Best Party Size

[chrisiav]

I've hosted two sessions of a FG campaign so far. Still learning the ropes so I'm hoping things speed up once I become more proficient with the software. Still, it seems that a party over 4 players bogs down. At my last session, 6 players (all guys from my normal PnP game so we know each other) joined. There was a point where they needed to investigate some stolen wine crates. It involved 5 of the players questioning a neighboring merchant. The sixth player rolled a great perception and noticed a shady looking character hanging out and went over to talk to him. That meant I had two conversations going on at one time, one in whisper (which was a pain until I figured out that /r was a whisper shortcut). I should add that I'm trying to keep the chat all text. My PnP games involve a lot of raucous yapping and for my FG game, I just want the quiet.

In any event, my questions are these:
1) What size do you DMs limit your party to? Or do you have any limit? What # of players do you find optimum?
2) Am I just setting myself up for failure by restricting my chat to text or does anyone else find the mode viable?
3) Is there any mouse control (like a right click on the portrait) that can initiate whispers to make the chat faster? Or is it viable to create shortcut keys for a whisper? And if so, do you need a separate shortcut for each player?
4) In the same vein, can you open up a second chat window or tab os that chat can go in one place and die rolls and what not go in the other?
5) What tricks do other DMs use to control the flow of the chat window? For example, players love rolling die (I am guilty of it myself) But on FG, random rolls clog up the window. Does the novelty wear off? OR do you DMs have rules regarding rolls or just random OOC chatting?

Sorry for the long post but I am highly caffeinated at this point.

[Nylanfs]

Yea caffeine! Tell them to roll the dice off the chat window.

[kylania]

1) What size do you DMs limit your party to? Or do you have any limit? What # of players do you find optimum?

5 or 6 people usually, though starting out anything more than 4 with new players can get slow and confusing.

2) Am I just setting myself up for failure by restricting my chat to text or does anyone else find the mode viable?

I imagine so. Most people aren't comfortable with typing as their main form of communication and might be slower at it. Voice is definitely the way to go but text can be used to enhance it as well. Like using /emotes to add to what you're saying.

3) Is there any mouse control (like a right click on the portrait) that can initiate whispers to make the chat faster? Or is it viable to create shortcut keys for a whisper? And if so, do you need a separate shortcut for each player?

Type /w FirstLetterOfTheirName<press TAB> and it'll prefill the character name for you.

4) In the same vein, can you open up a second chat window or tab os that chat can go in one place and die rolls and what not go in the other?

Don't think so.

5) What tricks do other DMs use to control the flow of the chat window? For example, players love rolling die (I am guilty of it myself) But on FG, random rolls clog up the window. Does the novelty wear off? OR do you DMs have rules regarding rolls or just random OOC chatting?

As Paul said, they can roll the dice all they want off the chat log window.

[Zacchaeus]

Yeah, what kylania said and:

2. Yes voice chat all the way. Typing is just far too slow. BUT, because FG allows you to pass notes, maps and text to individual players it enhances the experience way more than can be done with P&P. If there is going to be a situation where players could have different options and only those players should know I prepare 'whispers' in advance and just drag them onto the player. I've also in the past dragged exactly the same chat onto every player just to see what the reaction is. So there is room for text but keep it for secret things or when only some of the party get knowledge.

5. That's what the chat window is for; it's supposed to get cluttered. You can type /clear to clear it every so often if you feel the need.

[chrisiav]

What happens if you drag the chat box onto a player? Does that become a whisper to just that player?

[kylania]

What happens if you drag the chat box onto a player? Does that become a whisper to just that player?

Yeah, you can type into the chat field and before hitting Enter you can drag that text and drop it on a player portrait and that'll whisper them directly.

I can't see how that's easier than /w b<tab> since you have to take your hands off the keyboard, use the mouse and drag from the southern reaches of FGIsland to the Northern Peaks of WhoPutTheseGuysWayUpHere Mountains. :)

[JohnD]

What happens if you drag the chat box onto a player? Does that become a whisper to just that player?

It does. That's how I do it.

As for your other questions....

I've gone as high as 10 in the same game. That didn't last long, a couple of sessions. Perhaps it was too big and that contributed to a few people flaking out... not sure. Generally my limit is 7 or 8, but a lot depends on the ruleset you're using. C&C is pretty easy to run a large group while RM is going to be tough for a GM.

I would use Teamspeak instead of chat. 10+ years of just chat as a DM in Neverwinter Nights and Neverwinter Nights 2 drove home how exhausting it is for a single DM to type everything for 3ish hours while 6+ players are just sitting there waiting.

Rules for rolls, hmm... well the big one is if the GM asks for a roll in the Tower and the player makes the roll out in the open, how do you handle it? Either the roll doesn't count and they roll in the Tower or the roll out in the open is an auto failure. But that's up to individual GM fiat.

[chrisiav]

Yeah, you can type into the chat field and before hitting Enter you can drag that text and drop it on a player portrait and that'll whisper them directly.

I can't see how that's easier than /w b<tab> since you have to take your hands off the keyboard, use the mouse and drag from the southern reaches of FGIsland to the Northern Peaks of WhoPutTheseGuysWayUpHere Mountains. :)

Actually I was referring to a box of text from a module. Can you just drag that onto a player portrait to make that a whisper for that player?

[Zacchaeus]

Actually I was referring to a box of text from a module. Can you just drag that onto a player portrait to make that a whisper for that player?

Yes, that's what I was talking about. I prepare these whispers in advance as boxed text and then just drag them onto the player.

[Griogre]

Nobody has mentioned this but, *especially* if you know your players personally, using voice will give FG a much greater face to face feel since you will have the same chatter as around the table. Generally, the more players you have the more speed advantage you will have from voice over typing.

[chrisiav]

Nobody has mentioned this but, *especially* if you know your players personally, using voice will give FG a much greater face to face feel since you will have the same chatter as around the table. Generally, the more players you have the more speed advantage you will have from voice over typing.

I hear you but since 1) I play with most of these guys twice a month face to face, and 2) my FG game runs on a weeknight and I have people chattering at me all day, I had this silly notion that it would be nice to play a quiet game of D&D. But I'm slowly coming to the realization that it's probably just a pipe dream unless my group dips down to under 4 players.

[VenomousFiligree]

My preference is for IC text and OOC voice. Imo you can achieve much richer RP with text, especially when playing the opposite sex. The downside is though, as people have pointed out, it's slower.

[JohnD]

At one time I was able to type 55 wpm and even that was slow for a 6 player group.

[Blahness98]

1) What size do you DMs limit your party to? Or do you have any limit? What # of players do you find optimum?

I try to keep my party sizes down to between 4 and 5. As I do a lot of text only games, I find that is the ideal number that I can handle with only text.

2) Am I just setting myself up for failure by restricting my chat to text or does anyone else find the mode viable?

It all depends on how well you can multitask. Voice makes things go quicker, but it does lower the immersion. If you can mix voice and text, you get both immersion and quicker uptake.

5) What tricks do other DMs use to control the flow of the chat window? For example, players love rolling die (I am guilty of it myself) But on FG, random rolls clog up the window. Does the novelty wear off? OR do you DMs have rules regarding rolls or just random OOC chatting?

I have players that don't roll randomly, so I couldn't tell you. I as a player have thrown random rolls by accident, but I usually apologize in OOC about tossing the the roll and stop clicking near the hotkeys. Otherwise, tell your players to toss the rolls out of the chat window so they will not register. That way they can toss as many as they want and they will not register.

[Mask_of_winter]

3) You can drag any unformated text from the chat (before it is sent) and drag and drop it onto a portrait to send it as a whisper.

I give you props for keeping it all typed chat. Unless I played a roleplay-heavy game with a light system (Hillfolk, WoD, etc) there is no way I'd set myself up for this kind of abuse as a GM. I may compromise and do OOC on voice and IC in chat. But never 100%

[damned]

These have all been answered but you are looking for opinions/advice so another set cant hurt!

1) What size do you DMs limit your party to? Or do you have any limit? What # of players do you find optimum?
I like to have a group of 7 because I will almost always have at least 4 that way and the game can go ahead.
A game with 3 or 4 players runs faster for sure.
A game with 6 or 7 can get bogged down even with voice.

2) Am I just setting myself up for failure by restricting my chat to text or does anyone else find the mode viable?
If you want to do chat do as much prep as possible.

3) Is there any mouse control (like a right click on the portrait) that can initiate whispers to make the chat faster? Or is it viable to create shortcut keys for a whisper? And if so, do you need a separate shortcut for each player?
Yes you can drag speech bubbles and story entries and pictures on to portraits for private sharing,

4) In the same vein, can you open up a second chat window or tab os that chat can go in one place and die rolls and what not go in the other?
Nope.

5) What tricks do other DMs use to control the flow of the chat window? For example, players love rolling die (I am guilty of it myself) But on FG, random rolls clog up the window. Does the novelty wear off? OR do you DMs have rules regarding rolls or just random OOC chatting?
Roll outside the chat window if you are just rolling and if they keep it up start throwing bolts of lightning.

[LordEntrails]

I've done all chat before (different platform, years ago. Its possible.) But as mentioned, it's tiring. The only reason I would consider it now is if you plan to go through the chat log and use it to post or document your adventure. Say you do a blog or online journal of your game, then it's worth it.

[damned]

Other reasons why people do text only include Immersion, more socially comfortable with text, cant do voice because they are in noisy/quiet environment.

[Blahness98]

The only reason I would consider it now is if you plan to go through the chat log and use it to post or document your adventure. Say you do a blog or online journal of your game, then it's worth it.

I do this for my players. I may get a little behind with the recaps, but it's fun going back and reading what happened in game to talk about it on a forum or do out of FG RP. Also allows me to remember what happened since the last session since I sometimes forget to take notes.

[Ardem]

On a side note you can set up direct Team Speak hotkeys

You can set up some whispers directly to individuals, they however can also to GM, however you will need to prepare them prior to game time.

I have a number of keys for my Arma group, just like these guys have. This might be able to help you speed up your flow.

here is a tutorial for you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=337pMAe-sac

[Lysander]

1) What size do you DMs limit your party to? Or do you have any limit? What # of players do you find optimum?
Optimum is 4 players, I can handle up to 6 if I am running Savage Worlds. I don't GM any other system since I found Savage Worlds...

2) Am I just setting myself up for failure by restricting my chat to text or does anyone else find the mode viable?
Chat only is SLOW and since I suck at typing, tedious after a couple of hours. I find voice chat like the FG Teamspeak, Ventrilo or even Skype speeds up the game play tremendously. Of course, Chat only has the advantage of being able to do other things while the game is going on (interact with my child and wife, eat without making noises on the voicechat, pay bills on a separate window...)

3) Is there any mouse control (like a right click on the portrait) that can initiate whispers to make the chat faster? Or is it viable to create shortcut keys for a whisper? And if so, do you need a separate shortcut for each player?
Nothing will make it truly faster, but the drag from chat box to character will help, or if you have preset speech, you can drag and drop or even hit the speak bubble icon if you format it right...

4) In the same vein, can you open up a second chat window or tab os that chat can go in one place and die rolls and what not go in the other?
Don't really know, so I can't opine here...

5) What tricks do other DMs use to control the flow of the chat window? For example, players love rolling die (I am guilty of it myself) But on FG, random rolls clog up the window. Does the novelty wear off? OR do you DMs have rules regarding rolls or just random OOC chatting?
If it get's really annoying of players rolling dice on the window, especially after telling them to stop, then start assigning random damage or ability minuses until they stop. Let them know WHY you want them to stop first, then proceed to punish the transgressors!

[chrisiav]

Thanks for all the info and tips. I put alot of what you all said into play and it definitely eased up the learning curve.

I put the text/voice question to the players and most wanted to just stay text. The sessions are kept to around two hours and I keep the adventures pretty simple hack and slash stuff. Most of us game together in monthly games that are long sessions and are RP heavy. so I think its kind of nice to have the change of 'go find something and kill it' one shots. I think if FG ever became the medium used for my regular games, I would have to go voice.

Even the most cynical of my players seem to be warming up to FG (Amazing how much more everyone enjoys the game when all the players figure out where the end turn icon is). A couple have even mentioned purchasing licenses of their own. I think alot of it depends on how WOTC supports the program going forward. Myself, I would love to see you guys release some of the older stuff for purchase.

[damned]

chrisiav it will be interesting to see if the Wizards entertain that thought... they have the back catalogue, it wouldnt require much effort on their behalf - 98% of the work would have to be done by SW. but would they see that as taking the shine away from 5e?

[ShadoShryke]

Nobody has mentioned this but, *especially* if you know your players personally, using voice will give FG a much greater face to face feel since you will have the same chatter as around the table. Generally, the more players you have the more speed advantage you will have from voice over typing.

This is what my groups have done with virtual tables. We like to use Skype and the Virtual table software open at the same time. This allows for some variance, as well as OOC interaction without extra hassles.

I tend to tell people to keep the virtual table chat "in character" and then all "out of character" conversations can be done in Skype or another chat system (Mumble, Ventrillo, etc.).

[Nyghtmare]

My preference is for IC text and OOC voice. Imo you can achieve much richer RP with text, especially when playing the opposite sex. The downside is though, as people have pointed out, it's slower.

This is actually my preference too, although I am playing it with people I only know from online.

If I were to get a campaign going with my friends from back home (I live in the USA, but am originally from Canada), I would want to do it the same way as well.

I have always been way more comfortable roleplaying in text than voice anyways. :)

[Nyghtmare]

chrisiav it will be interesting to see if the Wizards entertain that thought... they have the back catalogue, it wouldnt require much effort on their behalf - 98% of the work would have to be done by SW. but would they see that as taking the shine away from 5e?

Or, even better, they could release these classic modules for sale within Fantasy Grounds but converted for us already into the 5e rules — so they would be making money on older product that they would only need to update to the current rules, which shouldn't actually be too too hard.

[LordEntrails]

@Nyghtmare,
That's what I'm planning on myself (I'm actually doing Undermountain, which isn't such a straight forward update/conversion). I suspect that if a few people put together some good conversions, that then SW can take a couple as examples to show to WOTC and get their approval for release.

[Nibelung]

I'm late to the topic, but I like those questions.


1) What size do you DMs limit your party to? Or do you have any limit? What # of players do you find optimum?

My sweet spot is five characters. Mostly because I play 4e as my main game, and that is the assumed party size for balanced encounters. I tried more than once play with six players, but it always made the combats feel slower than usual.


2) Am I just setting myself up for failure by restricting my chat to text or does anyone else find the mode viable?

I use the chat for in character interaction, and the voice chat (via Teamspeak) for OOC comments and small questions. When a heavy roleplaying scene is going out, the voice chat have a tendency to go silent. That is the signal your players are focused on the game.


3) Is there any mouse control (like a right click on the portrait) that can initiate whispers to make the chat faster? Or is it viable to create shortcut keys for a whisper? And if so, do you need a separate shortcut for each player?

/w #<TAB>, with # being the first letter of the character name. It helps if your players have characters with names that start with different letters. You can tab as soon as you can differentiate one character from another. So if you have a Bobarbarian and a Barbaretta, you can type "/w ba<TAB>" or "/w bo<TAB>"


4) In the same vein, can you open up a second chat window or tab os that chat can go in one place and die rolls and what not go in the other?

Not that I know off.


5) What tricks do other DMs use to control the flow of the chat window? For example, players love rolling die (I am guilty of it myself) But on FG, random rolls clog up the window. Does the novelty wear off? OR do you DMs have rules regarding rolls or just random OOC chatting?

The novelty wears off after the fourth session. Just be patient. And if they just like to see the dice rolling, just ask them to roll outside the chat area and it will not register.