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mattcolville
April 12th, 2013, 22:52
I love 4E and that's really what I use FG2 for. 4E is well adapted for VTT play.

But I cut my teeth on AD&D 1 and 2 and would like to go back to these occasionally. My one real sticking point is THAC0. All my players are in their 20s and used to modern games and while there's a lot to love about the different style of play the older editions use, I really, really, really don't want to have to teach them THAC0.

But! If there's a robust FG2 ruleset for it, then they wouldn't need to know their THAC0, they would just click on who they want to attack, roll, and FG2 tells them if they hit.

Does a ruleset like that exist?

sehmerus
April 13th, 2013, 02:21
Castles & crusades, is Basically 1eADND with thaco replaced with Bonus to hit, and AC inverted to be high=good , that sounds like what you would want to do. or you can take any 2e game and invert it yourself.. take thaco - 20 = your Bonus to hit, and take AC and - 20 to get thenew AC.. So if a fighter has Thaco of 18 and Ac of 5, his base attack would be +2 (20-18) and his Ac would be 15 (20-5)

opusaug
April 13th, 2013, 02:37
Can someone explain to me what the problem is with THAC0? The first few times I heard people complain about it, I thought they were joking. I guess in the intervening years since I stopped playing D&D, there was some kind of change to the rules to make it more complicated, but I never got the memo. Why do people hate it?

Answulf
April 13th, 2013, 03:01
THACO didn't become harder - modern AC rules became easier. One less step in calculating and a bit more intuitive.

mattcolville
April 13th, 2013, 04:02
I realize now I wasn't clear, I mean is there a FG2 ruleset for AD&D1 or 2? And does it support things like hit verification?

leozelig
April 13th, 2013, 04:18
I use OSRIC - it tells you what AC you hit when you roll. The targeting system isn't quite as robust as 3.5 or 4e. It is being updated though, so that might change.

If you are used to the more developed rulesets, OSRIC will seem very feature-lite, but it has everything you need to run an old school AD&D game.

opusaug
April 13th, 2013, 04:48
I realize now I wasn't clear, I mean is there a FG2 ruleset for AD&D1 or 2? And does it support things like hit verification?
Sorry Matt, the thac0squirrel distracted me. ;)

Like leo said, there's the OSRIC ruleset, but also one for AD&D 2e.

rule of three
April 13th, 2013, 07:43
You can use the osric ruleset but as leozelig said, it's an old ruleset, based on the pre-JPG dd3 ruleset. No targeting features or so. I'm currently working on an update to the osric ruleset. And you remind me that I've to send the "Ad&d1e" to someone ... It fixes good values to bonus and integrate Weapon vs AC bonus/malus.

sehmerus
April 13th, 2013, 12:54
The ADND2 ruleset has all the stuff osiric does (plus it has a player combat tracker) and the character sheets have spaces for the 2e rules like kits and weapon/non weapon proficiencies and they are all Auto roll verification whether its dropping "to hit rolls" on monsters, or grab and dropping saves and NWP it will even tell you if its a success or not, the only thing it DOESNT do is auto fill in the character sheet, you have to manually put in values of all the different things. wich i like because we use it for Basic D&D so i can house rule the way we use it.

sehmerus
April 13th, 2013, 12:55
the advantage to Osiric is that it does have a MOD library files for the spell lists and the monsters. thats a big thing to a new player.

rule of three
April 13th, 2013, 20:32
I've downloaded ad&d2 ruleset. It's robust but it hasn't all that features of osric ruleset. When I created osric ruleset I have one thing in mind : flexibility :)

Old Schoolers have tons of house rules and modifications done by years of practice. So, my scripts point to one and only one values reference : oldschoolreferences.lua.

Skills are also very flexibles : you can use d100, d20, d12, d6... add bonus or abilities, roll under or not, ...

And the one thing that was not easy to incorporated : the weapon vs Ac bonus and malus. I'm not very happy with my initial method but I haven't find time to change the interface since I've scripted it.

But, yes, OSRIC ruleset is old now and lacks some great features of the newer ruleset.

karaiv
September 22nd, 2015, 13:39
Hi mate,

which ADND2 ruleset are you referring to?

damned
September 22nd, 2015, 13:56
http://oberoten.dyndns.org/fgwiki/index.php/OSRIC

although it looks offline at this time...

karaiv
September 22nd, 2015, 14:12
http://oberoten.dyndns.org/fgwiki/index.php/OSRIC

although it looks offline at this time...

Thank you, mate.
Is this (http://www.fantasygrounds.com/wiki/index.php/Ruleset:_OSRIC) the same ruleset?

damned
September 23rd, 2015, 00:48
Yes that looks like it - sorry - I peeked in the Wiki and must have missed it.
The one in the Wiki is by rule_of_three the poster above.

krb243
November 10th, 2015, 19:14
the osric ruleset is fine, but we can't use it. too many times a player has accidentally changed the value of a skill because of the mouse wheel and there's no reset value. usually a ruleset has the option to use ctrl to stop this, but the osric ruleset doesn't. it's a shame b/c other than that the ruleset is awesome and osric would be our go-to game. instead, I use core and created a BFRPG ruleset that works great. it was just easier for me to create ascending AC value stat blocks than decending.

JohnD
November 10th, 2015, 19:30
Castles and Crusades. Give it a look see. If you want a tour let me know.

krb243
November 10th, 2015, 19:48
thanks john...not to hijack the thread, but are you ever going to run your campaign? I've got the trembles and need a fix ;)

JohnD
November 11th, 2015, 04:35
thanks john...not to hijack the thread, but are you ever going to run your campaign? I've got the trembles and need a fix ;)

I will drop you a PM.

damned
November 11th, 2015, 06:06
the osric ruleset is fine, but we can't use it. too many times a player has accidentally changed the value of a skill because of the mouse wheel and there's no reset value. usually a ruleset has the option to use ctrl to stop this, but the osric ruleset doesn't. it's a shame b/c other than that the ruleset is awesome and osric would be our go-to game. instead, I use core and created a BFRPG ruleset that works great. it was just easier for me to create ascending AC value stat blocks than decending.

is that the only thing you need fixed?
what fields need this changed?

krb243
November 11th, 2015, 13:30
see below

krb243
November 11th, 2015, 13:36
thanks for responding damned...on the skills tab, the base, ability, race, and misc fields can be accidentally changed with the mouse wheel. also, fields on the front page and weights on the inventory page. hopefully you can implement the CNTRL button to be used to effect any changes using the mouse wheel throughout the character sheet. thanks again for spending time on this.

damned
November 11th, 2015, 15:13
thanks for responding damned...on the skills tab, the base, ability, race, and misc fields can be accidentally changed with the mouse wheel. also, fields on the front page and weights on the inventory page. hopefully you can implement the CNTRL button to be used to effect any changes using the mouse wheel throughout the character sheet. thanks again for spending time on this.

Its not actually what you were after but I have disabled scroll adjustments on all these fields. There is no toggle on/off its just off.
This one is called Osric2.pak you will need to rename to use with a current campaign. If you do that I suggest you backup first as I dont know what it might do to your data...

https://www.dropbox.com/s/0cq0cp3l9bfjys1/Osric2.pak?dl=0

damned
November 11th, 2015, 21:11
Ive just modified it - to use the scroll wheel on these fields you should hold the SHIFT button while scrolling.

Trenloe
November 11th, 2015, 21:30
NOTE: The standard in most FG rulesets is to use the Control (CTRL) key to enable mouse-wheel adjusting of fields. I'd recommend sticking to that standard and not using the shift key, as that might lead to some confusion when using the ruleset.

damned
November 11th, 2015, 21:34
NOTE: The standard in most FG rulesets is to use the Control (CTRL) key to enable mouse-wheel adjusting of fields. I'd recommend sticking to that standard and not using the shift key, as that might lead to some confusion when using the ruleset.

I couldnt (quickly) see where/how to utilise the CTRL key.
There is a function isShiftPressed but no corresponding isCtrlPressed?

damned
November 11th, 2015, 21:37
I couldnt (quickly) see where/how to utilise the CTRL key.
There is a function isShiftPressed but no corresponding isCtrlPressed?

Thanks!
isControlPressed!!!!!

krb243
November 12th, 2015, 02:42
awesome, it works great!!! thanks damned :D

dmkevin
December 30th, 2015, 12:53
I'm going to give this a shot also.

Thanks for all your work on this!!

dmkevin
December 31st, 2015, 01:28
I installed the ruleset and the mods. The monsters one it appears is still being completed. I couldn't figure out how to get the mods to work and tried it a few times till it did. There were some demon entries, humanoid entries, etc., but when I clicked on these it said there was some problem with the data file.

Looks great so far!

Hawker73
October 10th, 2016, 02:48
Can someone explain to me what the problem is with THAC0? The first few times I heard people complain about it, I thought they were joking. I guess in the intervening years since I stopped playing D&D, there was some kind of change to the rules to make it more complicated, but I never got the memo. Why do people hate it?

Exactly 1E born and raised, would give anything to find a group using THAC0.......

damned
October 10th, 2016, 11:34
Being born and raised on 1e is all well and good but dont let that tie you to the archaic and senseless THAC0!
Every other improving Stat increases.... bah humbug!

Talyn
October 10th, 2016, 15:40
Being born and raised on 1e is all well and good but dont let that tie you to the archaic and senseless THAC0!
Every other improving Stat increases.... bah humbug!

See, I knew I there was a reason you are an OK guy! LOL ;)

Hawker73
October 15th, 2016, 06:06
Being born and raised on 1e is all well and good but dont let that tie you to the archaic and senseless THAC0!
Every other improving Stat increases.... bah humbug!

I won't....in fact I have to say I got the 5E PHB and a hardcopy, and have to say reading so far I think I like it better then 2E, and 3E (never played but I did check out rules) (never played 4E, or know much about it only heard bad stories)

But with that said that "Archaic" system is still tied to some of my best gaming experiences....no reason not to get some 1E games going or work on a ruleset......I think MANY old players would enjoy nostalgia, and many NEW players would enjoy the retro experience. If you don't understand why the Wizard and Knight wet themselves when a guy with a lute walks into the tavern you just don't understand old school D&D. ;)

damned
October 15th, 2016, 06:09
Castles & Crusades very much captures the 1e feel of D&D. Gary Gygax worked with the Trolls in his last years and did contribute to C&C. Barring the ascending AC it is very similar.

Hawker73
October 15th, 2016, 06:32
Now if only I can find a C&C game....

JohnD
October 16th, 2016, 07:02
Now if only I can find a C&C game....
Hey there. I may have room in a Thursday evening game, 7-10 PM Central. PM me if you're interested in hearing more.

GunnarGreybeard
October 17th, 2016, 10:47
But with that said that "Archaic" system is still tied to some of my best gaming experiences....no reason not to get some 1E games going or work on a ruleset......I think MANY old players would enjoy nostalgia, and many NEW players would enjoy the retro experience.
I agree wholeheartedly however, you would need to find a coder that loves and knows the AD&D system who also has the time to dedicate to create the ruleset and then be responsible for maintaining it with each revision of Fantasy Grounds to make sure nothing gets broken and fix it when anything does break. All that with the probably of no compensation.

Talyn
October 18th, 2016, 04:43
Probably of no real help since you'd still need a ruleset coded, but I hear Swords & Wizardry is essentially a re-worked 1st edition or something like that. I think the basic rules PDF is available free?

I bring it up because SmiteWorks does have a license agreement with Frog God, but for the Pathfinder versions of their products. If a S&W ruleset were available then S&W versions of their products could be in the Store to help post-ruleset funding for whomever codes them. But, you're still looking at needing the S&W ruleset coded to begin with, which is a monumental task in and of itself and would likely take a year or longer to get done.

Meanwhile a C&C ruleset is available right now, and maybe that will satisfy enough of the OSR urge?

vodokar
October 18th, 2016, 05:26
Probably of no real help since you'd still need a ruleset coded, but I hear Swords & Wizardry is essentially a re-worked 1st edition or something like that. I think the basic rules PDF is available free?

I bring it up because SmiteWorks does have a license agreement with Frog God, but for the Pathfinder versions of their products. If a S&W ruleset were available then S&W versions of their products could be in the Store to help post-ruleset funding for whomever codes them. But, you're still looking at needing the S&W ruleset coded to begin with, which is a monumental task in and of itself and would likely take a year or longer to get done.

Meanwhile a C&C ruleset is available right now, and maybe that will satisfy enough of the OSR urge?

Swords and Wizardry is an excellent game, but it isn't 1e, it is 0e. AC starts at 9 vice 10 for descending (or uses ascending). Single saving throw vice the 5 in 1e. Race as Class. +1 to -1 for stat modifiers vice +3 to -3 in 1e. etc. etc.

Nonetheless, if you use the Swords and Wizardy Complete version, it is as close to 1e as your going to get without it actually being 1e, because it is using every supplement for 0e that existed right up to the release of the AD&D Players Handbook.

damned
October 18th, 2016, 07:47
Swords and Wizardry is an excellent game, but it isn't 1e, it is 0e. AC starts at 9 vice 10 for descending (or uses ascending). Single saving throw vice the 5 in 1e. Race as Class. +1 to -1 for stat modifiers vice +3 to -3 in 1e. etc. etc.

Nonetheless, if you use the Swords and Wizardy Complete version, it is as close to 1e as your going to get without it actually being 1e, because it is using every supplement for 0e that existed right up to the release of the AD&D Players Handbook.

On most of these points (excepting AC of course) C&C is still the best match.
Similar (if not the same) core classes and races.
Similar XP progression.
Similar attributes and attribute bonuses.
Similar Saving Throws.

The big differences are: ascending AC and Siege Engine to replace all those tables and tables of skills etc.

JohnD
October 18th, 2016, 07:54
C&C is so low impact to run as a GM I frequently have 8+ players in my groups and it run smoothly.

Give it a try (you can't go wrong for just $10) before you sign yourself up for hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and hours of work that you might not even get anything out of.