Anybody willing to play a trial game with a new player?...and other questions

[redeem4]

Well as the title suggests, I have never played a tabletop game before and would like to play something...it doesn't matter what particularly, but I would say Pathfinder because that seems to be one of the more popular choices to go with and maybe closer to what I played with in Baldur's Gate and what have you. I should also note that I am using the free mode currently of this program...well that will change depending on how some games go though :D

My other question is about how the heck do you go about getting into games on this website haha. I mean, I would assume this to be the best place to go to get into games with the program, yes? I have gone to the game calender and tried to join games and even after a week I still get no replies or anything, so does getting into games just take a long time or something?

[JohnD]

You will want to find the name of the GM for the games you are trying to join and send a PM as well.

You should also look at the last activity date on the campaign you are trying to join. Many have been abandoned for months/years. There seems to be no way for the admin(s) to remove these listings - so you could be trying to join a game that's been dead for 2 or more years. :/

Look at recruiting threads posted by DMs looking for players. Most DMs in my experience don't go looking for additional players until they have a spot open. So... you find a post that interests you, make an entry in the thread and send the DM a PM as well.

Good luck! :)

[redeem4]

You will want to find the name of the GM for the games you are trying to join and send a PM as well.

You should also look at the last activity date on the campaign you are trying to join. Many have been abandoned for months/years. There seems to be no way for the admin(s) to remove these listings - so you could be trying to join a game that's been dead for 2 or more years. :/

Look at recruiting threads posted by DMs looking for players. Most DMs in my experience don't go looking for additional players until they have a spot open. So... you find a post that interests you, make an entry in the thread and send the DM a PM as well.

Good luck! :)

kinda why I posted in this thread because I thought this might be how you get invited to games and btw, the game calender still only has like 2 games that GMs are even active it seems...are games usually this hard to come by?

[Mgrancey]

More an issue of timing and such, there have been periods of activity and periods where its quiet. Additionally, games can get posted in different areas, some get posted in both. The Guild house thread is one spot, but people will also post in the ruleset threads as well. Pathfinder Society is a good way to try out a system and get a feel for the game, but we're kinda short on GMs.

There is also a limit on people willing to run, depending on what you want to play d20 systems have numerous other competitors and other programs or setups work better for indie RPGs. Keep an eye out, you can also say that your looking to join but if so, state your license, availability and time zone so that games that clash don't waste time offering when you can't make it.

[Mgrancey]

Oh, the other thing to take into consideration is that at the end of May is the 2nd FG convention, so a bunch of GMs are getting ready for that as well.

[redeem4]

Alright then, I will state my stuffs here then

My time zone is EST, I have a free license atm, and I can play pretty much anytime in the evenings on any day.

[JohnD]

One thing to realize is that there are a large number of games going on... you don't see everything in the GameCalendar page. If a DM lists their game as "private" or "not accepting players" it doesn't show up. I myself have three campaigns that aren't visible because I am full (21 different players).

DMs recruiting will make posts in the appropriate section(s). Posting letting people know you're looking to join a game is great; but you will want to make note of those DM recruiting posts... that's where you'll find most of your opporunities. There's enough extra "work" involved running a game without chasing after players, so a DM posts an opening and lets interested people approach on their own.

FG Con 2013 is, as has already been mentioned, coming soon... that may be taking away from current pick up games as DMs prepare. There may also be a bit of an ebb/flow to games based on the time of the year. Personally it always gets more difficult to make the time for a regular game come May-September simply because of vacations, school ending, summer, outdoor work, etc... so I go on hiatus. Others may do the same thing.

Keep looking and don't get discouraged. There are games out there and sooner or later you will find one. :)

[Macgreine]

I had requested floating liscense from the developers for this exact situation. It would be nice to invite someone to your table to learn the system without the $ commitment. You might want to try roll 20. Very active community and no expense to try a game or sit in for a session.

[redeem4]

I had requested floating liscense from the developers for this exact situation. It would be nice to invite someone to your table to learn the system without the $ commitment. You might want to try roll 20. Very active community and no expense to try a game or sit in for a session.

ah thank you for this. I just joined that website and its layed out much better than how this site is actually...I mean, how to find games and whatnot. It also seems to be much easier to get into a game too and that's really all I wanted to do and not have to jump through a bunch of hoops for weeks on end just to get into a single game, so I guess if/whenever I can get into a game on here then I can try out the program, but at least I will be able to learn the basics over there.

[GunnarGreybeard]

I would just add what a few of the others stated already. There are games but many are currently full and DM's generally only advertise when they need slots filled. Once they get a regular group they tend to drop off the radar for a while.

[JohnD]

ah thank you for this. I just joined that website and its layed out much better than how this site is actually...I mean, how to find games and whatnot. It also seems to be much easier to get into a game too and that's really all I wanted to do and not have to jump through a bunch of hoops for weeks on end just to get into a single game, so I guess if/whenever I can get into a game on here then I can try out the program, but at least I will be able to learn the basics over there.
It will help if you tell people which days/times you are available and what your time zone is.

I may have an opening. PM me for further details (no promises).

[redeem4]

It will help if you tell people which days/times you are available and what your time zone is.

I may have an opening. PM me for further details (no promises).

Actually I already did post about that information a few posts above this one already btw unless you mean to put it in my signature or something, but I think I'm fine for now since I did end up finding some quick games over on that other site to learn the basics which is good enough for me for now and by the time I come back here, there should be some games opened up hopefully.

[JohnD]

Good you found a game... enjoy! :)

Always a path to future FG success when people direct potential new users to other VTTs. :/

[Answulf]

Actually I already did post about that information a few posts above this one already btw unless you mean to put it in my signature or something, but I think I'm fine for now since I did end up finding some quick games over on that other site to learn the basics which is good enough for me for now and by the time I come back here, there should be some games opened up hopefully.

Yeah... I think Fantasy Grounds is a much better product, but there are 170,000+ users over there and maybe 2-4 LFG posts on a good day over here. :D

It can be tough to find games, especially pick-up games, here. I play the occasional pick up game with strangers over there and campaigns with friends here in Fantasy Grounds.

[Macgreine]

There is no doubt that FG2 is the best Vtt as far as functionality ( is that a word?). But for the new player it is as the OP stated a tangled bunch of hoops to jump through. Both in up front $ and connectivity and the receptivity of the community. I feel it may quickly become a dinosaur (if its not already) if it doesn't change and evolve with the times.

Like many of those who have stated "its not just good, its good enough" Fg2 will be the VTT that says " I remember when ___". You fill in the blanks.

[redeem4]

Yeah... I think Fantasy Grounds is a much better product, but there are 170,000+ users over there and maybe 2-4 LFG posts on a good day over here. :D

It can be tough to find games, especially pick-up games, here. I play the occasional pick up game with strangers over there and campaigns with friends here in Fantasy Grounds.

I would agree FG is the better product, but at least from my experience over a week it has been almost impossible to find a game and it seems the community isn't too active over here as compared to Roll 20.

I mean, when somebody here posted that I should go there, I literally found a game immediately and that was only a couple of days away which was perfect for what I wanted which was to learn and get into Tabletop gaming, period.

I actually just finished that tabletop game earlier today and I have to admit, while tabletop gaming is slow (at least from what I played) it is rather fun and it will probably be more fun the longer you play especially since the game I played was more or less a tutorial-like game before we got into the story.

And to reply to JohnD, this doesn't mean I entirely left FG, but now when I come back, I will no longer be completely clueless on how tabletop gaming works and it will probably be easier to find games on this site because of that.

[Macgreine]

Yes FG2 is the better "product" now but with the ever growing community base and community contribution Roll20 has, I would wonder what things will be like 6 months out from now. Time will tell.

[Mgrancey]

Its kinda a catch 22, a limited community and revenue means they can't use this as primary job, but simplifying and automation is a lot of work (especially if making it backwards compatible) which is where others get benefits.

When I was looking around most other VTTs provided basic functionality, only worked for 3.5/Pathfinder and 4e, or were focused on indie RPG. Nothing against them, but most are just specialized rules of a more general system [FATE, FUDGE, D20, etc] for a particular setting or effect and some are ridiculous or stupid [got a High School one as a free handout; why oh why High School was bad enough the first time no way I would want to play going through it again.

Lets face it Fantasy Grounds is probably one of the oldest VTTs out there, I remember ads for it years (in Dungeon and Dragon, which did pay off for me at least) ago before others;

[Answulf]

I have been using FG for almost eight years and I have mixed feelings about it these days.

On the one hand there have been multiple windows of opportunity for Fantasy Grounds to become a lot more successful than it is now. It's disappointing that none of those were capitalized on, because Fantasy Grounds has always been the best product on the market. Those windows may be permanently shut now if Roll20 continues to grow and succeed, which is sad for FG but good for the market as a whole. On the other hand, as long as FG still works and I'm having fun with it, I don't really care if it's a niche product - until another product is truly better. Selfishly, I have an ultimate license and am almost always the GM so I've never had trouble getting games going or recruting players from this site, other sites or in person.

[Trenloe]

Slightly off topic (not much though) - but of use to people on this thread. The FG Convention (31sy May - 2nd June.) website is now live. More info here: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18749

[Macgreine]

Good you found a game... enjoy! :)

Always a path to future FG success when people direct potential new users to other VTTs. :/

@john


I would have liked to invite him to the table for a session or something but why should I have to pay another $115 bucks to do that? I have already invested in both a license to play and a license to DM. Why should the financial burden to introduce new players and perspective customers fall to GM's who are already investing a lot in the community by preparing and running games?

I will admit that I am carrying a bit of a chip on my shoulder because I even offered to pay for an additional "floating" license so I could entertain new players and what would likely become perspective customers for FG2.

Anyway I wanted to help him find a place to plug in and have fun even if its not here. I hate seeing people come in to the forums wide eyed and bushy tailed wanting to plug in only to find they will grow old and die here waiting.

[JohnD]

Well I'm glad he found a game to join.

I can't answer your other questions, although, yes, you do come across as having a "chip" on your shoulder... directing potential new users away from FG is hardly going to strengthen the community and makes what you want probably an even less likely possibility IMO. Kind of cutting off your nose to spite your face if you will.

Regardless, what's done is done... and for other potential new players who come here and read this thread as well.

[Macgreine]

Well I'm glad he found a game to join.

I can't answer your other questions, although, yes, you do come across as having a "chip" on your shoulder... directing potential new users away from FG is hardly going to strengthen the community and makes what you want probably an even less likely possibility IMO. Kind of cutting off your nose to spite your face if you will.

Regardless, what's done is done... and for other potential new players who come here and read this thread as well.

Hey John,
I would like to share with you my original request for a floating license. Where I was quickly responded to by Grigore who I would assume is one of the developers. As you can see he told me to check out roll20 and map tool to initiate my friends into VTT D&D instead of FG2

https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18128

I only see what I did as following suit with what they thought I should do. Apologies if your offended or anything.

[Trenloe]

Where I was quickly responded to by Grigore who I would assume is one of the developers.
No, he's not a developer; but a very knowledgeable and active community member.

We'd all like to see Fantasy Grounds grow and prosper. But, if players can't find games here and do elsewhere then I don't see too much wrong with that... Hopefully they'll keep monitoring the forum here and find something that works for them soon... Or, perhaps this is an indication that something needs to change somewhere: be it the licensing model or additional licensing options, how games are organised within the community, more pick-up games, all of the above, and/or something else...

[damned]

i think that the vat majority of rpg-ers are not seriously looking for pickup games. most are looking for something longer term - half a dozen sessions and your are just getting warmed up. lack of free options does restrict pick up gamers - especially in this world where everyone wants pretty much everything for free...
far and away the larger portion of people who post first timer looking for a game messages that I have played an intro game with dont come back. pickup gamers tend to be more suite to other types of gaming... 15,000 roll20 users does not mean 15,000 users actually use the product...
there are no black and white answers here.
i generally believe that all things considered players who put some skin in game are more likely to play longer term. mind you in my current game only 1 of 5 players has a license - but then I recruited them elsewhere in a RPG group...

[Macgreine]

15,000 roll20 users does not mean 15,000 users actually use the product...


Its actually 170.000 currently and I agree just because they joined doesn't mean they actually are players/supporters, but it does show that a potential 170,000 people have interest in table top gaming. But even if its only 5 or 10% that do support/remain active its pretty significant.

[JohnD]

Yeah, I guess we can hopefully agree to disagree on some things. :)

I will say that in my experience "demo" users are more likely to pull a "one and done". In a PFS game, no big deal... in an ongoing campaign where you have regulars, well, that's a pain in the ***.

Something just jabbed me wrong about the referral... again, agree to disagree. :ninja:

I will say it is rare that a week goes by here that there isn't at least one recruiting players type thread... just a little patience is needed. One week probably is just one game session or maybe less for the average on-line group... it really isn't a long period of time.

Still, dude's got a game it seems... nothing wrong with that.

[Trenloe]

From the 2011 annual report there were over 23,000 licensed FG users (those who have bought a license): https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16028

It just goes to show that based on the above discussions in this thread, lots of registered users does not necessarily mean lots of games available to the general public/pick-up games. As has been said many times, lots of FG users will rarely visit these forums or advertise a game - they have their own group already sorted out and have no need for the community; or they'll visit, find a game and disappear off into the ether too as their requirements have been met.

That being said, it certainly does feel that at the moment there are less one-off games being advertised than I've seen in the past. Hopefully this is due to FG GM's having found a good group of players for a full on campaign ran in FG.

The FG Con at the end of this month will allow people to try FG/different rulesets. This is something that we hope to run more often - once we get the event website working to our liking.

[damned]

Hey Redeem4 - pop over to FG-con.com and have a look at games being hosted by Ultimate licenses. Hopefully you can find something that suits your availability.

[redeem4]

Yeah, I guess we can hopefully agree to disagree on some things. :)

I will say that in my experience "demo" users are more likely to pull a "one and done". In a PFS game, no big deal... in an ongoing campaign where you have regulars, well, that's a pain in the ***.

Something just jabbed me wrong about the referral... again, agree to disagree. :ninja:

I will say it is rare that a week goes by here that there isn't at least one recruiting players type thread... just a little patience is needed. One week probably is just one game session or maybe less for the average on-line group... it really isn't a long period of time.

Still, dude's got a game it seems... nothing wrong with that.

yes, a week usually isn't very long, but since I was new, I was wanting to try out a game asap just to see how I like it and after much frustration on these forums no less, I ended up finding a game on Roll20 within 5 minutes of joining and actually joined a couple others as well and that were literally a couple of days away, so that is much better imo than waiting a week or longer just to get into a game to see if I even enjoy tabletop gaming as much as I think I would (I do like it from what I've played so far :P)

And I would have to agree about there probably should be some sort of change to how the licensing works because it is pretty messed up that GMs would have to shell out a lot more money just to get new players to try out the software because in all reality its not even really needed for GMs to even do that since it is a lot more money on their part and it would already be costing them their time to setup things and trying to teach new players as well. Maybe make the demo version last 1 session or a certain amount of hours of gametime until you have to buy the lite/full liscene.

I mean, on the other hand with your competition for example, Roll20 lets you GM and be a player for free, so if your a new player, you can easily find a game because then you can join any game and also the way you find games is very well setup on that site. You even said it yourself that the game calender on FG is not updated very frequently or outdated and games on there could have happened ages ago and are no longer around and that people can't remove their own games or something as well, so that's why finding games on here is not as easy.

[Mgrancey]

I'm not sure if you downloaded and checked out the demo, but there is a significant difference between roll20 and FGII. d20Pro is more in line with the class of VTT that FGII is.

Watched GM demo vid for Roll20, it is pretty much just a shared screen, libraries, randomizers, and some extra functionality, FG covers so much more that they are entirely different classes of VTTs, if all I did was create maps, encounters, and handouts I could do stuff right away too. Personally, there is a lot more to RPGs than just battle, but then again I got started with Old World of Darkness and tracking locations in my head and sketched out on a white board. I prefer to play Savage Worlds the same with less specifics on inches and more on playing and plot.

The automation, character sheets, and all the extra stuff that makes FG what it is, is the hard part, that's why so few do it. Quite frankly, I'm not sure how long roll20 can/will last the way it does as (without looking at their books) depending on how many extras they sell it might or might not support the costs of running the site as most people tend to be completely cheap-skates. (Proven by a pay your own price package of indie computer games where most people paid less than a dollar and most of those only a penny or two.

[damned]

im glad you got a game - hope you enjoy it.

[Answulf]

I mean, on the other hand with your competition for example, Roll20 lets you GM and be a player for free...

I agree that Fantasy Grounds should probably be doing things differently, but keep in mind - there is a reason Roll20 is free and Fantasy Grounds is expensive. As Mcgrancey pointed out, Roll20 is very basic compared to Fantasy Grounds. Roll20 is like taking the bus, while Fantasy Grounds is more like carpooling with close friends in an Audi. It's going to be faster, easier and cheaper to get a ride on public transportation, but it's not the same experience.