Planning a Harn Campaign. Interest? Ruleset?

[GomJabbar]

Hello Fantasy Grounders,

I would like to run a Harn campaign using Fantasy Grounds II. I have 2 primary questions.

1. Is there player interest in a Harn campaign? Does it depend on the ruleset? For those unfamiliar with Harn it is a low-magic, low-fantasy, low-wealth, highly-realistic setting that is extremely detailed with tons of material, though much of it is very old 1980's style and takes some searching to find. Less hack n' slash, more roleplay.

2. Which ruleset should I use? Options are;


a. 3.5E

Pros:

- Comes with FGII by default.
- Large player base.
- People are familiar with it. Especially those familiar with and heard of/like Harn (ie. the older crowd like me)
- I have the Shane Morales d20 Harn Guide for converting Harn to d20 which is similar enough to 3.5E to work.
- I have DMed 3.0 (a bit) and played 3.5 (a fair bit) before in pen & paper.

Cons:

- 3.5E is complicated. Requires lots of prep work. More difficult to run/DM.
- It is very high-fantasy, high-wealth, high-magic. Harn is low-fantasy, low-wealth, low-magic. The d20 Harn Guide helps a lot in this regard.
- 3.5 rulebooks are hard to come by if you don't already own them. Not available in PDF.

b. 4.0E

Pros:

- Comes with FGII by default.
- Large and growing player base.
- New people are familiar with it.
- The new and "exciting" D&D flavour.
- Rulebooks are currently available at bookstores. It looks like D&D Essentials would fit Harn nicely, on first glance.

Cons:

- I don't know and don't own any 4e stuff.
- 4e sounds as complicated as 3.5e.
- 4e sounds very high-fantasy, high-wealth, high-magic like 3.5e. Maybe even moreso. And the d20 Harn Guide would be less useful. I would have to come up with my own conversion doc.
- The younger crowd familiar with 4e will likely not have heard of Harn.

c. Castles & Crusades

Pros:

- Available for purchase for FGII (which I have already done).
- Simple. Means faster prep and easier to run.
- Feels old-school. Those familiar with Harn (old folks like me) would feel comfortable with C&C.
- Lower-magic than 3.5e and 4e by default (no paladin or ranger spells, smaller spell lists).
- Could be used as-is with minimal house rules or d20 Harn Guide-type changes for a Harn campaign (other than the money changes to create low-wealth).
- Easier to house rule than 3.5E or 4E.
- I have run pen & paper AD&D 1e and 2e and D&D 3e campaigns so C&C feels very easy to me.
- Rulebooks are easy to get online and available as PDFs.
- I have lots of old 1e and 2e material that I can convert to C&C easily.

Cons:

- Small player base.
- Not as much character variability/differentiation (ie. No feats, no skills, all fighters are basically the same).
- Would be a bit of work (not too bad) to create my own C&C Harn Guide. Could be fun though and would be gobbled up on C&C and Harn websites (though I would have to be careful with licenses).

I am currently leaning toward Castles & Crusades because it is simple, I don't have loads of prep time, it involves the least amount of tweaking/conversion/house rules for Harn, rules are readily available to players as PDFs and included in FGII ruleset modules. The only things that worry me are lack of variability and lack of player base (hence question 1).

Thanks for listening.
Brad (aka GomJabbar)

[Pard]

3.5e has an SRD. It's free and online. Just stick to SRD material and there will be no problem with the 3.5e.

I am game for any of the systems, but I do prefer 3.5e or 4e simply because I play both.

[lazarus0280]

I'd be interested in this. If you haven't already I'd get the d20_jpg on the download page. It's free and it is 3.5 with the bells and whistles. That would be my recommendation, or maybe take a peek at the Savage Worlds systems or Ars Magika system. Been running some low fighting heavy roleplay on both those systems and they seem to work very well. The Ars Magika system I think is free.... (not 100% on that.. I can ask though).

This is the FG wiki if you haven't seen it. https://oberoten.dyndns.org/fgwiki/index.php/Category:Rulesets and it looks like you can download the ars magicka there. Just click the link, then over on the right hand in the box you'll see the download option.

I linked you to the rulesets page. You can find ArsMagica and others there. Oberoten has really been working on that one. He's normally hanging out in the FG chat room at https://fg2.rpg-vault.net/ If you had questions about that ruleset or maybe like a quick run through with it he'd be the man to talk to.

[GunnarGreybeard]

I'd be up for anything Harn although the 3 rulesets you mentioned I am not keen on. With D&D I never developed interest on anything beyond AD&D 1st edition. With C&C, I never really looked at it so I know little about it although I have heard its more like a old school, original D&D rework.

[GomJabbar]

So I have been doing more hunting around for rulesets.

I downloaded the d20_JPG. Haven't tried it yet. How does it differ from the default 3.5e ruleset in FG2.7.4? I hear there are differences but don't know the details.

I have been looking at Savage Worlds. Interesting concept. I will have to add it to the list to consider. It seems to have a much larger following than C&C and would make the DM's (ie. my) job easier.

Gunnar: C&C is very similar to AD&D 1e and 2e. They simply incorporated the 3e/d20 to hit vs. AC concept as opposed to attack matrix tables (1e) and THAC0 (2e). I think the 3e/d20 hit mechanism is much simpler.

[lazarus0280]

as far as the d20_jpg it's basically the same as the 3.5e but just simpler. Drag and drop skill features etc. Easier dice rolling. the mechanics are streamlined. Supposedly it will be replacing the current 3.5 from what i gather.

I'm pretty much down for whatever though so just keep me posted. I have enjoyed playing the Savage Worlds system. Had my first experiences with it this week. Cool concept and execution in my eyes.

[GunnarGreybeard]

Gunnar: C&C is very similar to AD&D 1e and 2e. They simply incorporated the 3e/d20 to hit vs. AC concept as opposed to attack matrix tables (1e) and THAC0 (2e). I think the 3e/d20 hit mechanism is much simpler. Ah, ok. I was running a Harn based campaign using Rolemaster. I opted for Rolemaster, 1, because I am fairly familiar with it and 2, it models the lethality of Harn combat pretty well. Its currently on hold due to RL scheduling issues on my end but I am still hoping to pick it back up. I'm guessing a C&C system would be alot easier to run from a GM perspective and probably less intimidating to players especially those who prefer less detail.

[GomJabbar]

I have been looking at the d20/3.5e E6 system that originated on enworld. It looks very intriguing. And simple.

The developers are putting together a E6 SRD at https://sites.google.com/site/e6baselinesrd/. It is still in the development phase at the moment. They are basically taking the OGL d20 SRD and stripping it for E6. You can also google d20 E6 to find lots of info.

Those unfamiliar with E6... E6 is identical to d20/3.5 except that the PCs stop advancing after level 6. After level 6 they gain a Feat every 5000 XP instead. It creates a more low magic, low fantasy, low wealth style of campaign. Right up Harn's alley.

I think I could simply use the 3.5e or d20_JPG ruleset as is. Alternatively I could trim it down and update to match the E6 SRD to create a homebrew version of d20_JPG.

So many options, so little time...