Does anyone know what program...

[dcook22]

Hi all,

Does anyone know what program the folks at WOTC use to create their maps for the dungeon adventures? And if not, what program makes the best maps? Preferably with a small learning curve.

Thanks,

Dan

[Sigurd]

Best and small learning curve???

I believe WOTC sometimes uses Campaign Cartographer by profantasy for many elements and perhaps map layout. Then the use post processing and other graphics programs to fill out the map and make it look right - probably photoshop.

If you're interested in maps check out the Cartographers Guild. Its a really great website with lots of tutorials and helpful people.

https://www.cartographersguild.com/


Good luck, Sigurd

[Griogre]

They use their map tiles for the RPGA modules these fall in the not fancy but functional catagory. You can see and download these here: https://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dnd/20061121t It is very simple to use this along with all tile based mappers. Just drag and drop.

There is also a Yahoo group with a later version an more tiles, but this will get you started. I use to belong to the group but I don't really use this so I quit and don't remember the name.

If you want something with a little more ump, but without the learning curve of Campaign Catographer then try Dungeon Forge or AutoRealm (they are both free google 'em).

[EugeneZ]

Sigurd: You really think they use CC? Are you guessing or do you have a source? Based on what I've seen, I don't think that's what they use... but you could be right that they're just tricking me with lots of post-processing.

[Zeus]

Sigurd: You really think they use CC? Are you guessing or do you have a source? Based on what I've seen, I don't think that's what they use... but you could be right that they're just tricking me with lots of post-processing.

From reading this thread over at the Cartographers Guild (https://forum.cartographersguild.com/showthread.php?t=891&highlight=mike+schley), D&D Freelance artist and Cartographer Mike Schley confirms he uses 100% photoshop for his maps (KotS, Thunderspire to name just a couple).

[Zeus]

And here's a work in progress view of my attempt at recreating Mike's classic 4e style basic tile maps in Photoshop.

Its a map for a dungeon delve I'm planning for one of my groups.

Its still missing loads of bits but the basic style is there.

[EugeneZ]

Very impressive, Zeph! This could pass as WotC-style easily, I think. I always thought the "glow" of the floor tiles was from Photoshop, not something like CC, which is why I was so sure it was not CC. You nailed that aspect, I think... your next test will be all the little furnishings and such. No idea where they get them; I assume they draw them by hand.

[Spyke]

Even if the WOTC ones aren't, you can certainly do an inner glow with CC3...

Spyke

[Zeus]

Very impressive, Zeph! This could pass as WotC-style easily, I think. I always thought the "glow" of the floor tiles was from Photoshop, not something like CC, which is why I was so sure it was not CC. You nailed that aspect, I think... your next test will be all the little furnishings and such. No idea where they get them; I assume they draw them by hand.

Thanks.

I'm planning to create a library of all the other items like doors, pits, furniture etc. Just waiting to pick up a new graphics tablet as these will need hand inking and I prefer to use a pen rather than a mouse.

Once I have completed all of the work for basic maps I'll make a step-by-step guide and release a basic image kit for anyone who wants to produce their own maps to scale.

Its also not as time consuming as it might sound to produce these as I use layers and masks to quickly re-redraw the earth, walls and colors. Took me about 30 mins to knock this one up. Throw in the remaining bits and pieces and the tile overlays and it should take no more than 1hr or so for a quick map.

Adding affects like rubble, dirt, bloodstains etc will take a bit of extra time due to the processing required. I am also working on a cobbled wall version similar to the style Mike used in KotS but again just waiting for a tablet as the detail is quite fine.

[Sigurd]

RE CC - I am not suggesting that they slavishly build in CC then convert. Different freelancers have used different methods. I remember from conversations on Cart Guild that some of their cities have influences from the CC icon set. Some artists have planned cities in CC and then finished them with photoshop etc...

For the record, their level of production you almost have to use photoshop for some of the work.

On the cheap, you can accomplish a lot with 'The Gimp' as a replacement for Photoshop and 'Inkscape' or 'Paint.net' as a replacement for Illustrator.

Sigurd

[Bidmaron]

Zephp, are you using cc3 for your maps or photoshop?

[Zeus]

Zephp, are you using cc3 for your maps or photoshop?

Photoshop.

[dcook22]

Thanks.

I'm planning to create a library of all the other items like doors, pits, furniture etc. Just waiting to pick up a new graphics tablet as these will need hand inking and I prefer to use a pen rather than a mouse.

Once I have completed all of the work for basic maps I'll make a step-by-step guide and release a basic image kit for anyone who wants to produce their own maps to scale.

Its also not as time consuming as it might sound to produce these as I use layers and masks to quickly re-redraw the earth, walls and colors. Took me about 30 mins to knock this one up. Throw in the remaining bits and pieces and the tile overlays and it should take no more than 1hr or so for a quick map.

Adding affects like rubble, dirt, bloodstains etc will take a bit of extra time due to the processing required. I am also working on a cobbled wall version similar to the style Mike used in KotS but again just waiting for a tablet as the detail is quite fine.

Great stuff, Zeph. Were you pretty handy with Photoshop before you tried maps, or did you learn from a tutorial? If the latter, do you have a link to that tutorial. I'd really like to learn what you're doing.

And what kind of tablet would you get? Have a link to a recommended model?

And I'm looking forward to your tutorial and design elements. As always, in my life, I have more money than time, so if $20 would help you get your stuff dine faster, I'm happy to contribute to a cause. :D

Thanks in advance for your answers.

Dan

[Zeus]

Great stuff, Zeph. Were you pretty handy with Photoshop before you tried maps, or did you learn from a tutorial? If the latter, do you have a link to that tutorial. I'd really like to learn what you're doing.

I am learning Photoshop as I go but have used other graphics packages in the past and am familiar with the general techniques it employs.

I have used a variety of sources to draw inspiration and knowledge from, including books like DC's guide to comic book pencil drawing, inking and coloring. Online resources like the Cartographer's Guild (ton's of tips and guides here) as well as specific artists like Mike Schley (he often frequents Cartographers Guild and generally always assists if asked).


And what kind of tablet would you get? Have a link to a recommended model?

I am looking at a Wacom tablet (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Wacom-Intuos3-Tablet-Pen-Mouse/dp/B00061MJ7U/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1249233255&sr=8-7). I'm after an A4 version although you can pick them up in a vareity of sizes :) and costs :(


And I'm looking forward to your tutorial and design elements. As always, in my life, I have more money than time, so if $20 would help you get your stuff dine faster, I'm happy to contribute to a cause. :D

Thanks in advance for your answers.

Dan

Contributions are always welcome but not necessary, unfortunatley like for you time is always in short supply. I am balancing various D&D projects at the moment as well as a New version of the FGII Campaign Tool Tenian released a while back, not to mention keeping up with WotC and parsing rulebooks and all.

As soon as I can find some time to pick up the tablet and put it to some use I'll release an update as soon as possible. Stay tuned.

[dcook22]

I am balancing various D&D projects at the moment as well as a New version of the FGII Campaign Tool Tenian released a while back, not to mention keeping up with WotC and parsing rulebooks and all.


Where can I find the Campaign tool by Tenian?

Dan

[Zeus]

Theres a copy of Tenian's original version at the Yahoo RPGA FGII group site (https://f1.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/MOJ1Snisy0yMJo9qt1cZaFV11B5AyUfkIXPCI2AteLgUPd7ZPv sFQwo8RotKJLCUwR6_Isu4oRaXXUdUCC85He3GjgZzWyp27cGW dre9tKcn2eZD0edfMg/FG%20II%20Campaign%20Files/Campaign%20Tools%20Pack.zip)

and a beta of version 2 can be downloaded from https://zgp.eugenez.net/FGII%20Campaign%20Tools%20v2%20Beta/

[Zeus]

Still no tablet :(

But I did find some time to update the map with my trusty mouse. This version integrates a layered cobbled wall effect (similar to maps from KotS) as well as my version of Mr Schley's signature woven paper background with gilted edge.

Feedback as always is appreciated.

[dcook22]

Looks fantastic Zeph. I definitely have to get on to the cartography guild and look into some tutorials. Is that where you picked up your starting techniques? I mean, I wouldn't even know where to look for the aged paper texture or how to do the rock wall in Photoshop. I got Photoshop CS4 yesterday so I'm going to start playing around with it.

I look forward to your tutorials, and again, if you can point me to a good tutorial that's already out there I'd greatly appreciate it.

Great work so far.

Dan

[Zeus]

Looks fantastic Zeph. I definitely have to get on to the cartography guild and look into some tutorials. Is that where you picked up your starting techniques? I mean, I wouldn't even know where to look for the aged paper texture or how to do the rock wall in Photoshop. I got Photoshop CS4 yesterday so I'm going to start playing around with it.

I look forward to your tutorials, and again, if you can point me to a good tutorial that's already out there I'd greatly appreciate it.

Great work so far.

Dan

I think the best thing I can do is to recommend you download the podcasts by Butch Curry at Nirvana Games (https://www.zombienirvana.com/?page_id=67) he's produced a truly excellent series of guides for Fantasy Cartography using Photoshop and employs various techniques walking you through the production of a classic overland style map reminiscent of the style used in Tolkein's books. I believe theres a PDF planned too but I only have the podcasts.

In addition the Cartography Guild has some good guides although I can't recall the exact ones I have used. Try the Photoshop guides at https://forum.cartographersguild.com/forumdisplay.php?f=48

Regarding textures, I create my own using scans of old books and other interesting materials. These sit on their own layers so I can interchange them. I also colour on seperate layers so my inks always remain unaffected if I want to recolour elements.

For cobbled walls I sketch paths of stone shapes in the centre of a 300x300pixel image on one layer. I then stroke the path to ink them and then use an Offset filter to shift the image down and to the right and repeat the process until the entire 300x300 square is filled. I then create a base colour layer followed by shading and highlight layers. Once colouring is completed I save the image as a pattern.

On the map I use the pattern on a solid fill layer which fills the entire canvas. I then create a mask using the stone earth layer shape as a guide reduced by 30pixels, this masks the cobbled stones against the earth and floor and reveals only a straight line wall (30 pixels wide) which follows the contour of my stone earth layer. I then go around the inside edge by hand to blend the cobbled wall into stone earth.

Its hard to explain in words alone. I hope it helps though and you find Photoshop and Cartography as fun as I do.

[dcook22]

I think the best thing I can do is to recommend you download the podcasts by Butch Curry at Nirvana Games (https://www.zombienirvana.com/?page_id=67) he's produced a truly excellent series of guides for Fantasy Cartography using Photoshop and employs various techniques walking you through the production of a classic overland style map reminiscent of the style used in Tolkein's books. I believe theres a PDF planned too but I only have the podcasts.

In addition the Cartography Guild has some good guides although I can't recall the exact ones I have used. Try the Photoshop guides at https://forum.cartographersguild.com/forumdisplay.php?f=48

Thanks, I'll check those out.



Regarding textures, I create my own using scans of old books and other interesting materials. These sit on their own layers so I can interchange them. I also colour on seperate layers so my inks always remain unaffected if I want to recolour elements.


Ahhh.. So you've been thinking about this for a while.



For cobbled walls I sketch paths of stone shapes in the centre of a 300x300pixel image on one layer. I then stroke the path to ink them and then use an Offset filter to shift the image down and... SNIP ...stone earth.

Its hard to explain in words alone. I hope it helps though and you find Photoshop and Cartography as fun as I do.

Gulp...sounds more complicated than I thought. But, I guess if it were easy, everyone would do it. Thanks for explaining and pointing me in the right direction. I appreciate your help.

Dan

[Foen]

These are great maps and top advice too. If you get the tutorial done, I'm sure Smite Works would be happy to put them in this site (like Xorne's tutorials).

Keep up the great work!

Stuart

[Foen]

Still no tablet :(

But I did find some time to update the map with my trusty mouse. This version integrates a layered cobbled wall effect (similar to maps from KotS) as well as my version of Mr Schley's signature woven paper background with gilted edge.

Feedback as always is appreciated.

Hi Zephp, what font are you using for the map title? It looks pretty much the same as the WotC font.

Stuart

[Tenian]

He has a talent for extracting fonts from WOTC pdfs :) It's probably either Vecna or Loth. The other font WOTC likes to use is Mentor.

[Zeus]

Hi Zephp, what font are you using for the map title? It looks pretty much the same as the WotC font.

Stuart

Tenian is indeed correct. The font is called DnDLolthSC and can be found in most of the DDI Dragon PDFs along with the other propreitry WotC fonts like DnDAttack and DnDVecnaSC. The Mentor family font set is also used, Mentor is a commerically available font.