laptop to run FG. :)

[fallofenosis]

I think you've missed what I've subsequently suggested. The old drivers that you mention are the most recent drivers from the HP website, right? In post #51 I link two different graphics card drivers - provided by Intel (the chip manufacturer), not HP and not DirectX drivers. One is an older one and one is the most recent. These are newer than the HP ones.

Please try installing this one first: https://downloadcenter.intel.com/download/25313/Intel-Graphics-Driver-for-Windows-10-and-Windows-7-8-1-15-33-?product=91830

If that is no good, try this one (the most recent): https://downloadcenter.intel.com/download/26682/Graphics-Intel-Graphics-Driver-for-Windows-15-40-?product=91830

My utmost of apologies Trenloe, you have directed me TWICE to try those drivers. I completely missed/misread those. My bad. I will definitely try those when I get home from work.

Side note: I'm installing FG on my work lappy. The Lenovo Thinkpad. It has roughly the same specs, and an integrated Intel GPU as well, but a slightly better CPU. We'll see how it goes.

[fallofenosis]

Side note: I'm installing FG on my work lappy. The Lenovo Thinkpad. It has roughly the same specs, and an integrated Intel GPU as well, but a slightly better CPU. We'll see how it goes.

Looks like everything runs great on my work lappy. Super smooth. in fact perfect. The only issue are the oversized maps that I need to cut down, but then I'm sure they will work fine. Even at their size the are WAY faster than on my personal laptop. So things are looking good!

[Beldak]

Try to snag the Windows 10 Creators Update that came out today (google how to manually install if it's not offered on Windows Update). It has a "Game Mode" that you can use on FG with the Win-G hotkey and go to settings. Curious how that works on your home laptop.

[fallofenosis]

Try to snag the Windows 10 Creators Update that came out today (google how to manually install if it's not offered on Windows Update). It has a "Game Mode" that you can use on FG with the Win-G hotkey and go to settings. Curious how that works on your home laptop.

Thanks for this, I saw the update today. Installing now. We'll see how it goes.