Monster traits not adding immune precision

[Togainu]

Playing around today with monster traits (such as Ooze's, Elementals, etc) I noticed that it was missing the application of the immunity of precision damage (at the applicable types). Is this currently still a planned feature and has to be done manually till then or is this an actual bug in it's current state.

This is in regards to Pathfinder

[Trenloe]

Works fine for me when I drag an Elemental or Gray Ooze from the bestiary to the combat tracker.

What version of the PFRPG ruleset are you running? Look in the chat window when you load up your campaign - you should see "PFRPG ruleset v3.1.1..."

Are you running any extensions?

[Togainu]

I don't have any extensions and I am running v3.1.1
It does mention the elemental trait (I also tried ooze and got the same result) and it adds immune critical automatically just fine. It just doesn't automatically add immune precision

[Trenloe]

Sorry, was just thinking of critical.

I can't see anything in the code that auto adds immune precision based off the creature type.

The only code I can find that covers precision damage is not multiplying the precision damage on a critical.

[Togainu]

Hmm alright, guess I will just have to add that manually to those monster types for now. Hope it at some point will be implemented

[Nickademus]

Shouldn't all types that add IMMUNE: critical also add IMMUNE: precision? I thought that precision damage was only possible if critical hits were.

[Trenloe]

Shouldn't all types that add IMMUNE: critical also add IMMUNE: precision? I thought that precision damage was only possible if critical hits were.
It's not specifically listed in creature types as immune to critical specifically grants immune to precision. It's usually talked about in the same sentence in the PRD, e.g. "Not subject to critical hits or flanking. Does not take additional damage from precision-based attacks, such as sneak attack." but there is nothing that states immune critical = immune precision.

To allow for flexibility, especially for 3PP creations, it shouldn't be assumed that immune critical = immune precision.

[Togainu]

I never said it automatically should grant immune precision when they are immune to crit. But all elementals are immune to precision so it would be nice if the system would automatically add it just like it auto adds crit immunity.

As seen here on the right (https://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/rogue#TOC-Rogue-Talents) there are specific types that are always immune to precision and seeing it can auto add the crit I was hoping it would do it as well for the precision

[Trenloe]

I never said it automatically should grant immune precision when they are immune to crit.
I know you didn't. :) I was replying to another user's post - that's why I included the section of Nickademus's post I was specifically replying to.

I agree with you, it would be nice to have IMMUNE: precision automatically added to the creature types where it's relevant. Please add it to the wishlist - https://fg2app.idea.informer.com/ Remember to include that this is for the PFRPG ruleset. Thanks.

[Togainu]

For the people interested in this you can find the suggestion here (https://fg2app.idea.informer.com/proj/?ia=96308) to vote

[Trenloe]

For the people interested in this you can find the suggestion here (https://fg2app.idea.informer.com/proj/?ia=96308) to vote
Voted. :)

[Nickademus]

It's not specifically listed in creature types as immune to critical specifically grants immune to precision. It's usually talked about in the same sentence in the PRD, e.g. "Not subject to critical hits or flanking. Does not take additional damage from precision-based attacks, such as sneak attack." but there is nothing that states immune critical = immune precision.

To allow for flexibility, especially for 3PP creations, it shouldn't be assumed that immune critical = immune precision.

According to James they are the same (https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2jxt3?So-What-precisely-is-precision-damage#8): So basically—as far as I read it, precision damage is a handy way of summarizing "extra damage from critical hits, extra damage from sneak attacks, and extra damage from a duelist's precise strike ability." But he goes on to say that precision damage isn't an official thing in PF, so Smite Works is going out on a limb to make 'precision' a damage type in the ruleset.

Irregardless, with the exception of swarms, if every instance of 'immune to critical hits' is followed by 'immune to precision damage', they don't need to be equal; but they should still both be applied for creature types that say the creature is immune to both.


I agree with you, it would be nice to have IMMUNE: precision automatically added to the creature types where it's relevant. Please add it to the wishlist...
I use the wishlist for new features. I consider this a feature that already exists but isn't finished. Smite Works took the time to code the ruleset to automatically add effects based on creature type (thank you). They should make sure the parser is adding all of them.

[Trenloe]

but they should still both be applied for creature types that say the creature is immune to both.
I agree and have said so above.


I use the wishlist for new features. I consider this a feature that already exists but isn't finished. Smite Works took the time to code the ruleset to automatically add effects based on creature type (thank you). They should make sure the parser is adding all of them.
The devs have many times said that they use the wishlist to track changes/additions to rulesets. The devs have also said on the effects page "The effect system was built to handle 80-90% of the rules available in the game system", so the parser will probably never reach your requirement of "adding all of them". Therefore, you need a place to add a request to have immunity to precision damage added for specific creatures - it's not a "bug" it's a request for an addition to the current system. I'd say that's the wishlist...

[Moon Wizard]

From what I can tell, "precision" damage is simply a shortcut way of saying that the extra damage applied in this way is not multiplied on a critical.

Also, from my understanding, this is completely different than "critical" damage, which is a shortcut way of saying the extra damage applied on a critical (which is calculated excluding precision damage).

That is how they are used within the 3.5E/PFRPG ruleset. As has been being discussed, this is a somewhat amorphous part of the PF/D20 rules in that it is not explicitly defined as part of the rules, but more of a common exception used and mentioned in several places.

While reviewing creature types in the PF SRD and D20 SRD, I noticed that the precision damage immunity is only in the PF SRD.

That said, I'll look into adding automatic effect for the appropriate creature types/subtypes.

Regards,
JPG

[Togainu]

Thank you all for the feedback on this topic and it is greatly appreciated that you are willing to look into this Moon Wizard