Hand drawn / B&W maps for Fantasy Grounds?

[bennis1980]

Hi all,

Does anyone use scanned maps in their FG games?

I have tried producing maps using various software and I find anything I produce looks like a top down computer game. So I've started using this new method:

1. I hand drawn my map using a pencil/pen and a page (controversial) with clearly defined lines. I like sprawling cave systems and underground ancient ruins

2. Scan said map (B&W)

3. Import it into Adobe Illustrator (or other package)

4. Trace it using live trace (producing a lovely vector image)

5. (optional) Zoom into map to produce smaller maps for use in FG

6. Add colour using art package (minimal)


The maps are black and white (with the odd splash of colour, but not too much to keep the size below 500kb)

Let me know how you as a player would react to this kind of map, or generally what your expectations are when a map is produced by a GM.

Would a B&W map bore you?

Do you prefer digital maps?

Do you like minimist maps?

Do you ...etc?

Cheers
Bennis

[Trenloe]

I like all sorts of maps - have you got an example of what you've produced?

I've done anything from full on multi-colour maps to minimalist "old-school" maps - I use Profantasy's Campaign Cartographer for most of my maps (as I have no artistic skills at all). The old school addition is great for producing maps that look like maps from AD&D modules:

https://sub.profantasy.com/2007/december07.html

I'd like to see the results of your approach. :)

[Griogre]

Bennis I used hand drawn maps from time to time. Generally, my players don't care much about map appearances very much. Sure, they will oooh and awh for a second for a pretty map but once we start playing they don't care. I particularly favor hand drawn when doing caves because I find them hard to do quickly in must map creators if they don't have geomorphs. With FG I have found it best to not use graph paper and avoid the whole line up the grid problem, however, a very faint gritted graph paper which drop off in the scan can give you the best of both worlds.

My one bit of advice to you is instead of using black and white, which can look very stark, is gray scale then sepia the map. For fantasy maps, the tan gives it a parchment map "look" which can convey "adventure map" more than a black and white map does. In particular I like the Sepia IrfanView does as looking map like, though many art programs allow you to tweak the sepia shading color. Here's a couple of old "Map a Week" maps to show what I mean about sepia. With hand drawn maps I think the mood is set even more with sepia.

https://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m222/Griogre/001012Graveyard.jpg

https://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m222/Griogre/001012GraveyardSepia.png

Finally, I have to say that the possibilities of using a simple dark or light line on a background like Nestor did really seems like a great compromise of mood and function you can see his post here: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15713

Here's a sample map from the thread:
https://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c162/hmt321/NVEO/Dark_cavebm1.png

[bennis1980]

Oooh! Awh! They are really nice and easy beautifications of simple maps. That is exactly what i need, especially the sepia. Although I really like the second concept with the mood setting background (especially for battle maps), it doesn't facilitate the use of masks in a dungeon crawl (which is my favourite type of map, second to large scale).

It gives me some comfort knowing that in your experience, players do not expect fancy maps. It doesn't take away my longing for them though. I will certainly try the above methods to make them prettier (with the limited time we have on this planet :) )

Trenloe,
Any crawl maps I have currently (using my method) are scheduled for use in my up coming game ("the Hungry Hoards of Karuth") so I will show you once I've used them. I don't want any spoilers now, do I? :p

But I might have a more generic map handy to share in a bit.

[leozelig]

Hi all,

Does anyone use scanned maps in their FG games?

I have tried producing maps using various software and I find anything I produce looks like a top down computer game. So I've started using this new method:

1. I hand drawn my map using a pencil/pen and a page (controversial) with clearly defined lines. I like sprawling cave systems and underground ancient ruins

2. Scan said map (B&W)

3. Import it into Adobe Illustrator (or other package)

4. Trace it using live trace (producing a lovely vector image)

5. (optional) Zoom into map to produce smaller maps for use in FG

6. Add colour using art package (minimal)


The maps are black and white (with the odd splash of colour, but not too much to keep the size below 500kb)

Let me know how you as a player would react to this kind of map, or generally what your expectations are when a map is produced by a GM.

Would a B&W map bore you?

Do you prefer digital maps?

Do you like minimist maps?

Do you ...etc?

Cheers
Bennis

Bennis,

I mostly DM, but I love the hand drawn map style! The sepia is cool, both looked great to me. I have been grabbing textures and using an "oilify" effect to create a painted, almost impressionistic feel for my background.

I have also used a parchment texture for the background, with black lines and the occasional splash of color over that. The idea is to make it look like it was drawn with a quill and ink.

Basically, I want all my maps to look hand-made and not like a satellite image.

I have considered doing something more like what you do, and I would love to see an example. I am generally better on paper than I am with the mouse and digital drawing tools.

Leo

[bennis1980]

Leo,

I like your ideas. Oilify sounds great and would be nice with sepia to give a vellum parchment feel.

I will try to show some of my work tomorrow, though I may be tempted to apply some of the above methods for a comparison along side the original beforehand.

[Zeus]

Leo - Have you ever used a proper tablet like an Intuos or similar? I too used to be all thumbs with digital art software until I got my Intuos. I used to have to sketch my maps and then scan them in, re-ink (using a mouse) and color - a very tedious and laborious process.

Nowdays, I just draw directly on the tablet - much easier and faster. You can pick up an Intuos 3 these days for less than £100.

[bennis1980]

I have a bamboo graphics tablet which is great for touching up maps and adding some details. I also draw new maps quickly on a different layer if I want to create player handouts.

The only problem I find is you can't rotate your page around easily, which is essential for shading and other awkward sketching. Otherwise it is great using a tablet (x100 times better than using a mouse)

____


I would like to show some examples here but can anyone recommend a way of doing it (it won't let me upload them here, so I need to use some online picture storage)

[JohnD]

Personally I just use B/W maps unless I have an electronic source that is already in colour.

I'd rather spend my time DMing and playing instead of painstakingly drawing a map... hobby time is not always easy to schedule in my life.

I guess I'd prefer the nice colour and detailed ones, but usually I spend time looking and can't find 'exactly' what I'm looking for and end up drawing it on my own anyways.

[demonsbane]

The only problem I find is you can't rotate your page around easily, which is essential for shading and other awkward sketching. Otherwise it is great using a tablet (x100 times better than using a mouse)

Agreed in that rotating the canvas is very important. Good news is that actually, image rotation is software dependent:

Painter, Photoshop and likely ArtRage allow canvas rotation while painting, and perhaps GiMP has the same feature as well.

[Zeus]

I have a bamboo graphics tablet which is great for touching up maps and adding some details. I also draw new maps quickly on a different layer if I want to create player handouts.

The only problem I find is you can't rotate your page around easily, which is essential for shading and other awkward sketching. Otherwise it is great using a tablet (x100 times better than using a mouse)

I use Photoshop which allows you to rotate the canvas to allow for those awkward stroke requirements and/or shading etc.

____


I would like to show some examples here but can anyone recommend a way of doing it (it won't let me upload them here, so I need to use some online picture storage)

I use Flickr, you can then use the Share tab to grab the image url which can then be used with the forum post Insert Picture tool.

Alternatively you should be able to attach .JPGs to your post. In the additional options section under the post entry fields, look for Manage Attachments. Clicking the button will allow you to upload a .JPG image.

[bennis1980]

[COLOR="DarkRed"]

I use Photoshop which allows you to rotate the canvas to allow for those awkward stroke requirements and/or shading etc.



Thanks for that advice - very useful.

I wonder if it's the same shortcut command for adobe illustrator (most of the other PS commands i know work). I'm going to try that later - it'll be most useful.



That said, I love the smell and feel (and taste) of a physical paper map. Although I am a convert to all things digital, but I do feel guilty leaving my many A4, A3, A2 (and one such A0) hand drawn maps, neglected and sad in a portfolio case :cry:

[bennis1980]

Here are some examples of two maps I recently made using the above method.

The town map is full size, so since it's a vector image, I can zoom in to anywhere on the map before I throw it over to photoshop for touch up.

The mine entrance map is an example of one such zoom, and as you can see, there is no pixelation. I can create lots of hand drawn vector based maps this way.

My only concern is the blandness, but given time I will get over that, or improve my PS skills. :-)

(both maps treat as non-commercial creative commons)

[leozelig]

Leo - Have you ever used a proper tablet like an Intuos or similar? I too used to be all thumbs with digital art software until I got my Intuos. I used to have to sketch my maps and then scan them in, re-ink (using a mouse) and color - a very tedious and laborious process.

Nowdays, I just draw directly on the tablet - much easier and faster. You can pick up an Intuos 3 these days for less than £100.

What you describe is essentially what I am doing now. I have never tried a tablet, but it sounds like I should check it out!

Edit: Nice maps, bennis! Pay a visit to the cartographer's guild if you are looking to pick up a few tricks. :)