Metrics on player activity?

[Black Hammer]

I'm thinking of running another game or two, and pretty open with the schedule, but not had much success finding a quorum to run with. I'm looking to run either Mutant: Year Zero or Vampire: the Masquerade, but finding players for anything not D&D/PF is hard, let alone a sideline new game or a dead old one.

So I was curious if there was any sort of datamined or survey info suggesting what times are most popular for the FG userbase. Usually I'm stuck trying to juggle European schedules with Western US ones just to get three players. I suppose I could look at the published Steam metrics and extrapolate from there, but that'd require at least a vague idea of how many more non-Steam users there are.

[damned]

Black Hammer this is just my opinion/experience and yours may not match... if you want to run something that has a smaller player base extend your recruiting to forums or communities devoted to that system. You might pick up another player or two there. Either way - if you get 2 or 3 players start the session and keep it going as long as you are all enjoying it. Post a fun session recap and action screenshot in your recruiting thread and in many cases the game will slowly recruit for you. Personally Im happy to run my games for 2 players. 2 players get lots more time in the sun and tend to cover more ground. Smaller systems might have one player a month coming thru the forums and if you are only looking for players for 1 month you will miss those players. Over time the game will attract new players...

[Black Hammer]

I regularly post on here, Steam, game specific forums, and a couple of Google groups. If Smiteworks isn't interested in cultivating players outside of generic fantasy, that answers my question too.

[damned]

I regularly post on here, Steam, game specific forums, and a couple of Google groups. If Smiteworks isn't interested in cultivating players outside of generic fantasy, that answers my question too.

You do. But you post 2 or 3 different games/genres and then 3 weeks later you post a different one. (this is not an actual measurement - it is my recollection only). Im not saying its the wrong way to do it but for me it works better if I set the date and the game and I start it. The players will come - but it takes time.

There are seriously something like 4000 rpgs out there. In any large enough number of game sessions nearly 70% will be 5e/4e/3.5e/PF. The next 10 systems have about 2% of the market each (and some of these are also D&D versions). That leaves about 10-15% of the games being played to all the other systems (and many of *those* are d&d clones, retro clones, d&d inspired). Most players are playing D&D or their favourite flavour of it.

I run Trail of Cthulhu, Call of Cthulhu, Dungeon World and Castles&Crusades as well as 5e. They have all gone ahead - some with only 2 players. I have played a few Savage Worlds games and the odd Pathfinder, Top Secret and ShadowRun. Thats about it for my online RPGs. Of the systems I run ToC, DW and C&C have pretty small player bases.

Edit: Please dont take anything Im writing as criticism - its my viewpoint only.

[leozelig]

I regularly post on here, Steam, game specific forums, and a couple of Google groups. If Smiteworks isn't interested in cultivating players outside of generic fantasy, that answers my question too.

That's a good strategy. I have a lot of trouble recruiting for DCC RPG games with a similar approach. If I succeed on my luck roll, I get 3-4 players.

My theory is that people are reluctant to use an app they can't open inside a web browser, like Roll 20 and Google Hangouts (works for DCC - mostly theater of the mind). I don't know if Smiteworks as a small company can do much to generate more interest among these niche systems, but I definitely understand where you're coming from.

[GunnarGreybeard]

I'm thinking of running another game or two, and pretty open with the schedule, but not had much success finding a quorum to run with. I'm looking to run either Mutant: Year Zero or Vampire: the Masquerade, but finding players for anything not D&D/PF is hard, let alone a sideline new game or a dead old one.
Sadly, I think this is happening with any system other than the current big few, especially D&D. D&D 5e seems to have all the momentum atm.

[LordEntrails]

The only metrics I've seen are not about the time of games, but rather the systems being played. Damned has pretty much outlined those for you (though you can find them on ENworld). My experience also shows that a large percentage of players are US based, though Australia and Europe also have significant numbers of players. In order to draw from the largest base, you will probably need to pick Friday night or Saturday UTC as you have to allow for +/- 12 hours for other players.

All that said, if you want to plan ahead, run a couple games at the upcoming FG Con. I know it's not until October, but every time I've run a game there I've had 1 or 2 of the players per game want to get in on my next regular campaign (which unfortunately I don't have time for another). Plus, players are often willing to play any system at FG Con and like to experience or try new ones. So, imo, it's a perfect time to recruit players for one of the less popular systems. Just make sure your announcement thread lets players know that they don't need to know the system.

[NotRussellCrowe]

All that said, if you want to plan ahead, run a couple games at the upcoming FG Con. I know it's not until October, but every time I've run a game there I've had 1 or 2 of the players per game want to get in on my next regular campaign (which unfortunately I don't have time for another). Plus, players are often willing to play any system at FG Con and like to experience or try new ones. So, imo, it's a perfect time to recruit players for one of the less popular systems. Just make sure your announcement thread lets players know that they don't need to know the system.

I think this is a great idea. I got a chance to try Dungeon World during the last FG Daze, it's not something I would seek out a campaign to join but I've always been interested in it and I liked the opportunity to try a different system for a few hours. Having said that I will be running a 5e game at FG Con but that's only because I don't really know any other system, but if there's a DCC or C&C, SW, or something else I haven't played I'm more likely to try it out when there's no commitment to a long-term campaign. I've never played Vampire: The Masquerade as I thought it was built for LARPing but if it's something you can play over Fantasy Grounds that's awesome, definitely a great idea to run a one-shot and show people what it's all about!

[Black Hammer]

You do. But you post 2 or 3 different games/genres and then 3 weeks later you post a different one...
I post a willingness to run a couple of different games because there is no other way to gauge interest in a system. You don't see threads of players looking for anything aside from 5E and PF. If people are coming to the forums looking for VtM or A!C, I wouldn't know, and the only way I can find out is to post a thread naming a couple of games and seeing if people are interested. If I don't get answers, I try again a month later with different ideas. I have had at least one fairly regular campaign going off since fall of last year, so my Achtung! Cthulhu, 50 Fathoms, and now Trail of Cthulhu threads have simply been trying to recruit players for an existing game, as opposed to my more broad and open attempts at starting new campaigns with new groups.

I'd like to avoid spamming the forums with "Hey, anyone want to play X Y or Z?," particularly if it annoys you or anyone else. I did pay around $200 for the Fantasy Grounds material I have, and I would like to get more use out of it. It isn't a question of getting my money's worth, so much as I've found a tool I enjoy using. So the alternative is to recruit smarter rather than harder. Is the issue the systems I run? Then I should post for different games (which I do, and which appears to bother you). Is the issue the times and days I offer to run? This is why I'm curious about the user activity periods. Is the issue me being a crappy GM? Maybe; my convention games are usually filled out to the alternates, but perhaps my games online are less enjoyable.

As for criticism, I posted asking for a specific metric that I'm almost entirely certain Smiteworks has. Whether they want to share it is their business, since how many server calls for alias or update info they get and when might be a security issue, but I can't imagine it hurts to ask.

My problem with two player games is that I am not happy getting last minute cancellations and essentially wasting a block of time for both myself and my remaining player. If I had two reliable players, I'd be OK with that. If two regular users on here signed up for a game of mine, I'd be happy to run it. But when it's somebody's first post, at this point I pretty much assume they aren't going to show. I have an inbox full of messages saying "I'll be there Tuesday" from people who weren't, never message me again, and leave me and others hanging.

[LordEntrails]

... (which I do, and which appears to bother you). ....

I don't think damned's annoyed about your posts, or anyone else for that matter. From my experience, he's pretty hard to annoy. Not sure I've actually ever seen him get upset on the forums here. I think it's just that his experience is that it takes a long time to build a good pool of players for the less-popular games.

It's a bummer you've had such poor luck. I'd suggest again you make a big push at FG Con in October. Run a bunch of stuff, show people new systems. I myself mostly play 5E. It's not because its' my favorite system, it's because the system doesn't matter that much to me, so when I GM, I use a system I'm comfortable with. I suspect most players are the same.

Two FG Cons ago I played Savage Worlds, I never would have signed up for a SW outside a con. But I had a great time. I'd play the system again (if I had time to play more). I think you'll have similar luck recruiting players if you get active with FG Con and FGDaze as they come up.

[Full Bleed]

I regularly post on here, Steam, game specific forums, and a couple of Google groups. If Smiteworks isn't interested in cultivating players outside of generic fantasy, that answers my question too.
Try recruiting on reddit. You could start here: https://www.reddit.com/r/lfg

[JohnD]

Good link.

[Talyn]

Yes, and maybe if people use it the redditors will chill about "All Roll20 All the Time" like they usually are...
But I suspect Roll20 has an actual presence there and FG doesn't. The FG subreddit never gets any use.

[Black Hammer]

Try recruiting on reddit. You could start here: https://www.reddit.com/r/lfg

This is handy. Thanks.

[damned]

I definitely am not annoyed by your posting of games for different systems. I was just suggesting that you might pick one that you get 2 players for and try and build slowly from there. Absolutely flaky players are killers. When I have run for just 2 players I have made sure that they are coming. And if they are - I make sure I am too.
There are no easy answers to your question.
If I didnt believe in running the smaller systems I wouldnt have built the MoreCore extension which is very much designed to improve on CoreRPG. In addition soon after GenCon I will push a more powrful version out as a ruleset.
Here are some figures from Fantasy Grounds and from Roll20.
From a commercial point of view you can see why both companies value the 5e franchise.

https://www.enworld.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=76482&d=1461942896
https://67.media.tumblr.com/a93b7da3298f3a36c4d7ab317ba7718a/tumblr_inline_nwuh3qfvCV1t4momn_1280.png