v3.0.X Errors in 3.5E

[Hecklerus Prime]

I'm creating this post to serve as a list of 3.5e errors with the new (v3.0.X) updates so that the developers may see what the average user is experiencing. These may be issues that appear in other editions, but my players and myself only use 3.5e and so I assume these issues are exclusive to that ruleset. Some may be bugs and some may be that the interface has changed and we no longer know how to do something properly. In either case, these are things that are diminishing our enjoyment and experiences using this system. We will strive to make sure this thread is free of opinions and sticks to legitimate errors. If any others post, please state the version you are using. Thanks!

As of this posting, the current release is 3.0.1 and the following errors are present.


When a Heading is present in a story file, bullet points fail to react normally. They become double spaced and the arrow keys no longer navigate upwards through the list. Pressing the up arrow key always send the cursor to the bottom of the list. These effect disappear when the Heading is removed. Confirmed on multiple campaign files, multiple machines, and multiple license keys (full x1 & lite x2). [moon_wizard is aware of this]
No bullet list can contain underlines, italics, or bold formatting, regardless of heading. [moon_wizard is aware of this]
When editing a story file clicking in and out of the file will result in random jumps and highlights in that story. For example, looking at the end of the file, clicking onto an NPC to drag onto a link, and dropping into the story sometimes results in the link not being added and the story jumping to the top. Also happens when opening link or just clicking. Seemingly random event.
Clicking on a parcel for an opened module results in all items being replaced with <New Item>. Can be resolved by right clicking on the parcel in the Parcels window and selecting Revert Changes. Very annoying when trying to add parcels.
Several players report randomly being unable to make edits to character sheets. Often resolved by DM restarting FG. No triggers or patterns have yet been identified as the cause.
Some modules made in previous versions no longer contain the correct links. For example, Story A originally contained link to Story B, but post update now contains link to Story C. No instance of such errors have yet been found relating to NPCs, Images, or Items; only Story files. Possible this is a conversion error due to the update.
When exporting a module, using ".\Image Folder\Image Name.filetype" (ex: .\Module Covers\My Campaign.jpg) no longer seems to work as a way of linking a cover to the module. Unsure if this is intentional or accidental. Addition of file search link button is pleasant workaround, however.
Tokens no longer exported with a module. Method used: create campaign file. Within campaign file create folder "tokens" to store token images. Assign tokens to NPCs. Export module. When the module is opened later in another campaign, there are no tokens, neither in a module bag or attached to the NPCs. Possible this is done differently in new system.

[Moon Wizard]

Thanks for the list. It will take me a bit to check out each one.

Also, any details/steps you can provide on how to recreate them would speed things up. I may need example modules as well, if the problems are not recreatable using exported modules (for the module specific issues).

Thanks,
JPG

[Hecklerus Prime]

Version v3.0.1

In "Manage Characters" mode for 3.5E the dice rolling function is erratic. When rolling X sets of Y dice no numbers appear in the window approximately half of the time. The green check mark token still appears as though a roll is recorded, but no number are logged. However, the green check token appears on random lines, most often the last. When multiple green check tokens are present, clicking to remove one causes the others to randomly shift between alternating lines. No apparent connection to number or type of dice used.




When editing a story file clicking in and out of the file will result in random jumps and highlights in that story. For example, looking at the end of the file, clicking onto an NPC to drag onto a link, and dropping into the story sometimes results in the link not being added and the story jumping to the top. Also happens when opening link or just clicking. Seemingly random event.


Update: Potential cause identified. Errors only appear when the story is in Edit mode and a cursor has been placed somewhere in the page.



Tokens no longer exported with a module. Method used: create campaign file. Within campaign file create folder "tokens" to store token images. Assign tokens to NPCs. Export module. When the module is opened later in another campaign, there are no tokens, neither in a module bag or attached to the NPCs. Possible this is done differently in new system.


Update: Error occurs with old modules as well. Open an old module's campaign file, make any changes, and re-export. Upon opening the newly re-exported module the tokens will all have disappeared.

[Trenloe]

Update: Error occurs with old modules as well. Open an old module's campaign file, make any changes, and re-export. Upon opening the newly re-exported module the tokens will all have disappeared.
It looks like FG has gone back to working the way it used to for exporting tokens - you need to drag each token you want to export with the module into the "exported token" pane at the bottom of the export window. I don't know if this was a deliberate design decision or not.

Another way to do this is to make token only modules and if these are NPC tokensn use the tokens from these modules in your campaign before you export - assigning the tokens from a module to an NPC will add the module reference for the token and so allow you to access tokens in other modules.

Or, if you just have a set of miscellaneous tokens you use on maps etc., perhaps making a token module just for the tokens would be a way of allowing you to use the tokens in different campaigns.

[dulux-oz]

Hi Guys,

Got a new one (I think) for you.

FG3.0.1, 3.5E D&D, Windows 7 Pro

When clicking on the Clear Player Cache Button on the Join Mode of the Launcher, getting an error stating:

Error during recursive delete
Directory: C:/Users/TestUser/AppData/Roaming/Fantasy Grounds II//cache
Error: (145) The directory is not empty.
Note the double slash.

After acknowledging the error when you click on the Button again all is well.

Have reproduced this scenario multiply times. Using Windows Explorer the cache and its files, etc, appear OK.

Also, a couple of "Niggles":

1) On a Windows 8.1 machine on a Domain with Roaming User Accounts when you start to install FG Windows asks for an Administrator's Credentials - this is normal. HOWEVER, it is the Administrator's account that the FG Data Directory is placed under, not the actual user using the PC. If you know its there you can catch it when the FG Installer displays the Settings Window, but if you don't notice it then FG will never be able to be run for the normal user.

Something to fix, I think :)

2) [And this may be related to the first] Under Win8.1 FG does not put an icon on the Taskbar, the Start Screen nor the Desktop. Its easy enough to go into File Explorer and Pin the FG Executable to the Start Screen (or whereever) but it would be nice if the Installer did it automatically.

Just my $0.10 worth (inflation) :)

[Moon Wizard]

On the first item you mentioned, I don't see that on my machine. Can you give me the full value of the path in your Settings for the data directory? How did you set the value in the Settings? (previous installation, set by installer, ...)

On the 2 items you mentioned on the bottom, I believe that they are tied to the fact that the actual "user" running the updater is the admin account. Fantasy Grounds uses the Windows calls for the OS to get the Start Menu, Program Files, Desktop and App Data directories.

The only other option is to install everything to the the "Common" versions of those directories; which means that everything would be stored in "C:\ProgramData\Fantasy Grounds II", instead of "C:\Users\<User>\AppData\Roaming\Fantasy Grounds II". I'm not sure of what the repercussions would be of having items stored here instead, so I'm hesitant to change in the short term. Also, you technically lose the Windows roaming data files capability, not that I'm aware of people that use it.

Regards,
JPG

[Moon Wizard]

Hecklerus,

Working on your items above, and I had a question about the module cover export. I'm not aware of any capability like this. The module cover shown in the module list has always been a thumbnail.png file, as far as I am aware. Theoretically, since images are stored in the base directory of the module; if you had an image named thumbnail.png, it would be shown as the cover.

Regards,
JPG

[dulux-oz]

Hi JP,

On the last two items, as I said, they're niggles more than real problems - let's face it, how many people run a full Win2012/Win8.1 Active Directory Domain from home and then run FG on that network - and you're right, don't change things if you're not sure how they may break other things.

I went back through my Log files after reading your reply and found out that, on the first item, I did not give the full details. I was running both a Host instance and a Client instance of FG at the same time on the same machine. After successfully using both the host and the client I shut down the client and returned the host to the launcher, then clicked on the Clear Player Cache Button. To answer your questions:

1) C:/Users/TestUser/AppData/Roaming/Fantasy Grounds II
2) Via Installer on fresh install.
3) TestUser has Admin Rights.

Don't bust a gut over it - as I said, you've only got to go through clicking the Button twice to clear things up.

Cheers

[Moon Wizard]

Hecklerus,

Additionally, I'm having trouble recreating the mixed up story links on export. Can I get a copy of the campaign folder that you use to export to the module (ZIP)? Also, can I get the details you enter into the Export window when exporting? (a picture is fine.)

Thanks,
JPG

[Hecklerus Prime]

I had a question about the module cover export. I'm not aware of any capability like this.


Interesting. It seems that I was using a method that was long forgotten and the code only just now changed. A perfect example of the method I'm using is shown in Xorne's tutorial video "3.5 Adventure Module Creation (https://www.fantasygrounds.com/filelibrary/tutorial/xorne-adventure-1a.wmv)" done way back on v2.1.1 (wow!). The method is shown at 20:28 into the video. The functionality still worked up until the 3.X updates, but no longer functions. Note that jpg worked in addition to png. I would also like to point out that shortly after he explains how to add a cover he covers how to export tokens. This method, nor any other method I have tried (such as the one Trenloe provided earlier in this thread), allows for tokens to be exported. I only repeat the token issue here so that you can see the method I am using.

A thought on the module cover method. Is it perhaps that all of my files are in a folder named "Fantasy Grounds II" and that the program is now looking for one simply called "Fantasy Grounds"? I know that the "II" was officially dropped, but I'm not sure if that changed the default directory folder when installing FG or not. Just an idea.



Additionally, I'm having trouble recreating the mixed up story links on export. Can I get a copy of the campaign folder that you use to export to the module (ZIP)? Also, can I get the details you enter into the Export window when exporting? (a picture is fine.)


I am as well. I believe this perhaps was an error that appeared once I switched to the v2.9.4 temp rollback and then back to v3.0.1. Either that or perhaps I just linked a ton of stories incorrectly. The campaign module that I first noticed it in has since been fixed, but I'll send the file below anyway. Attached to this post is an image of the export screen for that same module.

[Moon Wizard]

The campaign tokens export is addressed in the test version for v3.0.2 that I pushed today.

The default folder created by the installer is now "Fantasy Grounds". However, previous installs will continue to use whatever is set in the FG Settings when installed for best compatibility.

On the module thumbnails, I just tested with both a PNG file and a JPG file selected through the file chooser, and the covers worked fine. Are you saying that the relative path "./modules/cover.png" is not working as a string in the field, and that's the issue?

Cheers,
JPG

[Hecklerus Prime]

Fantastic! I must say, I am really impressed with how rapidly you can churn out fixes. Well done, Sir. Please...never ever stop working FG!



Are you saying that the relative path "./modules/cover.png" is not working as a string in the field, and that's the issue?


Yes, but like I said the file chooser is a functional workaround. I'm just used to writing the filepath rather than choosing, but that's more of an issue with my preference than the software. This probably isn't even something that's important enough for you to focus on right now.

[Hecklerus Prime]

New quirks from latest session played. I was running the 3.0.2 test release (prior to today's full roll-out), but my players were all on v3.0.1


Locking drawing layer does not work on images. Even though I locked the layer, my players could still make drawings.
NPC characters have long load times when dropped into CT. Spellcaster have considerably longer times. Potentially tied to spell list (?)
Table results can no longer be hidden from players. We use several random generation tables that should not be seen by players, and the removed function basically breaks the tables.
Attacks, effects applied, and spells cast by hidden NPCs are visible to players in chat window. A hidden mage attempting to sneak up on the party is not so surprising when everyone can see she cast "Mage Armor" on herself. Womp. I am aware there are rules to turn off all NPC roll visibility, bit it seems an NPC the GM has elected to remain hidden should have everything hidden, not just her token.
NPCs cannot apply effects to themselves by changing target to "self". [Attempts to recreate have failed since official 3.0.2 rollout]
NPC spells cast do not automatically make target roll saves [Attempts to recreate have failed since official 3.0.2 rollout]
Copy and paste bullet items in story page adds two blank bullets after paste

Many of the other things we found are listed as having been fixed in the new release. I must once more tip my hat to MoonWizard and his prompt remedies to our issues.

[Trenloe]

Your players should be on the same version as you. As they will have the correct ruleset locally (3.5e) they will be using that at version 3.0.1 and will not download the 3.0.2 ruleset from you. So, some of the issues that are listed in your post have been fixed in 3.0.2 but you wouldn't have seen the fix as the players were all running their local copy of 3.0.1. At least that is how I believe it will work, but I'm not in a position to test. Anyway, the golden rule is everyone should be on the same version as the GM.

For the long load time for NPCs with spells this is indeed because of the spell list. In FG 3 the whole NPC is copied to the combat tracker entry where previously it was just a link.

[Moon Wizard]

Hecklerus,

* Found the drawing layer lock issue. Will be in next patch release.
* NPC load times will increase depending on the number of spells. This may be more noticeable, since NPCs in combat tracker are now full NPC records. This will help for spellcasting NPCs, since their spells are now tracked separately.
* Table rolls respect GM visibility. Can you use dice tower to work around?
* In v3.0.2, if an NPC is hidden, any rolls or effect applications which do not also include a PC are hidden as well. Can you check again?
* Self spell application works on NPCs for me in v3.0.2.
* Spell cast actions generate saves for me in v3.0.2.
* I can't recreate the blank bullets. I tried copying to/from formatted text fields and to/from regular string fields. Can you walk me through steps to recreate?

Regards,
JPG

[Hecklerus Prime]

* Table rolls respect GM visibility. Can you use dice tower to work around?


For manual rolled tables, yes. But some of my tables, such as a custom critical/fumble table, use several additional built-in sub-tables that roll automatically. The automatic rolls cannot be dropped in the tower. I supposed I will turn of GM visible rolls for now.



* I can't recreate the blank bullets. I tried copying to/from formatted text fields and to/from regular string fields. Can you walk me through steps to recreate?


Here's what I've done to recreate the issue. Create a Story item. Make the first line a bullet and type something (ie: Line 1). Press Enter and type a new line (ie: Line 2). Repeat multiple times. Press Enter and change from bullet to anything else, such as Heading or Body Text. Type something. Highlight bullet lists, go to last bullet, press Enter, and Paste. One or two blank lines should appear after pasted text.

During my testing, I also discovered that the additional lines appear no matter what type of paragraph style you're pasting in to (body text, heading, list, etc.).

[Nickademus]

I supposed I will turn of GM visible rolls for now.

I haven't played with the tables that much, but if they use your current character/NPC as the actor for the rolls there may be a way around this for now.

Assuming it is so, make an NPC named GM (or whatever). Add it to the combat tracker and keep it invisible. Select the GM NPC before rolling on the table and FG should hide all the rolls. Just don't target a PC with him.

[Moon Wizard]

So, if cascading table rolls had the same visibility, that would work? Or are you saying that different tables in the cascading chain have different visibilities?

Thanks for the steps on the bullets.

JPG

[Hecklerus Prime]

@Nickademus: That would certainly work to the end that I would maintain Tower functionality instead of hiding all GM rolls. It still does nothing for the automatic tables. Still, an improvement nonetheless. Thanks for the suggestion. I'll try it out next session.

@ Moon Wizard: Cascading tables sharing the same visibility as the first table would be optimum for my current setup. But I don't see how you could set it up to make one table's visibility dependent on another. It seems to do that you'd have to write the initial table to have variable visibility while simultaneously copying said visibility to all subsequent tables. What would you do if the same sub-table is called from two or more different initial tables? For example, I have three random encounter initial tables that all end up using the same sub tables (of course, the point is moot as all of those should be invisible so as to avoid ruining the encounter setting). I would think it would be easier to make all tables have independent visibility and leave it to the GM to decide which are visible or not. Similar to the old system. But what do I know? I'm the playtesting fighter to your programming sorcerer supreme; I show up and take a few blows while the hard stuff is up to you. Huzzah!

[Moon Wizard]

The concept would be that the cascading rolls would use the same visibility as the initiating roll.
* If attack roll, critical/fumble rolls would share attack roll visibility.
* For all other tables, the visibility of the first roll would determine (i.e. tower drop, GM rolls visibility option, etc.)

JPG

[Nickademus]

Heckerlus, may I ask how you are nesting table so that they automatically roll? Just now playing with tables and I don't see this functionality.

[Moon Wizard]

It's sort of hidden. Put another table name in brackets as a result, and it will roll on that table next.

Also, another somewhat hidden feature recently added is the fact that links can be dropped on table entries.

Regards,
JPG

[Nickademus]

I figured out the drag-n-drop links. I actually thought that was the way it was supposed to be done. Thank you for the info. I will try some nesting.

You know what would be awesome now? If the table entry could execute slash commands. So if I put "/die 5d10" in the first column and "gp" in the second it would automatically roll how much gold to award. The chat would have the information split up, but it is still better than having to manually roll such things. (Rolling is so passe.)

[gmkieran]

We just ran into a problem that I thought I remembered seeing early today, but can't find, now. Running 3.5 - entire group just updated to 3.0.2 prior to playing tonight. The NPC files for our final combat of the game appear to have been wiped completely from the DM's module (I'm not running the campaign). We had stopped mid-combat during our last session, so the NPCs had been populated to the combat tracker. Upon picking up combat where we left off, the DM discovered that none of the NPCs stats remained and he could not refresh their records from the story module. Anyone else seen this or anything like it?

Something else happened later - we noticed that the fighter's critical hits (hammer - bludgeoning damage) were tripling the bonus, not just the rolled damage (ie +18 became +54). Is that correct for 3.5, non-pathfinder?

Cheers!
GMK

[Moon Wizard]

The critical multiplier code has not changed, but I believe that the tripling of the modifiers is correct.
One source:
https://rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/18282/what-modifiers-are-and-are-not-included-in-a-dnd-3-5e-critical-hit

Are you saying that the NPCs in the combat tracker were missing the stats? Or the NPCs in the campaign list were missing stats? Could the GM re-add from the campaign list to the combat tracker? I'm trying to figure out where the issue is. I'm assuming it is one-time migration issue right now, but still something I'd like to fix.

Thanks,
JPG

[gmkieran]

Thanks for the clarification on the crits! Apparently we've gotten too used to 4e. ;) The NPCs stats were gone in both places and the GM was not able to re-add from the campaign list to the combat tracker. I can ask him for more details if you need them (I don't think he frequents the forums).

Cheers!
GMK

[Moon Wizard]

That's bizarre. Can you have him send me the newest db.script.*.xml files from his campaign directory? This should be the data before the last internal data migration.

The strange thing is that the campaign NPC data has never been changed, so the campaign NPCs should be untouched. What I expected was that there might have been an issue in the combat tracker migration, since they changed from partial NPC records with links to full records to full NPC records right in the combat tracker.

Regards,
JPG

[gmkieran]

I'll check with him on the .xml files, but you may be right about the combat tracker being the issue. This is his description of how the data went away, "what happened was that the 2 NPC's that I had built in the NPC tab, one was hidden and one not, lost all the data that had been in the combat tracker. I clicked on the character sheet and it was populated with data. I deleted it from the combat tracker to reload it with the data and then when I went to reapply it, all the data from both NPC's sheets had been wiped. I checked other NPCs in other sheets and those were fine. The NPC (melon) was unaffected since it was from the Monster Manual." So, the issue occurred only when the NPCs were removed from the combat tracker (it was actually 1 NPC with 2 forms and 2 sets of stats, thus the need to remove one record from the CT and add the other multiple times over the course of combat; dratted shape shifters! ;) )

Thanks!
GMK

[Hecklerus Prime]

v3.0.2 - Another player is running as DM, all players running same version. Numerous issues. Tried to have DM uninstall and reload FG. Issues persist. DM upgraded from Lite to Full version earlier this year.

For some reason, characters never remember who the owner is, even when we log in as the same name. Character does not appear as select-able option until DM releases. Dice colors are not remembered.
Characters cannot select portraits. If DM selects portrait for players, the DM can see portrait. If player then selects a portrait, the DM sees nothing (previous image disappears)
DM shared images/story/NPCs/drawings on images/etc. are forgotten at each game load. Players can no longer see shared items, regardless of /save command use
Player created Notes are likewise erased at each game load, regardless of /save command use
Players cannot see DM campaign in Manage Characters area
Campaign never remembers what modules are open/closed or settings (force load, share, restrict)
Players images for portrait selection differ from DM options. May be normal as we all have different images in our portraits folders.
Players cannot see shared tokens.
Chat log does not record when other users join game - works fine when DM only

Only things of note that we can find:

DM does not have a Fantasy Grounds folder where the rest of us do (User > AppData > Roaming > Fantasy Ground II)
Attempts to export campaign as module always fail

[Griogre]

I wonder if he put the data in someplace like Program Files where the program doesn't have the rights to change data. I would suggest he try putting the data directory in My Documents, copy over the data into the new directory and then go into Setup and change the path of the data directory to where he put the folder in My Documents.. I'm assuming a Windows installation.

[Trenloe]

I wonder if he put the data in someplace like Program Files where the program doesn't have the rights to change data. I would suggest he try putting the data directory in My Documents, copy over the data into the new directory and then go into Setup and change the path of the data directory to where he put the folder in My Documents.. I'm assuming a Windows installation.
Yeah, sounds like it.

Ask the GM to start Fantasy Grounds as Administrator: right-click on the startup icon and select "Run as Administrator" - this should give write rights to the FG data directory.

If this doesn't work, a quick way to check where the data is residing is ask the GM to click the folder icon "Open Data Folder" above the version number and see where this opens up - is there any data there, where is it?