ATK Targeted Effect in the Chat Window

[Minty23185Fresh]

I have found a discrepancy in how information related to effects is reported in the chat window. I don't know if this behavior is intended, and if so, why it is intended. This discrepancy might be considered a bug.

First, no extensions are loaded.

Setup: the player character, Krystryd will make three attack rolls against three Goblins. She has +5 to her attacks due to strength and proficiency plus a couple of attack effects. A +2 targeted ATK effect and a non-targeted ("generic") +1 ATK effect. Goblin 3 has cover and so has a +2 effect against attacks. All of this is shown in the provided screenshot.

The screenshot below depicts the GM's Chat Window and Combat Tracker. In the Chat, all three of Krystryd's attacks are shown. Each attack can be divided into a "roll" portion followed by and a "results" portion. I'll refer to both as I explain the issue. (I've added little red dots to highlight the salient points.)

16706

Note that the untargeted ATK +1 effect is applied in the "roll" portion of each attack, modifying Krystryd's attack bonus of +5 to +6 in each attack.

In the first roll the total outcome, 24, is shown in both the roll portion and the results portion.

In the second roll the targeted ATK +2 effect is applicable. Note that the +2 is reported in the results portion instead of the roll portion. Why is this? It is an ATK effect just like the other one, only targeted. Seems like it has always been this way so I guess I can live with it, though the inconsistency seems unnecessary.

Given the aforementioned behavior, also note that the +2 ATK effect results in "Attack [19]" in the results portion. This seems proper since it did modify the adjusted dice roll of 17 by plus 2 equals 19.

Now for the real issue (bug?): In the last attack, Goblin 3's +2 cover effect is now relevant. Note that the +2 is reported in the results portion. This seems completely appropriate, since it doesn't have anything to do with Krystryd's actual roll of the dice. It is an effect applied by the defender of the attack. However note that Krystryd's adjusted roll of 24 as shown in the roll portion is not reduced by 2 in the results portion. The result is reported as "Attack [24]" instead of what seems appropriate, "Attack [22]". [B]This seems just plain wrong, to me.[B]

[Gwydion]

I have found a discrepancy in how information related to effects is reported in the chat window. I don't know if this behavior is intended, and if so, why it is intended. This discrepancy might be considered a bug.

First, no extensions are loaded.

Setup: the player character, Krystryd will make three attack rolls against three Goblins. She has +5 to her attacks due to strength and proficiency plus a couple of attack effects. A +2 targeted ATK effect and a non-targeted ("generic") +1 ATK effect. Goblin 3 has cover and so has a +2 effect against attacks. All of this is shown in the provided screenshot.

The screenshot below depicts the GM's Chat Window and Combat Tracker. In the Chat, all three of Krystryd's attacks are shown. Each attack can be divided into a "roll" portion followed by and a "results" portion. I'll refer to both as I explain the issue. (I've added little red dots to highlight the salient points.)

16706

Note that the untargeted ATK +1 effect is applied in the "roll" portion of each attack, modifying Krystryd's attack bonus of +5 to +6 in each attack.

In the first roll the total outcome, 24, is shown in both the roll portion and the results portion.

In the second roll the targeted ATK +2 effect is applicable. Note that the +2 is reported in the results portion instead of the roll portion. Why is this? It is an ATK effect just like the other one, only targeted. Seems like it has always been this way so I guess I can live with it, though the inconsistency seems unnecessary.

Given the aforementioned behavior, also note that the +2 ATK effect results in "Attack [19]" in the results portion. This seems proper since it did modify the adjusted dice roll of 17 by plus 2 equals 19.

Now for the real issue (bug?): In the last attack, Goblin 3's +2 cover effect is now relevant. Note that the +2 is reported in the results portion. This seems completely appropriate, since it doesn't have anything to do with Krystryd's actual roll of the dice. It is an effect applied by the defender of the attack. However note that Krystryd's adjusted roll of 24 as shown in the roll portion is not reduced by 2 in the results portion. The result is reported as "Attack [24]" instead of what seems appropriate, "Attack [22]". [B]This seems just plain wrong, to me.[B]

I thought Cover was ATK -2 (which would reduce the roll of the attacker), but in your screenshot it appears it is showing as a defensive effect +2 so I suspect it is increasing the Goblin's AC by 2 instead of reducing the attack roll, but having the same effect. I'm sure others will chime in.

[Moon Wizard]

This is because rolls are treated independent of application of rolls to generate results. Initially, all rolls are considered in a target-less manner which is what is used to generate the initial roll. Any modifications to the roll due to attacker effects vs. specific defenders or defender effects are not calculable until the roll is "applied" to the defender. Thus, those effect modifiers are noted in the results output vs. the roll calculation.

Regards,
JPG

[Minty23185Fresh]

I thought Cover was ATK -2 (which would reduce the roll of the attacker), but in your screenshot it appears it is showing as a defensive effect +2 so I suspect it is increasing the Goblin's AC by 2 instead of reducing the attack roll, but having the same effect.

An additional level of obfuscation, right? But. I have checked the application of the cover effect and it does subtract rather than add it. Sometimes it would take a fair number of dice rolls for me to validate proper function but FG does behave properly.

[EDIT] I was flat-assed wrong here! I reexamined the Lua code this morning. The value 2 is added to the defensive side of the equation not subtracted from the offensive (attack) side.

[Minty23185Fresh]

... Initially, all rolls are considered in a target-less manner which is what is used to generate the initial roll. ...
I have seen this time and time again in the code: "if rTarget..." I thought this meant a complete non target, like a "null roll", like rolling the dice without ANYONE selected as a target, as if I just accidentally double clicked a die. I realize now that there is more to it than that. If I drag the die on to Goblin 1 the "attack" has a target. But if I drag the die on to Goblin 2, the "attack" has a target AND the "effect" has a target. The application and reporting of the data pertinent to each case being different. Interesting. Possibly confusing. Certainly thought provoking and worth further investigation on my part. Thanks Moon Wizard.

[El Condoro]

The result is reported as "Attack [24]" instead of what seems appropriate, "Attack [22]". [B]This seems just plain wrong, to me.[B]

The result is as the rules - cover gives +2 to the AC of the target, not subtract 2 from the attack roll. That's why one says EFFECT and the other DEFEFFECT, which is the effect on the defense of the target. The roll of 24 is going to be a hit whether the goblin has AC 12 or (effectively from cover) AC 14.

[Minty23185Fresh]

Thank you El Condoro. I understand what you're saying.

In the attack against Goblin 2, "Attack [19]" includes the additional ATK: 2 because it is an attack modifier.

In the attack against Goblin 3, "Attack [24]" does not include the 2 due to cover because it is a defensive value.

The value in "Attack [x]" is the final attack value not a scaled measure of the attack's effectiveness, so to speak.

[El Condoro]

That's how I understand it, yes.