Interesting Article On Gary Gygax And Dave Arneson On Ares Technica

[LordEntrails]

Because we are gamers and like to ague about minutia.

No we don't. We only argue about earth shattering, world changing, end of civilization, scientifically provable alternative facts. You know, like why is the sky blue?

[Nylanfs]

No, the sky is azure!

[Nickademus]

Actually, the sky isn't any color. What you see is actually light refracting through chemicals heavy in the air. The sky can appear blue, green, even orange as the density of these chemicals change. *pointincase*

[dulux-oz]

Actually, its "light refracting through chemicals, dust and other small particles" - but point taken!

[Spin-Man]

I do not know why this is even a discussion. Looking at my OD&D books, Gygax is never listed alone and Arneson is listed alone once for Blackmoor.

Please do not confuse D&D with TSR.

My introduction to D&D was in 2nd Edition. When I went back to what I thought was the beginning, all those AD&D books had Gygax's name alone on the cover, so I thought for years that he was the sole creator. Pop culture hasn't really helped in that regard, either. Gygax has appeared in shows like Futurama, but I had never heard of Arneson until less than 10 years ago. No one knows his name unless they are into roleplaying games, but Gygax is a household name throughout all of nerd culture. Sort of like how everyone who can name a superhero knows Stan Lee, but only comic fans know how Jack Kirby and Steve Ditko contributed to the creation of Spider-Man.

As for the article in the OP, I ordered the graphic novel and I enjoyed it. I recommend it: the art and narrative style are good, and I learned some things from it, too. For example, I had no idea that H. G. Wells wrote a miniatures war game.

[Myrdin Potter]

I started with OD&D, but I really started on my own with the Basic boxed set (the first one) and then quickly moved to AD&D. These discussions get confusing because there are a few flavors of "D&D" and what exactly you are referring to can confuse the issue.

D&D started as the fantasy supplement to Chainmail which was a miniatures game for medieval combat. The front cover of the 3rd edition says "by Gary Gygax and Jeff Perrin". As an interesting aside, the "fantasy" section starts at page 28 of the rules and specifically mentions Tolkien with hobbits, Ents and Balrog listed as monsters. TSR was sued over the use of these names and later there was a claim that Tolkien was not the main influence on D&D, but it is obvious he was. So the very fist book - no truth to the claims of Gygax claiming sole credit.

The came Dungeons and Dragons, published as three booklets. All three books (incomplete rules, assumed you had Chainmail - combat rules - and even an Avalon Hill game called "Outdoor Survival") list "Gygax and Arneson". There were 4 supplements published as booklets to expand the rules. Gygax is only on the cover for 2 of 4 and not alone each time (once Bloom and once Kuntz). Arenson is listed alone for Blackmoor. Gygax is listed alone on anothjer rules book - "swords and spells" which is miniatures rules for D&D (full circle back to Chainmail there ...).

Then there was sort of a split. AD&D and a newer version of D&D. D&D was first the Holmes blue book (in a boxed set, my very first D&D purchase). That says Gygax and Arneson edited by Holmes. Later these were done again as Basic D&D with rules starting with levels 1-5 and then a new book for higher and higher levels. I never played that system as I went over to AD&D and I do not have those books, so not sure who is credited there.

For AD&D, it says only Gygax on the cover. He released the Monster Manual first, and the preface to that book thanks a bunch of people who contributed, Arneson is not mentioned. The Players handbook and DM's Guide is the same. Arneson is listed in the PHB as someone (one of quite a few) that contributed to the original game. In the PHB, Gygax made it clear that he wrote the AD&D rules, that he had help, but he basically claimed the "head judge" role which is a direct callback to the origins as a miniatures game.

I do not want to step through all the other editions, but I am pretty sure that Gygax does not claim to be the one and only for 2e and once you get to Third edition he was gone from TSR and other people are listed on the cover. 5e clearly gives credit to Gygax and Arneson for creating the original game.

I find no factual support for the foolish hobgoblin that Gygax claimed sole credit for the game. The creation of TSR and who owned it and profited is a different story and it went to who had money to actually publish everything and who therefore assumed control as the game grew in popularity. That was Gygax. Gygax was certainly the face of the game and I met him at a Gencon in the early 80's (I think I first played in 1980 or 1981 in high school) and Arneson was just a credit on book covers by that point.

[Spin-Man]

You know the history better than me, but this is all very 'inside baseball.' My point was that the outside world and casual fans are often presented with a simplified history that boils down to "Gary Gygax made D&D" regardless of whether he personally made such a claim, and that's why these discussions keep popping up.

[celestian]

My point was that the outside world and casual fans are often presented with a simplified history that boils down to "Gary Gygax made D&D" regardless of whether he personally made such a claim, and that's why these discussions keep popping up.

He did make D&D. If it had not been for him TSR wouldn't have existed and D&D wouldn't have been produced as it is today. There are certainly many cogs in the machine but that's a pretty big gear.

Maybe Arneson would have made a version of it? I find that unlikely tho. Based on history and the people that knew him said he had a hard time organizing his thoughts (see his published products?).

Personally I think folks like Frank Mentzer and Tim Kask probably had more to do with the popularity of D&D than Arneson at the end of the day.

[Nickademus]

no truth to the claims of Gygax claiming sole credit.

For the record, Gygax NEVER claimed to invent D&D or be, as many call him, the 'Father of D&D'. He simply doesn't correct anyone who thinks this, at least not loudly. The few rare places I've seen him talk about it he openly tells the sorry of how the RPG idea was Arnesan's and how multiple people contributed. Don't let my posts (or anyone else's) lead you to believe that Gygax actively tried to grab credit for anything other than the company TSR (and I think the creation of GenCON).