Published adventures - # of PCs?

[JohnD]

Is there anything that states how many characters the individual adventures are for? Probably have missed it.

I know the level ranges, but can't seem to find a specific "for x-y players". As I said, probably have missed it somewhere.

Thanks.

[Zacchaeus]

I believe 5e is 'balanced' for a party of 3-5 players. (p83 of the DMG)

[whiteTiki]

Zacchaeus is right, the adventures are designed for 3-5 players according to the DMG, but there are some additional facts you should know too:


Although 3-5 players is the number of players mentioned in the DMG, you can also have up to a 6 player party.
Although 3-5 players is the number of players mentioned in the DMG, you should also know that the ideal party size is 4 and that everything in the adventure is calculated for 4 party members, with this I mean:
All the adventure's Combat Calculations were made for a standard 4 size party
If you have a 3 size party or a 5 size party, they will advance (character level) slightly faster or slower respectively. Because you'll have to divide a specific amount of XP (previously calculated by the creators of the adventures) between 3 or 5 players instead of 4.
This is why its recommended by the adventure itself that in any case were you don't have a standard 4 size party, you should use the "Milestone Character Advancement Mode", which basically means, level up your characters after they have completed certain specific milestones (usually chapters)
An alternative to this, when you have a 3 or 4 players party size, is dividing the XP equally by 4 (instead of 3 or 5 respectively) and then assign that result to the players. This way, they will always have exactly the XP the Adventure intends for them at certain milestones.


Hope it helps.

[Zacchaeus]

And just as an FYI I'm running Hoard of the Dragon Queen with a six man party without changing anything; and it's working out fine. Some of the encounters I wouldn't like to run with just 4 (unless of course they were all Druids :))

[whiteTiki]

According to the adventure of HotDQ and the "Milestones" they are proposing when not using the regular "XP Award System", you'll soon find that after Chapter 5 things will change, as more and more XP will be required to level up.
That means that chapter 6 - Castle Naerytar, chapter 7 - Hunting Lodge and chapter 8 Castle in the Clouds are not going to be "in sync" with your characters XP. You can do the calculations beforehand and realize that even when they kill and destroy everything in their pass and complete all the quests available beginning from chapter 6, they will not reach the level they need according to the milestone rule. Specially in Chapter 7 and Chapter 8.

So this means that the XP out of proportion is always present, even from Chapter 1, but you don't notice it because the difference is too small I guess. I don't know what Chapter you're in, but if you're below 5, you should considere this for the future chapters.


Some of the encounters I wouldn't like to run with just 4 (unless of course they were all Druids )
I agree with this, there are some encounters for this adventure that are a little bit hardcore for the players intended level. Specially when having just 4 players in the party. In my case, we had 5 players and they still had some hard times in some of the encounters.

[JohnD]

Thanks.

I am looking at either 5, 6 or 7 and just wanted to know balancing issues.

[Griogre]

Personally I added monsters to all the various encounters for the 5 man parties I am running though HotDQ to bring the encounters designed for 4 PCs up to the same encounter difficulty with a 5 man party. I do have experience players so I'm not really that worried about killing them off. I personally felt the feel of HotDQ was high heroic - something hard to pull off in D&D sometimes. Truly, a lot of risk but a lot at stake for the PCs and for those who survive a real feeling that their PCs were/are heroes. The deaths are heroic too - for a good cause. This feel is really only something you can do, IMO, in an adventure path campaign. There have been a number of PC deaths but that just makes the players hate the protagonists more.

I've personally found 5 PC parties have much more synergies than a 4 man party. WhiteTiki is right though, you won't probably notice a difference between 4 and 5 man parties it until Episode 4 and it was slight and hard to notice. In Episode 5+ it really becomes noticeable.

[JohnD]

Any advice for PotA specifically? I would classify the group as experienced, cohesive and capable regardless of numbers.

[whiteTiki]

DM Advices for Princes of the Apocalypse here:

Ok, so this is a tricky one, this adventure is organized very differently from others I've used and its a bit more complicated. I can still give you some good tips and tricks to DM this:

You will divide the whole adventure into 4 parts:


CHAPTER 2 Initial Investigation and beginner Side Quests from Chapter 6

Here your characters should end up being Level 3. (Remember to use some of the Chapter 6 Side Quests available)


CHAPTER 3 The 4 Haunted Keeps corresponding to each one of the Elements (Cults)

Here your characters should begin Level 3 and should end up being Level 6.
TIP: Level them up to Level 4 after the first Haunted Keep, Level them up to Level 5 after the second Haunted Keep and finally level them up to Level 6 after the third Haunted Keep. Important to know they WONT Level up after the 4th Haunted Keep.
NOTE 1: Don't let them start the first Temple right after completing the 3rd Haunted Keep, Make them clear all 4 of them
NOTE 2 IMPORTANT: Feathergale Spire (Air) is designed for Level 3, Rivergard Keep (Water) is designed for Level 4, Sacred Stone (Earth) is designed for Level 5 and Scarlet Moon (Fire) is designed for Level 6.


CHAPTER 4 The 4 Temples beneath corresponding to each one of the Elements (Cults)

Here your characters should begin Level 6 and should end up being Level 10.
TIP: Let them decide were to go first, they should dictate the story. You should Level them up one level after each Temple
NOTE 1 IMPORTANT: Howling Hatred (Air) is designed for Level 6, Crushing Wave (Water) is designed for Level 7, Black Earth (Earth) is designed for Level 8, Eternal Flame (Fire) is designed for Level 9


CHAPTER 5 The Fane of the Eye and the 4 Nodes

Here your characters should begin Level 10 and should end up being Level 14-15.
TIP: You should Level them up after clearing the Fane, then Level them up after clearing their first Node and level them up again after clearing the third node. They should be Level 13 before clearing the last node and reach Level 14 after clearing the last node.
NOTE 1: If they did a bunch of side quests they might reach Level 15 after the last node and begin that node at Level 14 instead of 15. Depends on the Adventure Developments.
NOTE 2 IMPORTANT: Fane of the Eye is designed for Level 10 and must clear this out before any of the Nodes. Howling Caves (Air) are designed for Level 11, Plunging Torrents (Water) and Black Geode (Earth) are designed for Level 12. Weeping Colossus is designed for Level 13.



GENERAL NOTES: Just remember, the intended order for the Outposts (Haunted Keeps), Temples and Nodes is always: Air, Water, Earth and Fire. In that specific order.

Hope this helps you!

[whiteTiki]

I've personally found 5 PC parties have much more synergies than a 4 man party. WhiteTiki is right though, you won't probably notice a difference between 4 and 5 man parties it until Episode 4 and it was slight and hard to notice. In Episode 5+ it really becomes noticeable.

I agree with this too, 5 PCs parties have much more synergies, everything is more dynamic, the adventure develops in a more interesting way, it adds versatility to the party itself and it definitely doesn't compromise times (combat times, taking a lot for a player to take a turn again) during gameplay. Personally I think 5 size parties are the best size you can have as a DM and as a Player maybe too. In my opinion, if you can't have 5, the next best option is 6 (compromising some times). 4 and 3 PC sized parties leave much to be desired while 7 Pcs or more sized parties are way too much. This is just my opinion of course.

Cheers!