New Fantasy Ground user - What do I need to pay D&D 5e?

[mysticknight232]

Hello all -

Like many of you, my group and I have been looking for ways to game away from the table due to the usual personal life changes such as getting married, having families and just plain growing up. We came across FG after the release of D&D 5e. I have been tasked with gathering as much information about FG as possible so we can decide if this would be right for us. I have two questions:

First - What do I/we need to purchase in order to play? We have a group of 6 people and looking at the FG packages, I'm just a bit confused about who needs to purchase what. If I buy the Core Character Pack ($50) and Core Monster Pack ($50), do I get all the game rules from the PHB as well or do I still need to purchase the Basic Rules? Furthermore regarding the actual FG software purchase, if i purchase the Ultimate License ($149), it looks like anybody I authorize can access all materials I share at any time, whether I'm logged into FG or not. Is it that easy? What if one of my other players wants to GM, can they use their account to GM or are they considered guests and not FG users if they don't purchase their own package? In short, help me understand better what the packages do and don't do.

Second - What are the pros and more importantly, some of the cons about running 5e on here? I'm looking at the two adventures that are already available with maps, tokens and other information preloaded to make game prep easier. But does everything work as smoothly as it does in the demo youtube videos? Things always look great until you get in and play around with it and I just want to know what the users think first.

I'm sure this will be a living thread for a little while as more questions come up from me but for now, thanks for your help!

mysticknight232

[Nylanfs]

1a) Everyone will need FG installed and either a full license key ($39USD, or $4USD subscription) or the GM will need to have the Ultimate License ($149USD, or $10USD subscription) which lets everyone connect without buying a license key.
1b)If you as the GM buy the Complete packs ($50USDx2) you can designate that they are shared with the players, BUT they will ONLY have access when you have your session of FG up, running and they are connected to it. The Basic Rules are a smaller subset of the core rules and aren't needed if you buy the Core packs. If the players want to play around with characters while not connected they will need to purchase the Core Character pack (or any of the smaller subsections of it)
1c)If somebody seems likely to want to GM in the future I would recommend everyone get the full license.

2)Unless the video's are put up by Smiteworks, those are ALL in-game video's, and how smoothly it goes depends on how fast you get used to how FG works. There is a decent learning curve.

If you aren't sure I would suggest getting a $10/mo Sub, the Basic Rules pack $4 and throw a quick adventure together for eveyone to play with and try it for a month. Then buy a license before your next sub date is up if you are interested.

[FSHSchmo]

Feel free to stop by my YouTube channel (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCNVjqGaZXOh51urvCAMFy_Q) and see the games I run. I upload all my D&D games and they are ran from the DM view using Fantasy Grounds. If ya have any questions feel free to shoot me a PM.

[Trenloe]

In answer to your second question... As nylanfs says, there is a learning process, but once you get going it gets pretty smooth. FG is excellent for GMs - it allows for you to do a lot of prep ahead of the game and have everything ready to go during the game. Information is saved locally to the GM's computer and everything from one session to the next is recorded so you can pick up where you left off last time.

Fantasy Grounds has been around for over 10 years, so the base operation does run pretty smooth, like I the videos.

[mysticknight232]

So if I'm reading things correctly, with the Ultimate License, my players can connect to any information I share with them even when I'm not logged in to FG. Also, I automatically get the Rulesets for D&D 3.5, 4e, 5e and Pathfinder? Also, I get some additional OGL stuff for 3.5 and Pathfinder?

If any of my players want to take a turn at GM'ing, they would also need to purchase a license otherwise, if I had the Ultimate License people coule log in at anytime to play in my game? They would need the free demo at least I assume...can I still share anything I've purchased with them? Can they still save character sheets and other information or would I have to manage everything for them?

So far this is looking to be a good program. Thanks!

[mysticknight232]

Also, what communication software are you guys using? Skype, teamspeak, something else?

[FSHSchmo]

So if I'm reading things correctly, with the Ultimate License, my players can connect to any information I share with them even when I'm not logged in to FG. Also, I automatically get the Rulesets for D&D 3.5, 4e, 5e and Pathfinder? Also, I get some additional OGL stuff for 3.5 and Pathfinder?

You would need to have FG up and running and provide with them with the server alias or your IP for them to connect in order for them to use the information unless they purchase the content for themselves. FG comes with the above listed rulesets.


If any of my players want to take a turn at GM'ing, they would also need to purchase a license otherwise, if I had the Ultimate License people coule log in at anytime to play in my game? They would need the free demo at least I assume...can I still share anything I've purchased with them? Can they still save character sheets and other information or would I have to manage everything for them?

Correct, if they wanted to DM their own games they would need to purchase an Ultimate License for others to connect and play for free or everybody would need an Full License. You can export the PCs they make in FG and they can upload them locally. They can either purchase the class packs and use that to edit the PCs locally, manually edit them, or connect back to you and make changes. If the they have the free version and you have an Ultimate License they can connect to free and share the content you have purchased if you allow them to.

[FSHSchmo]

Also, what communication software are you guys using? Skype, teamspeak, something else?

I use Skype, some use Roll20 for their voice/cam chat, others also use Teamspeak or Google Hangouts.

[Moon Wizard]

Also, just to clarify, since there is sometimes misunderstanding between rulesets and game system content.

The rulesets to support 3.5E, 4E, 5E, and Pathfinder are included; and provide all the sheets and tools to play the game as well as automation of many of the rules.

However, data for those game systems is not included (except for core 3.5E and Pathfinder OGL data).

You can always enter your data into the various sheets as your campaign goes along, just like you would at a live table. Or, there are various resources for getting data.

For 5E, we have licensed the data from WotC, and have them for sale in our store. Also, there is a community tool called Par5E to help build data packs from text files.

For 4E, there is a community tool for connecting to your D&D insider account to build data packs from Compendium.

For Pathfinder, there is a list of community modules (i.e. Data packs) on the forums encapsulating a large chunk of the expanded OGL material available.

Rulesets and modules for other game systems are available for sale in our store. Savage Worlds, Castles and Crusades, Call of Cthulhu, ...

Hope this helps.

Cheers,
JPG

[mysticknight232]

Thanks Moon Wizard, and the other posters as well. I think this helps a great deal. I for one hope that my gaming group chooses to go this route.

Edit: Thought of another question. If I were to buy one of the adventure modules...or any of the rulesets (or data for that matter), can I view that information in say a PDF format? In otherwords, could I export the Wizard class or the entire core rulebook to PDF so that I could read it on the go on my iPad or can I only view the information inside of Fantasy Grounds and only on my computer?

Edit #2: Thought of one more question. What would the benefit be for my players to pay $40 for a full license versus just using the demo program? If everybody is already chipping in to purchase all the other core products, my guess is taht the rest of the people will just want to get the free software.

[Mavrik6666]

Try ooVoo for comms too; holds the rigors of video and audio well, allows you to turn off cams of other people, fits in a nice side bar view, handles up to 12 people, and doesn't shut down after 4 hours like Skype group chat... and its free

[Moon Wizard]

If I were to buy one of the adventure modules...or any of the rulesets (or data for that matter), can I view that information in say a PDF format? In otherwords, could I export the Wizard class or the entire core rulebook to PDF so that I could read it on the go on my iPad or can I only view the information inside of Fantasy Grounds and only on my computer?


No. The data is formatted completely differently than a PDF, since it is designed for faster use during play. There is no mechanism to export this data into any other medium (nor license for us to do so).



What would the benefit be for my players to pay $40 for a full license versus just using the demo program? If everybody is already chipping in to purchase all the other core products, my guess is taht the rest of the people will just want to get the free software.


If you already own the Ultimate license, then the players only need the demo/free license to play in your game.
If you have the Standard license, then the players will each need their own license to play.

Regards,
JPG

[Nylanfs]

Edit 1: The answer would be no, it would be nice if Smiteworks could sell FG/PDF bundles though at some point.

Edit 2:If somebody else wants to start a game either everyone would have to buy a full license, or that person has to get a Ultimate license. Also Module purchases are per user and tied to your steam or FG forum account, you can't share them between GM's.

[Nylanfs]

One of the FG users has a Teamspeak server setup for FG users to use also, details in the CoreRPG game system section I believe.

[Griogre]

To further clarify you Edit 2: The difference between everyone getting the $40 licenses and one person getting an Ultimate license is that anyone with the $40 license can run a game so the cost to be a DM has been paid for already. Will everyone in a group DM? Not usually but there is no barrier to anyone with the $40 license to DMing.

However if one person buys the Ultimate license, if someone else wants to DM that second DM *must* also buy an ultimate license so the "buy in" of a new DM is more expensive.

With Steam's buy 4 licenses for the price of 3 it is cheaper for a small group to get the $40 licenses. Make sure you understand the trade offs between just getting licenses and paying by the month as well because it might make sense for a short term DM to just get a monthly license for a few months.

What's best for you group will depend on how many DM's you have in the Group and if you can get your players to buy a licenses. We can actually help run the numbers for you if you told us the size of the group and number of DMs.

[damned]

Try it out with a $10/month ultimate Sub and the Lost Mines of Phandelver.
You will have everything you need to run this most excellent adventure.

If you love it then continue the sub or buy it outright.
Then work out what 5e material you will buy.... its easier of course to get it all but that is a $$ decision too.
Some of the excellent GMs here have not bought any 5e material on Fantasy Grounds - they use Par5e to get their material in or they enter it in when they need it.

[mysticknight232]

Try it out with a $10/month ultimate Sub and the Lost Mines of Phandelver.
You will have everything you need to run this most excellent adventure.

If you love it then continue the sub or buy it outright.
Then work out what 5e material you will buy.... its easier of course to get it all but that is a $$ decision too.
Some of the excellent GMs here have not bought any 5e material on Fantasy Grounds - they use Par5e to get their material in or they enter it in when they need it.

Hey, this is a great idea! $10 for one month plus $20 to purchase the adventure which comes with Pre-Gen characters right? Would I also need to purchase the D&D Basic rules for $3 or would I get that when buying the Ultimate Subscription for one month?

Edit: I see that the Ultimate Subscription comes with the 5e Ruleset so I answered my own question there.

[mysticknight232]

To further clarify you Edit 2: The difference between everyone getting the $40 licenses and one person getting an Ultimate license is that anyone with the $40 license can run a game so the cost to be a DM has been paid for already. Will everyone in a group DM? Not usually but there is no barrier to anyone with the $40 license to DMing.

However if one person buys the Ultimate license, if someone else wants to DM that second DM *must* also buy an ultimate license so the "buy in" of a new DM is more expensive.

With Steam's buy 4 licenses for the price of 3 it is cheaper for a small group to get the $40 licenses. Make sure you understand the trade offs between just getting licenses and paying by the month as well because it might make sense for a short term DM to just get a monthly license for a few months.

What's best for you group will depend on how many DM's you have in the Group and if you can get your players to buy a licenses. We can actually help run the numbers for you if you told us the size of the group and number of DMs.

Thanks for the clarification here. It's not that everybody in the group wants to DM, it's just that if we're going to invest this much money into a VTT software program, we wanted to understand if one person was "locked" in as the GM or if anybody could step in to the GM shoes after the initial purchase. I'm all for using this and I'm not worried about the cost seeing as how nice the program looks, but we're a democracy and all need to agree before proceeding thus all the questions and clarification!

A couple problems my group has is that they don't like the idea that other people having to buy licenses if they want to GM. This is mainly because if the GM is unavailable for a period and somebody else wants to run a one-shot, they don't want to have to pay again for the information we already paid for. The other thing they don't like is the fact that they can't access any of the in-game information (maps, rules, character sheets) if the GM is not physically logged in as well. I'm certainly not trying to complain, just sharing my groups thoughts so far on the research. Hmm, I feel like I'm back in college researching a paper. How funny is that!

I like the idea of buying a 1 months sub and the Phandelver adventure with pregens and giving it a try first to see how we like it. That seems to be the most economical way to go about this.

Continued thanks for all the back and forth on this. You guys have been a great sounding board for me!

[damned]

Hey, this is a great idea! $10 for one month plus $20 to purchase the adventure which comes with Pre-Gen characters right? Would I also need to purchase the D&D Basic rules for $3 or would I get that when buying the Ultimate Subscription for one month?

you get the basic rules included with the LMoP.

[damned]

Thanks for the clarification here. It's not that everybody in the group wants to DM, it's just that if we're going to invest this much money into a VTT software program, we wanted to understand if one person was "locked" in as the GM or if anybody could step in to the GM shoes after the initial purchase. I'm all for using this and I'm not worried about the cost seeing as how nice the program looks, but we're a democracy and all need to agree before proceeding thus all the questions and clarification!

A couple problems my group has is that they don't like the idea that other people having to buy licenses if they want to GM. This is mainly because if the GM is unavailable for a period and somebody else wants to run a one-shot, they don't want to have to pay again for the information we already paid for. The other thing they don't like is the fact that they can't access any of the in-game information (maps, rules, character sheets) if the GM is not physically logged in as well. I'm certainly not trying to complain, just sharing my groups thoughts so far on the research. Hmm, I feel like I'm back in college researching a paper. How funny is that!

I like the idea of buying a 1 months sub and the Phandelver adventure with pregens and giving it a try first to see how we like it. That seems to be the most economical way to go about this.

Continued thanks for all the back and forth on this. You guys have been a great sounding board for me!

There are really two parts to the licensing equation going on.

The Fantasy Grounds license is fully a SmiteWorks thing. They own that. If you want to swap GMs for a month and the regular GM has an Ultimate License or Ultimate Sub - have the new GM grab a Sub for a month. $10 and the base system and all its connectivity and bells and whistles is all there. If the usual GM has a Sub he can even cancel it while the other GM has his turn if he wants.

The commercial rulesets are another matter. There are licensing agreements with those companies (Wizards, PEG, Troll Lord etc) and when a GM (its usually the GM!) buys those licenses they are only licensed to be used by that person on their computer. The license allows the materials to be shared to the players while they are connected to the GMs machine only.

For most of the rulesets this isnt so bad - $10 for Castles&Crusades or Savage Worlds and $5 for FATE etc. But the D&D stickers are much bigger. If you are swapping the GM role about regularly doing D&D it will be fairly expensive. Only you can decide if that will work for you guys. I know in the group I play with of the 8 there are 4 Ultimate Licenses, 2 Full and 2 of the old Lite licenes and we also have 4 complete D&D sets in there too.

Some of the most regular 5e D&D players do not have any of the commercial products. They have either used the Par5e tool or just enter data as they need it. Its more work but all the game mechanics are there.

[dulux-oz]

One other thing which I'm going to throw into the pot - check out the Tutorial Videos available on the FG Wiki. Damn's are very good, Xorn's are excellent as well, and people seem to like mine too (mine are also available from the links in my sig).

While they won't necessarily help with your current purchasing decision(s), they will be helpful when you actually start to play - and a little bit of knowledge may help your decision(s) as well. :)

Start with the ones on the CoreRPG Ruleset. The CoreRPG Ruleset forms the foundation of all of the modern Rulesets, including the 5E DnD one. Learning the info contained in the CoreRPG will stand you in very good stead for using FG to play any RPG with FG. Once you've got a good handle on how FG works from these videos, then move on the game system of your choice (5E in this case).

Another piece of info which may help you understand things is this one here (https://www.fantasygrounds.com/wiki/index.php/Development_Overview) - also from the Wiki. Don't worry if the title doesn't seem too relevant, the info will help.

Cheers

[mysticknight232]

I started watching the CoreRPG tutorial video over my lunch hour today, very informational! Thanks for the suggestion.

[Trenloe]

One of the FG users has a Teamspeak server setup for FG users to use also, details in the CoreRPG game system section I believe.
Details of the community provided, free to use TeamSpeak3 server here: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?17071-Voicechat!-Community-TeamSpeak3-Server

[Isamill]

Here's my take on cost and benefit,
In the old days I would have spent thousands on manuals, adventures, and figures to play DnD especially with each ruleset change every 4 or 5 years - I think a cost of $40 each for a full licence is extremely cost effective to cover anyone wanting to DM and light licences for everyone else, the cost of a few rulesets, and adventures over the whole is extremely cheap compared to what we used to play and yes for people with a good group and real life you can still play together regularly no matter where you are
And the most important thing is the community here are EXTREMELY helpful and assist and welcome everyone on board

[mysticknight232]

I'm quite happy with all the help and responses I've gotten here so far. In the end I may just purchase a 1 mo sub and an adventure and run the players in the group that want to give it a try and those who don't won't have to play. I'll keep asking questions as they come up!

For example, I know that savage worlds is supported which our group also plays. We use Hero Lab for those char sheets. Does FG import that data easily or is it not compatible with 3rd party programs like Hero Lab?

[Griogre]

There is some hero lab support for D&D 3.x and 4E. PC gen support too. I don't think there is for SW but you might ask on the Savage Worlds boards.

[JohnD]

You can import Pathfinder characters as well from HL.

[demonsbane]

Also, what communication software are you guys using? Skype, teamspeak, something else?

I still think that Text Chat, the way Fantasy Grounds supports it, is the best! :D

[Iovec]

Okay... new FG user here... I have the Ultimate edition. I understand that people with a demo version can join my campaigns. I also understand that the regular license is the best way to go for players/GMs wanting to start their own games later.

If I am reading this correctly, since I have the ultimate edition, I already have the "D&D Complete Core Class Pack" and the "D&D Complete Core Monster Pack". So if I wanted to run a 5e adventure, all I would really need to do is
A) purchase one of the modules here (i.e. Rise of Tiamat, Horde of the Dragon Queen, Lost Mine of Phandelver, etc.) or,
B) create one on my own.

Also, since FG doesn't have Voice Chat built in, I would need to use my own client software (skype, Google+, Teamspeak, Ventrillo, etc.) if I wanted to do voice communication.

Did I get this summed up correctly?

[Nylanfs]

No, the Ultimate license does not include any data, it's ONLY to allow people with demo license to connect to you. Unless you want to make your own class and MM modules you would need to get those from the store also. Unless you do things more free-form and just enter a few stats you need as you go along.

Yes on the Voice, there is a TS Server setup for FG users (https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?17071-Voicechat!-Community-TeamSpeak3-Server) already, and lots of people have had good experiences with Google Hangouts.

[damned]

Hey Iovec! Welcome.
Ultimate contains exactly teh same content and features as the Standard License.
It has the one extra feature of allowing ANY other FG Client - licensed or demo - to connect to your games.
You can have 2 or 4 or 8 (there isnt an inbuilt limit but there are practical limits) demo players connect to you with the Ultimate license.
That is the sole purpose of the Ultimate License - to allow you to have anyone join the game.

As you already have the Ultimate - some good options for using it for 5e are:

1. Buy the Basic Rules for $3. Includes a swag of munsters and spells and the 4 core classes.
2. Buy Lost Mines of Phandelver - it includes the above plus a fully prepped adventure.
3. Buy PHB and MM and you have access to all of their goodness in FG format
4. Enter stuff in as you need it from your existing books
5. Scan your books, OCR them and use Par5e to convert them to FG format

I think Option 1 and 2 are really good options... $3 and $20 respectively.

[Iovec]

Nylanfs and damed,

I guess since I am new, then I am not fully understanding, but thanks for the info. Let me see if I got it now. As of right now, when I launch FG I can select D&D 5e, and I can create characters with 5e. But the class data (hereafter called "ruleset" just for my understanding) is not there, which means that when a fighter uses "second wind", then I would have to manually roll the results whereas if I purchase the ruleset then this could be automated on the character sheet. I am using Roll20.net currently, so I'm trying to compare the two.

I own the Ultimate licence and I want to run D&D 5e games exclusively. (Not really limiting myself to D&D 5e, but just using this so I can get a grasp of this.) FG has the "SUPPORT" for 5e ruleset but the actual ruleset (i.e. monster manual, player class info) is not installed. In order for me to run a game using the complete 5e ruleset, I would still need to purchase the following:
1) D&D Complete Core Class Pack
2) D&D Complete Core Monster Pack

and a module if I don't plan on making my own.

[damned]

close... but no cigar... it is confusing at first.
the games mechanics - the ruleset - is all included.
the 5e content - eg spells, monsters, class descriptions, equipment lists etc etc are IP belonging to the Wizards and is sold separately.

there is lots of automation but far from everything is automated. some stuff cant be automated fully - its just too complex.
when you create a Fighter using the PHB you can drag things like Second Wind into your char sheet and it will create an Effect/Action that lets you apply this with a single click
some features dont have that option
some feats can be defined as Effects and can be applied to your character and they will automatically interact with and modify rolls etc
there is a huge array of stuff in the PHB and there is other stuff - especially effects - available in the forums here

you can do a LOT of this without the licensed source material but its soooo much quicker with it.

now there is every chance that you are even more confused than before....

[dulux-oz]

Hi Iovec, and Welcome!

Let me chime in here as well - you really, really want to call things by their correct (ie Fantasy Grounds accepted) names, otherwise you'll just end up confusing yourself and everyone else.

In FG terms, a Ruleset is the set of computer code specifically designed to automate the Rules on an RPG. What you are calling a ruleset is better labeled (in FG terms) as a Module, and can include not only the Adventure information but also any Sourcebooks, Rulebooks, etc - the data.

Fantasy Grounds comes with Rulesets (remember: these are the automations) for a number of RPGs, including 5E D&D, but doesn't come with any source material (remember: data, or Modules) - apart from some OGL stuff for 3.5E & 4E.

You can play 5E without purchasing any of the data (the Class Pack, etc) but you will have to enter any such information manually. There are tools avaliable to do this (Par5e being the one most of us use) but this still takes time;

=OR=

You can use the Class Pack, etc, which has already been formatted, etc, correctly, thus saving you the effort and time.

This post (https://www.fantasygrounds.com/wiki/index.php/Development_Overview) from the Wiki will also help explain things in terms of Rulesets, Modules and Extensions (something we haven't touched on yet).

Don't worry, it can be confusing, but keep on asking questions - we're here to help and by asking the same question in a different way then you may get an answer explained in a different way which will help you "get it". :)

Cheers

[chillybilly]

The only "con" with using Fantasy Grounds is that it will spoil you. The program is so helpful, so fluid and takes care of all the little things (like keep track of the math), it could very well ruin you from playing "face-to-face" again. Fantasy Grounds is simply awesome.

I've been a gamer my whole life and the $30 bucks I spent on FG way back then was the single best gaming payment I ever made.

The only thing you also should look into is a voice chat program like Ventrilo or Teamspeak (there are others out there).

[Nylanfs]

Or you can use it for face to face games. :)

[Iovec]

Damned and Dulux-Oz,

Thanks for the replies... after reading all this, I am excited to get to using FG instead of Roll20.net even though it seems as though Roll20.net is cheaper and has a bunch built in that doesn't cost extra. I am finding a ton of stuff in Roll20.net to be buggy and not consistent.

That being said... sigh... I think I need a class... Anyone going to be at Gen Con that has a while to teach an old gamer some new tech?? Or, as an alternative, if anyone lives around Columbia, SC we can meet up before then...

My brain hurts... lol!

[damned]

Iovec

I have some (very poor production quality) very short intro videos on Fantasy Grounds. Each is 2-7mins in length and they cover one topic each. They are things that I think are useful to learn as a GM.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLsgd1zJLdiKUrEd85Dqr6UcaaLvD7YlJd

Dulux-Oz has gone the other way and produced (much better production quality) some much longer videos that go into a lot more background and more detail.
https://tinyurl.com/qaxsbqn

One of the great GMs here jh79 runs a once a month GM class for 5e. It goes for 3hours and will teach you oodles. Next vacancy is in July.
I could be persuaded to run a 90min session nice and early one morning for you (Dulux-Oz and I are on the other side of the planet from most of you fine people) but it wont get into the detail of the 5e ruleset as I havent GMd with that yet. You will get more than enough basics/intro to keep your head spinning though.

[dulux-oz]

Damned and Dulux-Oz,

Thanks for the replies... after reading all this, I am excited to get to using FG instead of Roll20.net even though it seems as though Roll20.net is cheaper and has a bunch built in that doesn't cost extra. I am finding a ton of stuff in Roll20.net to be buggy and not consistent.

That being said... sigh... I think I need a class... Anyone going to be at Gen Con that has a while to teach an old gamer some new tech?? Or, as an alternative, if anyone lives around Columbia, SC we can meet up before then...

My brain hurts... lol!

Roll20 is not actually cheaper in the long run (they just advertise it to seem that way), nor does it have the 5E stuff available for it (SmiteWorks is the only one to have that deal with Wizards of the Coast).

As far as a class, check out the Tutorial Videos on the Wiki - damned's are good, as are Xorn's, and people seem to like mine as well (mine are also available from the link in my sig). Start with the ones on th4e CoreRPG, because the CoreRPG forms the foundation of all of the other (modern) Rulesets and by learning how to do things in the CoreRPG you'll stand yourself in good stead for playing any RPG via FG.

And keep asking question - as I said, we love to help!

Cheers

Edit: Damn! damned beat me to it :p

[crb31]

Feel free to stop by my YouTube channel (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCNVjqGaZXOh51urvCAMFy_Q) and see the games I run. I upload all my D&D games and they are ran from the DM view using Fantasy Grounds. If ya have any questions feel free to shoot me a PM.
Thanks for doing the YouTube stuff. I find it very helpful.

[LordEntrails]

Guys, anyone notice that these same questions seem to come up every couple of weeks? I do, because I asked them myself just a few weeks ago. Perhaps one of these threads should be made sticky or, better yet, the website descriptions get cleaned up some? Please?

[dulux-oz]

Guys, anyone notice that these same questions seem to come up every couple of weeks? I do, because I asked them myself just a few weeks ago. Perhaps one of these threads should be made sticky or, better yet, the website descriptions get cleaned up some? Please?

I quite agree that something needs to be done - that's one reason I and others did the Tutorial Videos and also why I wrote and continue to write Wiki entries, etc, etc, etc. One of the issues (as I see it) is that people aren't reading the Wiki / watching the Videos. Why? Maybe they aren't finding them, maybe they don't want to do any research, maybe people aren't finding the info relevant - could be a range of reasons.

And as I said, that's only one issue.

It might help if there was a "Glossary" page on the Wiki or the website, or maybe the website itself needs a make-over by a professional, experience web/graphic designer (I can suggest somebody, by the way) or something such as LordEntrails' suggested - I don't know.

What I do know is that SW is a small company with only a couple of guys and that they rely heavily on the Community, so they don't have very much time to devote to everything that needs doing. Its an issue, to be sure.

There's nothing stopping anyone from writing an article/help page/whatever or having a go at re-doing a Wiki Entry if they feel its warranted, and then sending that to Doug or John or Zeph (or someone else who SW has entrusted with Wiki Edit privileges) for inclusion. My suggestion is if you feel you can help, then offer to help.

(The random thoughts of a Community member)

[damned]

Guys, anyone notice that these same questions seem to come up every couple of weeks? I do, because I asked them myself just a few weeks ago. Perhaps one of these threads should be made sticky or, better yet, the website descriptions get cleaned up some? Please?

It is a perfectly good observation. I dont think the solution is as straight forward.

Some people get it straight away from the website descriptions.
Some get it from the forums.
Some dont read far enough.
Some read the website and because they dont understand the layered system of Fantasy Grounds its still not clear to them. The wording on the website has been changed and tweaked and improved a good number of times to try to better convey the message. Some people will need it all explained to them (and this is not a criticism at all) but if the more full explanations were included in the main blurb it would just be confusing to the majority of viewers IMO.
Even in answering the question the way it is answered is constantly evolving as people get better at working out what makes sense to a new/prospective user and what is just confusing.
Couple that with - there is no one right answer to this question - i have 5 good answers and others have their own...

Perhaps your fresh eyes and fresh perspective might have a crack at it - the explanation that worked for you might be worth expanding on?

[Nylanfs]

I think it needs a flowchart, because flowcharts are cool (along with bow-ties and fez's) . :)

[dulux-oz]

I think it needs a flowchart, because flowcharts are cool (along with bow-ties and fez's) . :)

And who's a fan of the 11th (or is that now 12th) Doctor? Hmmmm?

[Nylanfs]

Bow-ties are from the 2nd doctor ;P

[dulux-oz]

And the 11th/12th :p

[Doc_Jones]

Iovec

One of the great GMs here jh79 runs a once a month GM class for 5e. It goes for 3hours and will teach you oodles. Next vacancy is in July.
I could be persuaded to run a 90min session nice and early one morning for you (Dulux-Oz and I are on the other side of the planet from most of you fine people) but it wont get into the detail of the 5e ruleset as I havent GMd with that yet. You will get more than enough basics/intro to keep your head spinning though.

As someone who has watched nearly all of Dulux-Oz's video's, a handfull of Xorn's, and attended jh79's 5E workshop, I highly recommend doing them. It seems like a lot of time to invest, however I can honestly say that I would NEVER have figured all these things out on my own. There are so many different features, and the wiki is so expansive, that without the visuals I'd still be lost. Make sure you aren't drowsy when you watch Dulux-oz's videos though. He has such a mellow tone and even pacing that he can easily lull you into a trance (this is meant to be complimentary). I suspect that he is trying to brainwash us with subliminal messaging somehow. Dulux-Oz for President! All hail the D-O!

[LordEntrails]

So, let me give a bit more on my experience and perspective on this topic, maybe that will help us solve this.

First, so you know my background etc, I'm a 45 yr old application engineer who supports, trains and implements engineering software. Mostly in the CAD and data management areas. My 'users' and 'customers' can be anything from an administrative clerk, a CEO or a highly technical specialist (engineer etc).

Second, my experience figuring out FG licensing;
- Started by reading various VTT reviews and comparisons. Note, this was a big influence on my incorrect understanding of how FG is licensed, because many of these are years old and none that I remember have the current FG licensing options.
- FG website: IMO pushes the capabilities with 5E and other game rules (as it should).
- - The store pages discuss what is included in the standard & Ultimate licenses (and they seem better written now upon review than I remember them from a month or two ago). The biggest piece of missing info, is they (esp the ultimate) does not include a list of what other purchasable items they do NOT include. Now, from a sales and marketing aspect, they should not include such a list. (But it leaves the question open for someone doing detailed research.)
- - I will also state, that "Ultimate", IMO is a deceptive title. It implies that this is the only thing you will ever need. Which is true, but since I was looking for, and the FG website has all the 5E licensing info, I assumed (& wanted to assume) that it would include all this 5E licensed stuff (not the modules etc, but all the rule books).
- - - IMO, ""Unlimited" would be a better descriptive license title since all it really gives me over the standard license is an unlimited number of players or guests connecting to a game I host. But, please don't change the title now!
- Next I did look at the wiki when I was doing my research. First, my experience with wiki's is they usually contain user and/or developer type info. Not prospective customer info. So, when I saw the FG wiki homepage, it looks like that is what it contains. (and IMO is what it should stick to) and would not contain any type of licensing info I was looking for. I will note, the existence of the FG wiki from my customer perspective was considered a good thing as this told me the program was alive and well with a robust user community.
- I also did look at the the forums. And this is where I was hoping to find the info. Again, from my customer perspective, the forum was important, actually was probably the deciding factor, to purchase as it indicated a living product with a good community and active customer support and development.

But, I couldn't find the info in the forums.

Why?
- The forum search tool; not good, not bad, though it does limit how often I can perform a search. That puts me off from trying to search for things.
- By browsing around the likely forum areas I expected such info might be, I couldn't find anything that looked promising. So I asked, and got the answers I needed, thx.

How to solve the issue?
- Well, since people keep asking in the forums, I think that's the place to put the answer. And I suggest it be a sticky post either in the City Hall or the Tavern.
- IMO a table is the way to go. I'll see what I can come up with and then we can put that with some of the answers others already gave and then see about making a new thread and making it sticky.

[dulux-oz]

As someone who has watched nearly all of Dulux-Oz's video's, a handfull of Xorn's, and attended jh79's 5E workshop, I highly recommend doing them. It seems like a lot of time to invest, however I can honestly say that I would NEVER have figured all these things out on my own. There are so many different features, and the wiki is so expansive, that without the visuals I'd still be lost.

Thankyou for the kind words - I'm glad you find them useful.


Make sure you aren't drowsy when you watch Dulux-oz's videos though. He has such a mellow tone and even pacing that he can easily lull you into a trance (this is meant to be complimentary).

Well, you know what they say about those who speak with a mellow tone (& I'm looking here at all the fine ladies on the boards ;) - think Barry White, Chef from Southpark, etc)


I suspect that he is trying to brainwash us with subliminal messaging somehow. Dulux-Oz for President! All hail the D-O!

Damn! They're on to me! Now I'll have to bring my plans for world-domination forward. MINIONS!!!!!

[LordEntrails]

I have a table put together, but have a few uncertainties around the demo/free licenses.

Can you buy and use any accessories if you only have the demo/free license? Would they do you any good given that you can not save characters or modified content?

[LordEntrails]

Still have the above question, so some of below may be inaccurate/wrong. But here's a draft of the table. Thoughts? (and better ways to post/format this?)




License Type


Feature/Function/Content
Demo/Free
Fantasy Grounds License (Standard)
Ultimate License


Connect to Game as a Player
Ultimate Hosted Game Only
Yes
Yes


Host Games as a GM/DM
1 Connection/Player Only, No Saving
Yes
Yes


Host Games for Demo/Free Users
No
1 Demo User Only (no full licenses can connect when in this demo mode)
Yes


Create Campaign Material (by ruleset)
No
Yes
Yes


Create Character (by ruleset)
Yes
Yes
Yes


Create Rulesets, Adventures & Customizations
No Saving
Yes
Yes


Core RPG Ruleset
Included
Included
Included


Third Party Published Content
Purchase
Purchase
Purchase








D&D 3.5 Ruleset
Included
Included
Included


D&D 3.5 OGL Libraries (SRD subset)
Included
Included
Included


D&D 3.5 Community Content
Available Free
Available Free
Available Free








Pathfinder Ruleset
Included
Included
Included


Pathfinder OGL Libraries (PRD subset)
Included
Included
Included


Pathfinder Community Content
Available Free
Available Free
Available Free








D&D 4E Ruleset
Included
Included
Included


D&D 4E Data Parsing
?
w/ DDI Subscription
w/ DDI Subscription


D&D 4E Community Content
Available Free
Available Free
Available Free








D&D 5E Ruleset
Included
Included
Included


D&D 5E Basic Rules
Purchase
Purchase
Purchase


D&D 5E Complete Core Class Pack (Players Handbook)
Purchase
Purchase
Purchase


D&D 5E Class Packs
Purchase
Purchase
Purchase


D&D 5E Character Customization Pack
Purchase
Purchase
Purchase


D&D 5E Complete Core Monster Pack (Monster Manual)
Purchase
Purchase
Purchase


D&D 5E Monster Packs
Purchase
Purchase
Purchase


D&D 5E (Dungeon Master's Guide)
Purchase
Purchase
Purchase



Purchase
Purchase
Purchase


D&D 5E WotC Adventure Modules
Purchase
Purchase
Purchase


D&D 5E Community Content
Available Free
Available Free
Available Free

[TASagent]

Maybe change "Connect to Game as a Player" to "Host Game for Demo Users: No/No/Yes"? Or something to that effect.

Naturally, if someone wants to know what the Ultimate does, they'll look at the Ultimate column, then be confused why it's the same as the Full column.

[Griogre]

It looks pretty good. I'm pretty sure a demo hosted by a demo/free license doesn't save campaign info. And I'm not sure on the Standard hosting a demo but I don't think that saves campaign data either.

I'm not exactly sure what you consider 4E community content. But to use the 4E data parser you will need to get at lease a month's subscription to DDI.

[Trenloe]

Maybe change "Connect to Game as a Player" to "Host Game for Demo Users: No/No/Yes"? Or something to that effect.
I think "Host Game for Demo Users" should be added as another entry.


I'm pretty sure a demo hosted by a demo/free license doesn't save campaign info.
Correct.


And I'm not sure on the Standard hosting a demo but I don't think that saves campaign data either.
A full hosting a single demo/free licence does save campaign info.

Additionally:

Create Character (by ruleset) should be Yes/Yes/Yes You can use Manage Characters with a demo/free licence and the character data will be saved.

D&D 3.5 OGL Libraries (SRD) change this to "D&D 3.5 OGL Libraries (SRD subset)" - the whole d20 SRD isn't included.

Pathfinder OGL Libraries (PFSRD) change this to "Pathfinder OGL Libraries (PRD subset)" - the whole Pathfinder SRD isn't included.

Another entry regarding using Community content (community rulesets and extensions) might be cool.

[LordEntrails]

Ok, made some changes to the table above. By Community Content, I meant the various extensions, modules etc that have been made available for free on either the forums or the wiki. Did we want more detail than what I list?

Changes:
- Added a row for Host game for Demo/Free Users per Trenloe's suggestion.
- Changed SRD references as detailed by Trenloe
- Added line for 4E Data Parsing, might need better title

Questions;
- So a Full/Standard host can have 1 demo player connect?

Not sure I like the 4E Data Parser line as this is (I think) a community extension, right?

We will also need to explain the difference between the 5E Ruleset and the 5E Basic Rules.

[TASagent]

Is it technically violating Wizard's ToS for users to scrape the compendium database? Should that really be on a semi-official features list?

[Nylanfs]

Doug made this page (https://fantasygrounds.com/buyfg/) shortly after FG went on steam it's the page you get when you select "features" the table at the bottom of the sheet is basically what you are trying to re-create.

[LordEntrails]

Links broken.

Note, there is already this one; https://www.fantasygrounds.com/buyFG/#licensecomparison
But it doesn't have the detail of the one in this thread.

[damned]

Is it technically violating Wizard's ToS for users to scrape the compendium database? Should that really be on a semi-official features list?

copyright law pretty much allows you to copy/convert material you own for your own personal use.

[TASagent]

Yeah, it's absolutely true that you can make a copy for personal use. I think WotC would still technically be within their rights to limit, in their terms of service, the ability of users to automatically extract all the contents of their database. If they chose not to, fantastic!

[Nylanfs]

AFAIK, very few ToS statements have held up in court.

[TASagent]

That may be true, but my main concern was the possible violation of good will affecting current and potentially future licensing deals between Smiteworks and WotC, if in fact they had stated they are opposed to scraping, which I wasn't sure if they had.

[etropic]

Steam summer sale.... Go go go !

[kleinksw]

Look no further than the Fantasy Grounds store for great 5e (and more) sale items! Of course, there's Steam too for your FG fix. ;)

[mysticknight232]

If you purchase something through Steam (i'm looking at the 4 pack of Basic Licenses currently on sale), will any future purchases through the FG store (instead of through Steam) be compatible? I just want to cover all my bases here.

Also, this has been a great thread, thanks to everybody that has continued to post questions here!

Also, to answer an earlier question, the reason why I posted the thread to begin with is because the general description on FG store about the different licenses did not fully explain things to me. Usually the first place I turn to for direct support is the forums. I did some browsing but didn't find anything specific to my question immediately so I posted to the forums hoping to get a fast response which I did. I did not check the Wiki's.

I also think the chart that was posted on this thread seems easier to follow than the comparison chart on FG web page. I also understand that Smiteworks is a small Company and I am totally on board with everything they've done...they cannot make everything perfect and I agree with the post about them leaning on the community to help people like me with my simpler questions as I'm starting out. I think this has been a good example of the forum community working as intended.

Cheers!

[Trenloe]

If you purchase something through Steam (i'm looking at the 4 pack of Basic Licenses currently on sale), will any future purchases through the FG store (instead of through Steam) be compatible? I just want to cover all my bases here.
Yes, they are exactly the same products - just different ways of purchasing/downloading them.

Note: if you are running (or plan on running) FG on a Mac then you should purchase any DLC from the FG store not from Steam (the Steam DLC update currently doesn't work on a Mac). Purchasing the base FG for a Mac on Steam is fine, that works well.

[mysticknight232]

Thanks...I've got a PC so no worries about Mac issues from me.

Perfect, then I think my buddies and I have finally settled on things. Since a couple of us want the option to run a game, we will likely buy the 4-pack from Steam along with some of the other D&D stuff on sale there and away we go! W00t!

[Trenloe]

Might be worth changing:

Host Games for Demo/Free Users No 1 Demo User Only Yes

To:

Host Games for Demo/Free Users No 1 Demo User Only (no full licenses can connect when in this demo mode). Yes

There's usually confusion that this full licence 1 demo user mode also allow full players to connect. Whereas you could construe this from "1 demo user only" I think adding some more text to make it 100% clear would be useful.

[LordEntrails]

Trenloe, I did not know that w/ a full license a demo user could not connect along with other full licenses. I will update the spreadsheet. Let me know if it makes more sense after the change.

[Trenloe]

Let me know if it makes more sense after the change.
Looks good. :)

[Notker deStammerer]

This is EXACTLY the information that I've been looking to find for my potential group. Thankfully Google popped it up first under my search. This definitely needs to be a Sticky on The Tavern as it explains a great deal. Thanks for all the info!

[Shawn720]

Core class pack - can I print character sheets from it?

Nothing in product description and can't find answer. Thanks

[Zacchaeus]

Hi Hrafodr welcome to FG.

No you can't print character sheets from within FG. There is a website utility which takes the XML and prints the character sheet from that.
https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?22440-5E-Character-sheet-from-XML

[Niles]

Disregard. Meant to reply further up the post.

[Niles]

The benefit of a full license is that they could DM. The free demo will only be able to connect to someone with an ultimate license, but they won't be able to DM in the future.