Copyrighted Material?

[johntjamesonjr]

Ok. Hello fellow FG people. It has come to my attention through others that making modules for distribution is considered copyright infringement. Ok that I understand. What I'm confused on is if someone posts they are gm'ing a game say 'I'm doing a game of Rise of the Runelords, Burnt Offerings...looking for players.' Well first off, isn't that a form of copyright infringement? I mean they have the module... they have the materials, yet supposedly the tokens/graphics are copyrighted..OK. That I understand. But what about the maps? And the PFRPG bestiaries..are they not technically copyrighted material? i'm just trying to understand whats going on. I had hopefully thought of my paying my monthly sub and hopefully soon getting the lifetime license I would hopefully be able to do something with the 20 plus GB of pathfinder and D&D 4E materials I have as pdfs would be able to be of use making mods/campaigns. Again from a reliable source we do not have a license with the company that does Pathfinder. That's fine. But I still see the program accepts PFRPG materials. I would appreciate solid confirmation on exactly what we can and cannot post/share on this forum. That way since my subscription is not due until the 15th of Feburary I will be able to make an informed decision as to if I will be keeping my FG program up and running. Thank you and good evening to all.

John Jameson

[dulux-oz]

Hi John,

The situation with copyright is like this: if you own a copy of the copyright material you are allowed to make copies for your own personal use only. This would include (in our case) using them in a game being run by yourself. However, you are not allowed to distribute them to anyone else (even if they also own the original material) for any reason, paid or otherwise. So you couldn't give your GM something you'd converted from one of your books, even if you were going to be playing in the module (for eg). Now that's a strict interpretation, and a some other may be more "free", but technically that's the line that most owners of copyright take.

OK, so we can get around it by "lending" our created module to our GM, but if you were "caught" you'd have some explaining to do.

What you can't do, as I've said, is offer anything you've converted to anyone else, and SmiteWorks are really "strict" on this as they don't want to jeopardize any deals that have or are working on by having someone "play around" with copyright issues - and most of the community also don't want to risk this - so we all tend to be pretty conservative around this issue.

Does that answer your question?

[johntjamesonjr]

ok so basically unless im the one being the gm i cant do squat with it.. right?

[johntjamesonjr]

but if that is the case... then was was there several modules of the bestiaries 2-4 for PFRPG if that is the case? I had thought those were also copyrighted. unless I am wrong. And i have those in pdfs.. and nowhere does it say those are free domain. idk. I could be wrong.

[Mask_of_winter]

When you host a game, the GM's material is encrypted. The players can look at it but they can't copy it to their pc. So nothing is distributed.

Every pdf or hardcopy rpg book you have will have a copyright notice on it. It means you can't distribute it even if it was free. There are other licenses, like OGL and SRD, these you have to read.

If you want to become a community developer, I suggest you contact Smiteworks and offer your service. If the material you wish to develop is for a publisher Smiteworks already has an agreement with it should be fine. Otherwise, an agreement with the publisher will need to be ironed out. From what I understand, there are some PF material available but they are from a third party publisher (not Paizo).

[johntjamesonjr]

Mask I'll have to find the EXACT link for the files in question about the bestiaries but after looking at PFRPG Bestiary 2 It seems to go hand in hand with the actual Beastiary book that Pathfinder is selling. Like I said, I'm not trying to start any problems or anything, but i am extremely concerned as well as confused. Thank you.

[johntjamesonjr]

OK Mask, here is the thread for the files in question. like i said the bestiaries 2-4 in question are i nfact pretty much word for word with the actual book Pathfinder is selling on their website. I'm just extremely confused right now and would like some sort of clarification. ty. https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?16074-List-of-Modules

[dulux-oz]

The other thing to remember is that game-mechanics can't be copyrighted - but the descriptive text around the game-mechanics can. For example, a monster's stats and special abilities can't be copyrighted, but the text describing the monster (it looks, habitat, battle tactics, etc) is copyrighted.

[johntjamesonjr]

AHHHHHH.. ok here we go.... just pulled up the PFRPG bestiary 2 book for FG. seems there is a legal notice thing as well as Open Game License notice that needs to be placed on anything of this type. hmm well i guess thats different.. i guess that was never mentioned. not sure if that was my fault or it was just unknown. or if that would even make a difference or not. idk.

[Mask_of_winter]

These are OGL (Open Game License) and SRD (System Reference Document).

[johntjamesonjr]

hmm well dulux-oz... idk.. but lately ive been getting alot of confusing messages cant seem to get a straight message from doug.. dso i guess i'll have to make something... add in ALL the legal stuff that im supposed to and send it to Doug and have him look at it before i try to post to the forums.. if i have to go that route so be it. but like i said i noticed the PFRPG bestiary book 2 in one of the forums actually has a OGL and the legal stuff posted in it.. so im not entirely too sure if its ok or not but i do know that its word for word on the stats since i have the actual book in PDF from which i scanned it from my hardcopy before the book was accidently destroyed with 4 other boxes of pathfinder materials

[johntjamesonjr]

well signing off for now to try to either come up with something to send to doug for approval or to try to start my own pathfinder gaming as a game master.. good luck on that one lol. so if anyone needs to contact me... you can reach me on my skype through the link.. everyone have a good night

[Moon Wizard]

I believe the Bestiaries are all OGL, which would explain why they are listed as community modules.

Regards,
JPG

[johntjamesonjr]

ok no problem.. i just checked the rise of the runelords burnt offerings and they have the OGL in the back... so I guess other then the maps and the tokens and anything graphic i can make like the npcs and whatnot correct? or am i reading that wrong as well?

[johntjamesonjr]

great.. this sucks.. idk why but now i feel like im useless for pathfinder lol.. idk.. heheheh oh well..

[Trenloe]

Paizo material is released under the Open Gaming License - which means that some of their material can be re-distributed as long as the requirements of the OGL are followed. OGL statement here: https://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/openGameLicense.html and here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_Game_License

Read the main title page of your Pathfinder Bestiary 2 PDF - the "credits" page. Pay attention to the bottom three paragraphs - this identifies what is "product identity" as far as the OGL is concerned - this is "stuff" that is covered by copyright and you can't redistribute in any form:


Product Identity: The following items are hereby identified as Product Identity, as defined in the Open Game License version 1.0a, Section 1(e), and are not Open Content: All trademarks, registered trademarks, proper names (characters, deities, etc.), dialogue, plots, storylines, locations, characters, artwork, and trade dress. (Elements that have previously been designated as Open Game Content or are in the public domain are not included in this declaration.)

"Open content" is also defined, this is the "stuff" you can distribute, as long as you adhere to the OGL (include the OGL statement within the product and have section 15 of the OGL correctly defined):


Open Content: Except for material designated as Product Identity (see above), the game mechanics of this Paizo Publishing game product are Open Game Content, as defined in the Open Gaming License version 1.0a Section 1(d). No portion of this work other than the material designated as Open Game Content may be reproduced in any form without written permission.

Basically, the game mechanics of OGL released product can be re-distributed (as long as the OGL is included and section 15 correctly references the sources). What you can't redistribute is what is listed as Product Identity - the main things in product identity are all artwork, plots, storylines, etc. - basically non-mechanics text.

The Bestiary modules you reference are completely legal, because:

An OGL with correct section 15 references.
Only contains "open content".
Do not contain any "product identity".


As I mentioned in reply to the PMs you sent me, you cannot create and distribute a bestiary with any of the Paizo artwork within, nor can you use any other copyright protected artwork - this includes artwork from the Internet as 99.9% of that is covered by copyright.

Note - the OGL only applies to products that are released under the OGL. This includes most d20/D&D 3.0e/D&D 3.5e products and some upcoming 5E products, plus Pathfinder products - always check for an OGL statements in any product, don't ever assume that a product is released under the OGL.

The OGL does not cover BECMI D&D, AD&D (1st and 2nd edition) or D&D 4th edition.

[johntjamesonjr]

hmm ok Trenloe ty

[Trenloe]

If you want to publicly distribute any RPG material/products you must research and understand the various product licenses.

If you are using/making material purely for your own private games, and don't distribute anything outside of those games, then you don't need to worry about this - copyright does not cover your own private use of materials you have legally the right to use - i.e. you've bought the product or the product is released by the copyright holders for free (e.g. the D&D 5e basic rules) or the product is released under a community commons agreement/OGL license or similar.

[johntjamesonjr]

ok again ty.. moving on now :)

[damned]

The OGL and SRD are awesome. And they are there to be used. But you cant "partially" comply with the OGL. Partial compliance is non compliance.

Something that you could do is write your own adventures - you can use the monsters from these Bestiaries that contain only OGL/SRD content (so long as you include the appropriate references etc) and the Product Identity would be your own. You could then share these with other PF GMs.

[Nylanfs]

Also note that Paizo has two more licenses that work in tandem with the OGL, the Compatibility License (https://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/compatibility) which is directly for commercial entities, and the Community Use Policy (https://paizo.com/paizo/about/communityuse) which lets you largely use anything that Paizo publishes in your work as long as it's a) freely distributed and b) you are not a commercial entity.

PCGen uses the Community Use Policy which lets us use anything in the Approved Product list (https://paizo.com/paizo/about/communityuse/products).

[Trenloe]

... the Community Use Policy (https://paizo.com/paizo/about/communityuse) which lets you largely use anything that Paizo publishes in your work as long as it's a) freely distributed and b) you are not a commercial entity.
Be very careful with this statement as the community use policy does not allow you to "largely use anything that Paizo publishes" - you can't grab sections of descriptive text from Paizo products, you can only use approved artwork/map (which is a very small subset of the artwork/maps included in a Paizo product), you can't change/edit those approved images/maps, etc.. It's a nice community policy that lets you use proper names, location names, deity names, approved artwork, etc. in your own products, it does not allow sections of the product to be used cart blanche.

[Lensman]

Still helpful after all these years.... ;)